An Annoying habit of Portis....

[desertfox59]

Look I love Portis...he's awsome but the guy is a pro running back and he doesn't put the football in the proper hand when he is running. The other day on his touchdown run he was running left but carrying the ball with his right arm, his inside arm...! NO! NO! NO! put that ball in the outside arm..keep it away from the defense...that is just basics....jeez..

GO Skins!

[PotomacSkinsFan]

yeah, but emmitt smith never carried the ball in his right hand, and corey dillon carries it in the left every time as well.

also, riggo (and other older backs ie walter payton) used to carry the ball in the palm of their hand sometimes.

[altair4]

I'd like some water, please...:)

[bubba9497]

geez got anything else to complain about.


He hasn't fumbled except twice (in only one game) all this year... it works for him. relax

[desertfox59]

yeah, but emmitt smith never carried the ball in his right hand, and corey dillon carries it in the left every time as well.

also, riggo (and other older backs ie walter payton) used to carry the ball in the palm of their hand sometimes.

Corry dillon = overrated
Emmit Smith = Massively overrated

WALTER PAYTON = The greatest running back of all time so I'll only reply to this example. Yes Payton used to carry the ball in his palm however, Payton only did that in the open field and he only did that with the correct arm and further more whenever anyone came near him he would either tuck it away or he was out of bounds so it didn't matter

[w33dh0l3]

Corry dillon = overrated
Emmit Smith = Massively overrated

WALTER PAYTON = The greatest running back of all time so I'll only reply to this example. Yes Payton used to carry the ball in his palm however, Payton only did that in the open field and he only did that with the correct arm and further more whenever anyone came near him he would either tuck it away or he was out of bounds so it didn't matter


i'm really not sure how you can call emmitt smith massively overrated, even under homerish circumstances.

[desertfox59]

i'm really not sure how you can call emmitt smith massively overrated, even under homerish circumstances.

Well let me explain it to you....

People, many people call Emmit Smith the best running back of all time...since I can think of at least three off the top of my head who were better (Walter Payton, Barry Sanders, Jim Brown) I would call that massivally overrated...I never said he wasn't good, in fact he is one of the better backs to play this game. But if you think you can compare ES to WP in any area but total career yardage....then you sir are a MORON.

[ncsuapex]

I hate that annoying habit Portis has of rushing for over 1300 yards a year for this first 4 years..

:rolleyes:

[PotomacSkinsFan]

Corry dillon = overrated
Emmit Smith = Massively overrated

WALTER PAYTON = The greatest running back of all time so I'll only reply to this example. Yes Payton used to carry the ball in his palm however, Payton only did that in the open field and he only did that with the correct arm and further more whenever anyone came near him he would either tuck it away or he was out of bounds so it didn't matter

yeah, but emmitt didnt fumble. In 18,355 carries, he only fumbled 38 times (he only lost 22 of them). whether or not he's overrated is irrelevent, because he always carried the ball in one hand and he fumbled the ball less than 1% of the time.

[desertfox59]

I hate that annoying habit Portis has of rushing for over 1300 yards a year for this first 4 years..

:rolleyes:

That's one habit that I totally love :)

[desertfox59]

yeah, but emmitt didnt fumble. In 18,355 carries, he only fumbled 38 times (he only lost 22 of them). whether or not he's overrated is irrelevent, because he always carried the ball in one hand and he fumbled the ball less than 1% of the time.

What percentage has Portis fumbled ? until he carries the football 18,000 times with a less than 1% fumble rate.....I'd tell him to put the football in the right arm.

[PotomacSkinsFan]

What percentage has Portis fumbled ? until he carries the football 18,000 times with a less than 1% fumble rate.....I'd tell him to put the football in the right arm.

i just checked the stats and in 5,818 carries clinton portis has lost 10 of 16 fumbles which is ALSO less than 1% of the time.
:eaglesuck

[desertfox59]

yeah, but emmitt didnt fumble. In 18,355 carries, he only fumbled 38 times (he only lost 22 of them). whether or not he's overrated is irrelevent, because he always carried the ball in one hand and he fumbled the ball less than 1% of the time.

He had 18,355 Carries? :yikes:

What was his average yards/carry ? according to you even if he had a 2y/carry average he would have well over 35,000 yards in his career :laugh::laugh::laugh::laugh::laugh:

If that were the case I'd take back my analysis of him as massivally overrated even if he still was a poor pass blocker, didn't have very good hands and played with one of the best o lines in football history.

[desertfox59]

i just checked the stats and in 5,818 carries clinton portis has lost 10 of 16 fumbles which is ALSO less than 1% of the time.
:eaglesuck


There is no way portis has carried the ball 5,818 times.....are we counting his peewee football league team too....and his highschool team, and college? think people....! think!... what is Portis's average per carry? if it's anything higher than 2 than that means Portis must have at leaste 11,000 yards in 4 years of football....:laugh::laugh::laugh::laugh::laugh::do h::doh::doh::doh::doh:

[PotomacSkinsFan]

hahaha, crap, fox, i mixed up my numbers (i typed in yards instead of carries). that was bad. But they are both under 1% in terms of fumbles

Portis: 1,231 carries and 10 lost fumbles is .8% fumbles
Smith: 4,409 carries and 22 lost fumbles is .4% fumbles

:eaglesuck

[desertfox59]

hahaha, crap, fox, i mixed up my numbers (i typed in yards instead of carries). that was bad. But they are both under 1% in terms of fumbles

Portis: 1,231 carries and 10 lost fumbles is .8% fumbles
Smith: 4,409 carries and 22 lost fumbles is .4% fumbles

:eaglesuck

O.K. fair enough....at least you can admit u were wrong, unlike some DALLAS Trolls....or some Giants Trolls both of whom don't even have the balls to show back up here and admit they are ass licking hind-tit-suckin crybabies.:):):):)

back to my point ....When Portis has carried the ball 4,000 times and still is under 1% I'll say o.k. forget the fundementals...do it your way....it's working.....Until that time Put the Ball in the correct arm!

[PotomacSkinsFan]

portis still fumbles less than 1 percent of the time. so i wasn't wrong. I was actually correct. And other guys (Smith and Dillon) who always carried the ball in one hand also have fumbled less than 1 percent of the time, so i think Portis should keep on doing what he's doing. he's only lost two fumbles this year, and they were both in the Oakland game.

Only one player in NFL history has ever carried the ball 4000 or more times, and it's only "ok" if portis keeps this up after 4000 carries!? Please.

Portis holds on to the ball pretty damn well. Keep it up, Clinton

[dcsmooth]

i'm really not sure how you can call emmitt smith massively overrated, even under homerish circumstances.

http://www.jerseygop.com/R_babes/elisabeth-hasselbeck4.jpg http://www.jerseygop.com/R_babes/elisabeth-hasselbeck3.jpg http://www.jerseygop.com/R_babes/elisabeth-hasselbeck5.jpg

Wow, I'm more impress with these pictures of this girl!!!
:cheers:

[ncsuapex]

^ That's hasselbacks wife.

[wahoos911]

ok, fox, just admit that you were wrong and were proven wrong with facts, which you dont have

[Blondie]

Look I love Portis...he's awsome but the guy is a pro running back and he doesn't put the football in the proper hand when he is running. The other day on his touchdown run he was running left but carrying the ball with his right arm, his inside arm...! NO! NO! NO! put that ball in the outside arm..keep it away from the defense...that is just basics....jeez..

GO Skins!


:laugh: :laugh: :laugh: :laugh: :laugh:

We are on the verge of making the playoffs. He has been a very big part in getting us there.

He can carry the ball between his teeth if he wants!!

:laugh:

Blondie

[canesluver]

Seeing that nobody was going to touch him, why risk changing hands?

[GSF]

Look I love Portis...he's awsome but the guy is a pro running back and he doesn't put the football in the proper hand when he is running. The other day on his touchdown run he was running left but carrying the ball with his right arm, his inside arm...! NO! NO! NO! put that ball in the outside arm..keep it away from the defense...that is just basics....jeez..

GO Skins!

Portis is one of the more surehanded backs in the league. There have been runs when I've thought, switch hands Clinton, but that wasn't one of them. He knew he had to run fast to outrun the defenders, and switching hands might have slowed him down.

[desertfox59]

I guess some of you just don't understand how to play football...

It is a basic fundamental. when a running back first is handed the football he recieves it with both arms. the interrior arm (the one on the side of the Quaterback) goes up to supply the QB a pocket in which to put the football, while the exterior arm (the one on the opposite side of the QB) is down. in the initial running back pocket the points of the ball (the most vunerable parts ) are protected by both the hands and the elbows on each side until in the open field when the back can (for speed purposes) shift the ball to one arm, the outside arm....the arm closest to the sidelines to protect the ball from the inside out tackling angles of the defense!

It amazes me how many of you want to argue with one of the basics of the game. there are almost no situations where this proper handling of the football should not be done.

Maybe its because so many of you are blinded by your love for this team that you just can't hear anything that criticizes any aspect of this team. you think that you are defending my Redskins. But by your soft bigtory of low expectations you are really doing my skins a disservice.

I want Clinton Portis to put the ball in the proper arm because I believe he can be one of the best to ever play this game! I want to see him do this properly because I believe in the fundamentals and I think that in order to be one of the best you have to do all the little things correctly. Yes to some of you this may seem like a little thing but I have high expectations for players with high skills like Portis. oh and by the way YOU SHOULD TOO!

For those of you who don't see this logic and want to throw stats out there to try to disprove the simple basics of the game of football. I guess the grass will always be blue and the sky will always be green... A great man once said, "there are lies...there are damn lies...and then there are statistics."

For those of you who believe that the grass is green...I welcome your points about this post, for there are many to make. and look foward to our conversations. Morons need not apply. ;)

[Blondie]

I guess some of you just don't understand how to play football...

It is a basic fundamental. when a running back first is handed the football he recieves it with both arms. the interrior arm (the one on the side of the Quaterback) goes up to supply the QB a pocket in which to put the football, while the exterior arm (the one on the opposite side of the QB) is down. in the initial running back pocket the points of the ball (the most vunerable parts ) are protected by both the hands and the elbows on each side until in the open field when the back can (for speed purposes) shift the ball to one arm, the outside arm....the arm closest to the sidelines to protect the ball from the inside out tackling angles of the defense!

It amazes me how many of you want to argue with one of the basics of the game. there are almost no situations where this proper handling of the football should not be done.

Maybe its because so many of you are blinded by your love for this team that you just can't hear anything that criticizes any aspect of this team. you think that you are defending my Redskins. But by your soft bigtory of low expectations you are really doing my skins a disservice.

I want Clinton Portis to put the ball in the proper arm because I believe he can be one of the best to ever play this game! I want to see him do this properly because I believe in the fundamentals and I think that in order to be one of the best you have to do all the little things correctly. Yes to some of you this may seem like a little thing but I have high expectations for players with high skills like Portis. oh and by the way YOU SHOULD TOO!

For those of you who don't see this logic and want to throw stats out there to try to disprove the simple basics of the game of football. I guess the grass will always be blue and the sky will always be green... A great man once said, "there are lies...there are damn lies...and then there are statistics."

For those of you who believe that the grass is green...I welcome your points about this post, for there are many to make. and look foward to our conversations. Morons need not apply. ;)


I think most people KNOW how to play football. You are not special in that category. I am well aware a player keeps the ball in the hand away from the defender.

MY point was if Joe Gibbs is not sitting CP's butt on the bench for the way he carries the ball, then who are you or who am I or who are we to tell him how to do it.

Blondie

[chrisc0015]

Portis really needs to learn how to play football... /sarcasm

[Khun Kao]

I was watching old tapes of Riggo play, and he is often carrying the ball like a QB does when he's looking to throw it down field

[desertfox59]

I think most people KNOW how to play football. You are not special in that category. I am well aware a player keeps the ball in the hand away from the defender.

MY point was if Joe Gibbs is not sitting CP's butt on the bench for the way he carries the ball, then who are you or who am I or who are we to tell him how to do it.

Blondie

I never said to sit portis.....ever.....! I mearly commented on something that he should do to make himself better! The very first line of my post was "I love Clinton Portis." But that doesn't mean I am going to give him a pass for doing things dangerously.

Oh and who am I? I am someone who understands the fundamentals of the Running back position.....Did you read the post you Quoted?:)

[allan1058]

yea i really hate that annoying habit of winning all these football games. Think before you speak (or type) please.

[Monk4theHall81]

Look I love Portis...he's awsome but the guy is a pro running back and he doesn't put the football in the proper hand when he is running. The other day on his touchdown run he was running left but carrying the ball with his right arm, his inside arm...! NO! NO! NO! put that ball in the outside arm..keep it away from the defense...that is just basics....jeez..

GO Skins!

:doh:

Skins have won 4 straight, Portis has rushed for over 100 each game, Portis is 29 yards from setting the all-time record for yards in a year for a Skin...

Why oh why do we have to have such negative fans on this site???

[The Showstopper]

Look I love Portis...he's awsome but the guy is a pro running back and he doesn't put the football in the proper hand when he is running. The other day on his touchdown run he was running left but carrying the ball with his right arm, his inside arm...! NO! NO! NO! put that ball in the outside arm..keep it away from the defense...that is just basics....jeez..

GO Skins!


are you friggin kidding me????? lets complain about the way a guy is carrying the football, even tho he is about to break our franchises sinngle season record....i mean come on, lets toss you back there and watch you rack up a few yards but show us the proper way to carry it

[Hogskin1]

When Portis has carried the ball 4,000 times and still is under 1% I'll say o.k. forget the fundementals...do it your way....it's working.....Until that time Put the Ball in the correct arm!
Yeah, BOY!!!! That Portis is a REAL LOSER. Because some day he MIGHT get over 1% fumbles, because an expert Redskin fan says he isn't carrying the ball right.

Well actually, that isn't the ONLY reason he is a loser. He has proven to be a wimp. He is a natural cutback runner. So after a year under Gibbs, he realizes Gibbs does not want him to be used that way, so what does he do??? He bulks up, never complains, and gives his all for the team. LOSER. Why can't he be more like T.O.

Some posts on here are WAY out there... :doh:

[CowboyinDC]

He is right, a back should always switch the ball to the other hand. Either for stiff arm purposes or to protect the ball.

That being said I believe its a bad idea to change running style at this point of his career. Historically running backs struggle when they switch the way they carry the ball.

Julius Jones ran the ball with two hands for the most part of this season when hitting the line of scrimage. Last game he reverted back to his 04 style where he secured it with one hand. It looked like he just had more balance and more explosiveness.

Tiki also had a bit of trouble when he adjusted his carrying style and he had the entire offseason to work on it.

Unless a back exhibits a consistent tendancy to fumble the ball leave it as is, he'll end losing more balls in the act of switching hands. Maybe its something to work on in the offseason but dont mess with something that works.

[Zguy28]

Are any of ya'll playing halfback for a pro team right now or coaching in the pros?


I didn't think so.

[Blondie]

I never said to sit portis.....ever.....! I mearly commented on something that he should do to make himself better! The very first line of my post was "I love Clinton Portis." But that doesn't mean I am going to give him a pass for doing things dangerously.

Oh and who am I? I am someone who understands the fundamentals of the Running back position.....Did you read the post you Quoted?:)

Yes dear, I did read it.

And whether you "give him a pass" is......well.....really not yours to give.

And, may I say again....I am well aware of the game of football......and the running back position in particular.

Just a question. Have you played that position? Beyond high school?

Oh, and did you read my post? I didn't specifically ask who you were. That was what is called a rhetorical question.

Blondie

[Ant15fromNJ]

I noticed that too but if it's not broken dont fix it.

[#1SkinsFan]

:doh:

Skins have won 4 straight, Portis has rushed for over 100 each game, Portis is 29 yards from setting the all-time record for yards in a year for a Skin...

Why oh why do we have to have such negative fans on this site???

lol agreed completely!

[TomE]

Well....yes... it is proper "form" to carry the ball on the "correct" side.. away from the defender..... point taken.

If Portis is carrying "wrong side"... has the ball popped-out and loses a fumble, then by all means, return here and proclaim.... "nya, nya.... I told you so"

Portis appears to be "in a groove" now, so for now I'll depend on his abilities as a professional NFL running back to get the job done as he and his coaches see fit.

[Dccat]

Corry dillon = overrated
Emmit Smith = Massively overrated

WALTER PAYTON = The greatest running back of all time so I'll only reply to this example. Yes Payton used to carry the ball in his palm however, Payton only did that in the open field and he only did that with the correct arm and further more whenever anyone came near him he would either tuck it away or he was out of bounds so it didn't matter


I agree. Sweetness was the best.

[Dccat]

Well let me explain it to you....

People, many people call Emmit Smith the best running back of all time...since I can think of at least three off the top of my head who were better (Walter Payton, Barry Sanders, Jim Brown) I would call that massivally overrated...I never said he wasn't good, in fact he is one of the better backs to play this game. But if you think you can compare ES to WP in any area but total career yardage....then you sir are a MORON.

Yep right again. Had Walter had Emmitts line he would have had 25k yds.

[THEBIGGUY56]

Why all the fuss? I have an easy fix, Mr. Fox man the next time you have your ball handling seminar just call up CP, I'm sure he will soak up all of your knowledge, especially with your proven history in the league! :doh:

[Neophyte]

Dude,

One phrase for you..."if it ain't broke, don't fix it." Portis is doing fine at protecting the ball and he is #6 in the league in rushing. If he were putting the ball on the ground then you might have a point but he is not so you do not.

[LiveStrongSkins]

This is a myth. I thought the same thing until I went to penn state football camp. At big schools like that they tell you never to switch hands with the ball. That was part of Tiki Barbers problem. Now he keeps it higher and more upright. His fumbling problem is no more.

[desertfox59]

This is a myth. I thought the same thing until I went to penn state football camp. At big schools like that they tell you never to switch hands with the ball. That was part of Tiki Barbers problem. Now he keeps it higher and more upright. His fumbling problem is no more.

:rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes: :rolleyes::rolleyes:

Never sir, Never did I say to switch hands. I said to put it into the proper arm. in this case the left arm. he was running left of the center that means the defense would be comming right to left. When first decided to take one of his arms off the ball it should have been his right.

I guarantee you that at big schools, small schools, medium sized schools across the country that they tell you to put the ball away from the defense once you remove your other arm from the ball after the hand off. this is no myth

the only myth here is that you know what you are talking about. :silly:

[jpark]

:rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes: :rolleyes::rolleyes:

Never sir, Never did I say to switch hands. I said to put it into the proper arm. in this case the left arm. he was running left of the center that means the defense would be comming right to left. When first decided to take one of his arms off the ball it should have been his right.

I guarantee you that at big schools, small schools, medium sized schools across the country that they tell you to put the ball away from the defense once you remove your other arm from the ball after the hand off. this is no myth

the only myth here is that you know what you are talking about. :silly:

Feel free to consider the fact that Clinton Portis is a professional running back and Ernest Byner, his position coach, had a very successful career doing the same thing. I think its safe to assume that both of them are well versed in the fundamentals of the game, including the one fundamental you are currently pointing out.

What I'm trying to say here is that they are well aware of the fundamental, so clearly they have chosen not to obide by it and chosen so for a reason. I would suspect that Portis feels more comfortable with what he is doing and Byner is cool with it as long as Portis isnt fumbling as a result of it.

For now, I'd say Portis deserves the benefit of the doubt. He has no fumbling issues. Lets not start looking for problems where they don't exist. It isnt that rare for professional athletes to do unconventional things because it is within their comfort zone.

[Washskins81]

oh dear God, if Portis fumbles, we will never hear the end of it from this guy.......we all know that you put the ball in the proper arm, everyone knows that........but the dude has racked up almost 6,000 yards in 4 seasons.......I don't believe, if you want to prioritize concerns in the redskins game, that this is even something to talk about.......STOP WORRYING!!!





HAIL TO THE





FRIGGIN





REDSKINS!!!!

[desertfox59]

Yes dear, I did read it.

And whether you "give him a pass" is......well.....really not yours to give.

And, may I say again....I am well aware of the game of football......and the running back position in particular.

Just a question. Have you played that position? Beyond high school?

Oh, and did you read my post? I didn't specifically ask who you were. That was what is called a rhetorical question.

Blondie

:rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes:

Look Blondie,

In regards to the "pass", I think it is your duty and mine as fans of our beloved skins to point out possible flaws and dangers. We should ask for perfection from our players as they should ask it of themselves. Is it not more dangerous for the ball to be on the defensive side of your body when you are running instead of the sideline side? Since you are "well aware...of the running back position in particular." you should know this.

oh and speaking of your knowledge...I just have one question for you...
Did you ever play the position past highschool? this is not a rhetorical question....you can go ahead and answer it.

Portis is one of the best backs in the leaque...that doesn't mean he doesn't have flaws. I think he is a young man who could listen to these things and learn from them, but you want to treat him like a little baby who can't listen to any advice no matter how logical or sound because it might hurt his delicate senseabilities. That is the soft bigotry of low expectations that I was talking about. You go on treating him like a baby....I'll treat him like a man.

Portis, man to man... your doing a fantistic job. You 're running hard. You're blocking well. Put the ball in the sideline arm, And Keep going.

oh and yes and yes.

:eaglesuck

[desertfox59]

Feel free to consider the fact that Clinton Portis is a professional running back and Ernest Byner, his position coach, had a very successful career doing the same thing. I think its safe to assume that both of them are well versed in the fundamentals of the game, including the one fundamental you are currently pointing out.

What I'm trying to say here is that they are well aware of the fundamental, so clearly they have chosen not to obide by it and chosen so for a reason. I would suspect that Portis feels more comfortable with what he is doing and Byner is cool with it as long as Portis isnt fumbling as a result of it.

For now, I'd say Portis deserves the benefit of the doubt. He has no fumbling issues. Lets not start looking for problems where they don't exist. It isnt that rare for professional athletes to do unconventional things because it is within their comfort zone.

:applause:

This is the most sensible reply so far. you may be right. I don't think portis has fumbling issues. I'm not trying to be hard on him....I think he's awsome. You are right there might be a perfectly legit reason for this, injury to left hand, or weaker left arm, or even comfort zone, ect.

but I would caution you against thinking that because these people are pro's that they dont make mistakes or miss little things.

It is amazing to me that people can second guess play calling and critique coaching and QB decisions but when it comes to the basics of the game we must bow to the wisdom of those same coaches. If anything we should question those fundementals and give them a pass on the higher more intricate aspects of the game like play calling and QB decisions.

I think that Pros sometimes forget these little things because they have so much to think about and do. Is it so bad that a lowely little skins fan who loves this team is posting about the little things that might help them or get them focused on the fundementals again?

I think Byner was a great back, but correct me if i'm wrong didn't he fumble more than 1% of the time? Not sure of this but it might possibly show his vunerablity as a coach. all in all good post Jpark.

[G-Prime]

Look I love Portis...he's awsome but the guy is a pro running back and he doesn't put the football in the proper hand when he is running. The other day on his touchdown run he was running left but carrying the ball with his right arm, his inside arm...! NO! NO! NO! put that ball in the outside arm..keep it away from the defense...that is just basics....jeez..

GO Skins!

Portis doesn't do this all the time and there is actually a reason why he did it.. Might not be a good reason but anyway.. He was thinking about the endzone before he rounded the corner. He keeps it in his right hand incase he has to go out of bounds near the goal line, the ball will still break the plane of the endzone. If it's in his left arm, it goes out of bounds at the 1 inch line =(.

I agree with you, having been a running back myself that sort of thing is first day stuff. I'm sure he knows that.

[Blondie]

:rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes:

Look Blondie,

In regards to the "pass", I think it is your duty and mine as fans of our beloved skins to point out possible flaws and dangers. We should ask for perfection from our players as they should ask it of themselves. Is it not more dangerous for the ball to be on the defensive side of your body when you are running instead of the sideline side? Since you are "well aware...of the running back position in particular." you should know this.

oh and speaking of your knowledge...I just have one question for you...
Did you ever play the position past highschool? this is not a rhetorical question....you can go ahead and answer it.

Portis is one of the best backs in the leaque...that doesn't mean he doesn't have flaws. I think he is a young man who could listen to these things and learn from them, but you want to treat him like a little baby who can't listen to any advice no matter how logical or sound because it might hurt his delicate senseabilities. That is the soft bigotry of low expectations that I was talking about. You go on treating him like a baby....I'll treat him like a man.

Portis, man to man... your doing a fantistic job. You 're running hard. You're blocking well. Put the ball in the sideline arm, And Keep going.

oh and yes and yes.

:eaglesuck

:laugh: :laugh:

I love it when I get a response that begins with "Look Blondie" :laugh: :laugh:

No, I didn't play a running back. I did sleep in a Holiday Inn Express however! Does that count?

I treat him like a baby? Where did that come from? :laugh: :laugh:

I just happened to read some of this to someone kinda close to the situation. I don't think they were worried Portis carrying the ball.

I don't think I will either.

Thanks for the debate however!! I really enjoyed it! Maybe we can do it again sometime.


Blondie

[IrepDC]

Look I love Portis...he's awsome but the guy is a pro running back and he doesn't put the football in the proper hand when he is running. The other day on his touchdown run he was running left but carrying the ball with his right arm, his inside arm...! NO! NO! NO! put that ball in the outside arm..keep it away from the defense...that is just basics....jeez..

GO Skins!

I like this guy. Kinda reminds me of one of my old coaches. Even though we won we should always be looking for ways to improve. Hope one of our coaches notices and works with CP. Fundamentals.....



Zip-it-up and Zip-it-OUT!

[Park City Skins]

Right. Guys who have been involved in the game all this time, for that many years, who started out with the fundamentals, need help from us. Now that's arrogan presumption.

[EnFoRcEr_uPu]

yeah, but emmitt smith never carried the ball in his right hand, and corey dillon carries it in the left every time as well.

also, riggo (and other older backs ie walter payton) used to carry the ball in the palm of their hand sometimes.

Took the words right out of my mouth.

[aejm1400]

Anyone ever see Portis hold the ball in his left hand in his career? Maybe being right handed when he would carry the ball in his left(running left of course) he found that he fumbled too much since it was his weaker arm(practice doesn't make perfect, it makes better but not always good). Thus, he went againest the grain and decided to carry the ball in his right hand at all times to avoid this and achieve the fundemental of not turning the ball over(on a regular basis).

That, and he wants to make sure he's able to throw a TD when needed.

[cooper02145]

Well let me explain it to you....

People, many people call Emmit Smith the best running back of all time...since I can think of at least three off the top of my head who were better (Walter Payton, Barry Sanders, Jim Brown) I would call that massivally overrated...I never said he wasn't good, in fact he is one of the better backs to play this game. But if you think you can compare ES to WP in any area but total career yardage....then you sir are a MORON.



Did you see a lot of Jim Brown playing???? As long as he doesn't put it on the ground and puts it in the end zone I don't care if he dribbles it there!!!

[OldTownFan]

Look I love Portis...he's awsome but the guy is a pro running back and he doesn't put the football in the proper hand when he is running. The other day on his touchdown run he was running left but carrying the ball with his right arm, his inside arm...! NO! NO! NO! put that ball in the outside arm..keep it away from the defense...that is just basics....jeez..

GO Skins!


The man is going to set a Redskins' rushing mark that has him above John Riggons and Stephen Davis, and was rookie of the year, has yet to rush for less than 1,300 yards in a season, do you really think what you have to say is relevant when you look at the facts?

I mean don't take this personal, but it's bothersome when fans have the nerve to criticize players who are litterally breaking records like Clinton Portis is doing, do you think he'd be where he is today if his 'flaw' was really a flaw? Of course not.

[THEBIGGUY56]

Also, in case you forgot last year the coaches were speaking in amazement at how clinton actually carries the ball through the line with two hands on the ball and still is so explosive.

[chrisbcbu]

:laugh: :laugh:

I love it when I get a response that begins with "Look Blondie" :laugh: :laugh:

No, I didn't play a running back. I did sleep in a Holiday Inn Express however! Does that count?

I treat him like a baby? Where did that come from? :laugh: :laugh:

I just happened to read some of this to someone kinda close to the situation. I don't think they were worried Portis carrying the ball.

I don't think I will either.

Thanks for the debate however!! I really enjoyed it! Maybe we can do it again sometime.


Blondie

Im sorry but you cant ask Rock for help. ;)

[MisterPinstripe]

Portis doesn't do this all the time and there is actually a reason why he did it.. Might not be a good reason but anyway.. He was thinking about the endzone before he rounded the corner. He keeps it in his right hand incase he has to go out of bounds near the goal line, the ball will still break the plane of the endzone. If it's in his left arm, it goes out of bounds at the 1 inch line =(.

I agree with you, having been a running back myself that sort of thing is first day stuff. I'm sure he knows that.

Actually that would not be a reason for it. The goal line is infinite as long as there is a body part over the pylon. he could stretch the ball out of bounds as he dove sideways and as long as a foot went over the pylon its a touchdown. Vick did that in one of these recent games. Held the ball out of bounds as he dove, but threw a hand over the pylon for a touchdown.

On the other hand I do not see a problem with him holding it in the left arm. Yes I agree you would think it would be better to hold it away from the defense but there must be a reason. If none of his coaches have made him change it from highschool through college and into the NFL then perhaps there is a very good reason for it and we should just let it go...

[budski]

geez got anything else to complain about.


He hasn't fumbled except twice (in only one game) all this year... it works for him. relax


Actually I do Portis gets to much air under the ball on those long passes.
That pass to Cooley look more like a punt, and he didnt plant both feet
either.

[[[ghost]]]

yea! and i hate how portis isn't even 6'0 tall! wtf? he better grow up, or we'll cut him.











anything else to complain about?

[canesluver]

Actually I do Portis gets to much air under the ball on those long passes.
That pass to Cooley look more like a punt, and he didnt plant both feet
either.
:laugh: :laugh: Actually, I was impressed with the touch. It couldn't have been thrown much better.

[FightForOldDC21]

hes doing fine but when he fumbles... then i dunno lol

[skinsfan51]

The annoying habit that Portis (and Moss) have is when you ask them a question they always answer, "I mean..." For example, Question: "Clinton, do you anticipate the Giants stacking the box this weekend to stop you?" Clinton: "I mean, that's what teams do..." Question: "Clinton, "Do you think Ray Brown can do his job at 43 years old?" Clinton, "I mean, yeah, I think he can do..."

I know it's picky, but I like to hear guys talk right. Clinton, no one asked what you mean. They asked for an answer. Just answer. Santana does the same thing. It must be a nervous thing.

[cjgwilliams]

I'd like some water, please...:)


What? You know, it would really be helpful if responses posted to the board actually made some sense.

[iceman330]

I'd like some water, please...:)

"water" for what? This thread actually makes a good point. Although, ultimately there have been guys who were successful simply putting the ball in one arm or another and leaving it there, you are taught from firggin little league to hold the ball in the outside arm. However, sometimes that may require the back to switch hands and, as a coach, you excuse a player from holding it in the inside arm when the player's chances of fumbling increase if he swtiches hands or if he is just more comfortable holding the ball in a particular hand.

If you don't have anything intelligent to add to a post then why don't you just keep quiet.

[rtbasye]

The annoying habit that Portis (and Moss) have is when you ask them a question they always answer, "I mean..." For example, Question: "Clinton, do you anticipate the Giants stacking the box this weekend to stop you?" Clinton: "I mean, that's what teams do..." Question: "Clinton, "Do you think Ray Brown can do his job at 43 years old?" Clinton, "I mean, yeah, I think he can do..."

I know it's picky, but I like to hear guys talk right. Clinton, no one asked what you mean. They asked for an answer. Just answer. Santana does the same thing. It must be a nervous thing.


Dude, I mean that's pretty funny... you know what I mean.

[skinsfan51]

Dude, I mean that's pretty funny... you know what I mean.

I mean, yeah, I get your meaning. :doh: :D

[Duptgrow]

Look I love Portis...he's awsome but the guy is a pro running back and he doesn't put the football in the proper hand when he is running. The other day on his touchdown run he was running left but carrying the ball with his right arm, his inside arm...! NO! NO! NO! put that ball in the outside arm..keep it away from the defense...that is just basics....jeez..

GO Skins!

your an idiot

[NOVA2Tampa]

Damn...cut the guy some slack...when any of us on here can put up a single-season rushing performance like CP has done this season, then that person is qualified to ***** about CP holding the ball in the "wrong" arm...short of that, STFU...unless, of course, you know more about football than Joe Gibbs...

[thespaniard]

Right. Guys who have been involved in the game all this time, for that many years, who started out with the fundamentals, need help from us. Now that's arrogan presumption.


It's not arrogant, it's just the truth. Just like how a lot of NFL players do not tackle right. Probably 90% of NFL players in the secondary arm tackle. But that must be correct because they're pros right?

[Pool Shark]

My problem with Portis is that he goes down waaaaaaay to easily. It seems he is always getting tripped up in the backfield or right before he is about to break it.

I'd like to see him add a little more lower body weight to be able to shrug off at least some arm tackles

[thespaniard]

Damn...cut the guy some slack...when any of us on here can put up a single-season rushing performance like CP has done this season, then that person is qualified to ***** about CP holding the ball in the "wrong" arm...short of that, STFU...unless, of course, you know more about football than Joe Gibbs...

I'm pretty sure Joe Gibbs didn't tell him what arm to carry the ball in.

You know what, you're right. CP does everything right. Let's just fire the RB coach...

[VA4Skins-WDC]

He did the right thing.

No one was going to touch him, if he switches hands he heightens his chance of dropping the ball, fumbling etc. If there is no one at risk of touching him then by all means he should keep it in the hand that he's most dominant with.

Some of us don't know how to play football?

Pretty sure Portis knows how to play football a tiny bit better than you do. Take your Portis bashing somewhere else, I'm pretty sure no one at this forum wants to hear it. You're bashing the man that has carried this team on it's uphill comeback.

[thespaniard]

He did the right thing.

No one was going to touch him, if he switches hands he heightens his chance of dropping the ball, fumbling etc. If there is no one at risk of touching him then by all means he should keep it in the hand that he's most dominant with.

Some of us don't know how to play football?

Pretty sure Portis knows how to play football a tiny bit better than you do. Take your Portis bashing somewhere else, I'm pretty sure no one at this forum wants to hear it. You're bashing the man that has carried this team on it's uphill comeback.

We (the ones bashing CP) are not taking anything away from what Portis has done this year. He has had a tremendous year, and is finally starting to look like the back he was in Denver. That being said, NODOBY IS PERFECT. It's ok to criticize CP in a contructive way. None of these claims are unfounded. All players still make mistakes. That's why they have coaches. That's why they watch film. That's why they PRACTICE. No one in the NFL is perfect, and no one is beyond scrutiny.

[CPNDPhil]

"The other day on his touchdown run..."

It is a happy day indeed on the Skins' message boards of the world when we complain about touchdown runs.

[illone]

If it was causing him to fumble I'd agree with you.

It's not an area of concern for our offense or for Portis.

If he keeps doing what he's been doing he can carry the ball with his teeth for all I care.

[desertfox59]

oh dear God, if Portis fumbles, we will never hear the end of it from this guy.......

I would never gloat or be proud of something bad that might happen to our beloved redskins...in fact that is why I started this thread....I see a flaw and I want to do my part as a fan to correct it..I hope Portis never fumbles ever.

[desertfox59]

:laugh: :laugh:

I love it when I get a response that begins with "Look Blondie" :laugh: :laugh:

No, I didn't play a running back. I did sleep in a Holiday Inn Express however! Does that count?

I treat him like a baby? Where did that come from? :laugh: :laugh:

I just happened to read some of this to someone kinda close to the situation. I don't think they were worried Portis carrying the ball.

I don't think I will either.

Thanks for the debate however!! I really enjoyed it! Maybe we can do it again sometime.


Blondie

About the "look Blondie" I didn't mean anything sexist by it...but now that you mention it it was kinda funny.

about the "baby" thing not just you but several other posters on this thread have remarked and commented with scarcasm and stats and several rude and moronic remarks trying to make a percieved counter point to a point which I never made i.e. that CP is not good...nothing could be further from the truth ...I state now and I have stated previoulsy that CP is awsome. I wouldn't trade him for any back in the league right now. but some people in this thread think that CP can't handle anything that might point out a flaw in his game, just like you would coddle a baby when it does something incorrectly. My point is that CP is a man, and men don't need to be coddled. Men can take critisism and consider its relivence and if need be adjust accordingly. (women can do this too ;))

I don't know who your source is....but I'm happy to hear it's not a concern.

I have also enjoyed the debate...at least with the sensible fans who make intellegent points and counter points.

:eaglesuck

[desertfox59]

Right. Guys who have been involved in the game all this time, for that many years, who started out with the fundamentals, need help from us. Now that's arrogan presumption.

the only thing that is arrogan is that some people can't see the truth past the end of their loyality.

[desertfox59]

Anyone ever see Portis hold the ball in his left hand in his career? Maybe being right handed when he would carry the ball in his left(running left of course) he found that he fumbled too much since it was his weaker arm(practice doesn't make perfect, it makes better but not always good). Thus, he went againest the grain and decided to carry the ball in his right hand at all times to avoid this and achieve the fundemental of not turning the ball over(on a regular basis).

That, and he wants to make sure he's able to throw a TD when needed.

Both of these are valid points...I simply don't know the answer. And actually for us to know that answer it would be info for the enemy ...so please don't tell us skins.

but I think it was a draw play.....so the throwing a TD thing is not valid. only relevient on pitch outs and wide tackle run play handoffs.

[desertfox59]

Did you see a lot of Jim Brown playing???? As long as he doesn't put it on the ground and puts it in the end zone I don't care if he dribbles it there!!!

No I didn't....just the little in films...I am relying on second had info just like everybody else is in regards to Jim Brown. for that matter I didn't see Walter Camp play either but I'm pretty sure he is one of the founders of the modern game.

[desertfox59]

I mean don't take this personal, but it's bothersome when fans have the nerve to criticize players who are litterally breaking records like Clinton Portis is doing, do you think he'd be where he is today if his 'flaw' was really a flaw? Of course not.

It shouldn't be bothersome.....Football teaches us that Perfection is never attainable, but it should always be the goal.

[desertfox59]

:laugh: :laugh: Actually, I was impressed with the touch. It couldn't have been thrown much better.

Ditto.

[Monkart]

I'd like some water, please...:)

:laugh: :laugh: :laugh: :laugh:

[desertfox59]

your an idiot

Its "You are" or "You're"

Who is the idiot? :doh::laugh::laugh::laugh::doh::laugh::laugh::laug h::doh::doh::rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes:

[NOVA2Tampa]

You know what, you're right. CP does everything right. Let's just fire the RB coach...

Gawd, you sound like my wife... :laugh:

Yes, there is always room for improvement, but it's the results that count, and so far, the results are looking pretty damn good...like the old saying goes, if it ain't broken, don't fix it.

HTTR!!! :cheers: :eaglesuck

[desertfox59]

It's not arrogant, it's just the truth. Just like how a lot of NFL players do not tackle right. Probably 90% of NFL players in the secondary arm tackle. But that must be correct because they're pros right?

thank you ... weren't these same fans complaining about Walt Harris's arm tackling earlier before he honed up on his tackling fundamentals....Now he's kicking ass. good post.
:applause::applause::applause:

[desertfox59]

He did the right thing.

No one was going to touch him, if he switches hands he heightens his chance of dropping the ball, fumbling etc. If there is no one at risk of touching him then by all means he should keep it in the hand that he's most dominant with.

Some of us don't know how to play football?

Pretty sure Portis knows how to play football a tiny bit better than you do. Take your Portis bashing somewhere else, I'm pretty sure no one at this forum wants to hear it. You're bashing the man that has carried this team on it's uphill comeback.

Again, I never said he should switch in the middle of the run....when he orginally put the ball in one arm ...it should have been his left..

I'm not bashing him.....I'm helping him...maybe.

you're right, he is the team MVP IMO.

[desertfox59]

We (the ones bashing CP) are not taking anything away from what Portis has done this year. He has had a tremendous year, and is finally starting to look like the back he was in Denver. That being said, NODOBY IS PERFECT. It's ok to criticize CP in a contructive way. None of these claims are unfounded. All players still make mistakes. That's why they have coaches. That's why they watch film. That's why they PRACTICE. No one in the NFL is perfect, and no one is beyond scrutiny.

Ditto

[skin_finatic]

Look I love Portis...he's awsome but the guy is a pro running back and he doesn't put the football in the proper hand when he is running. The other day on his touchdown run he was running left but carrying the ball with his right arm, his inside arm...! NO! NO! NO! put that ball in the outside arm..keep it away from the defense...that is just basics....jeez..

GO Skins!

you want to complain about anything else?

[Monkart]

I would never gloat or be proud of something bad that might happen to our beloved redskins...in fact that is why I started this thread....I see a flaw and I want to do my part as a fan to correct it..I hope Portis never fumbles ever.

:laugh: :laugh: We as fans get to watch the game and enjoy or dislike what we see, we don't get to correct these players in any way. Do you think Ernest Byner is going to read your post and go tell Portis Hey Clinton!, I was on ES and this guy desertfox noticed something I have not, I think he's right hold the ball away from the defense. :doh:
Extremeskins gets us closer to the players then anywhere I've seen, but we'll never be close enough to coach the players jeez!! . :2cents:

[jsg1972]

I like him!!!!

[Joey T]

Corry dillon = overrated
Emmit Smith = Massively overrated

WALTER PAYTON = The greatest running back of all time so I'll only reply to this example. Yes Payton used to carry the ball in his palm however, Payton only did that in the open field and he only did that with the correct arm and further more whenever anyone came near him he would either tuck it away or he was out of bounds so it didn't matter

Geesh man, you need to get a life. Go get married, then complain to her :doh:

You sound like a nit-picking female of the '70s - '80s :doh:

Present company excepted Ladies :notworthy

[Monkart]

thank you ... weren't these same fans complaining about Walt Harris's arm tackling earlier before he honed up on his tackling fundamentals....Now he's kicking ass. good post.
:applause::applause::applause:

I suppose you pointed that out to Steve Jackson!!! And that's why he's doing better now. :silly:

[Monkart]

I like him!!!!

Easy there!! you don't want to use up all your energy in 1 post :laugh: .
:jk: Welcome to ES hope you enjoy it here. :cheers:

[OVCChairman]

Look I love Portis...he's awsome but the guy is a pro running back and he doesn't put the football in the proper hand when he is running. The other day on his touchdown run he was running left but carrying the ball with his right arm, his inside arm...! NO! NO! NO! put that ball in the outside arm..keep it away from the defense...that is just basics....jeez..

GO Skins!


want some cheese?

If i remember correctly, and not to jinx it ::knock on wood:: Portis has fumbled 3 times this year....3!!! Stephen Davis, who carried the ball on the outside hand, fumbled 3 times in multiple games....so if it aint broke, dont fix it, just relax

[Park City Skins]

It's not arrogant, it's just the truth. Just like how a lot of NFL players do not tackle right. Probably 90% of NFL players in the secondary arm tackle. But that must be correct because they're pros right?

Er no it;s not.Just because you agree does not make it truth. simply an opinion that makes sense to you. And judging by the way you're willing to engage in such sweeping generalizations such as the 90 % reference means you're easily agreeable.


the only thing that is arrogan is that some people can't see the truth past the end of their loyality.

No. The only that is arrogant is that some people can't see past their loyalty to their own opinion and need to be right that they can't admit the truth they state is merely that. An opinion.

desertfox you've done nothing here but state the obvious. Clinton carried the ball in the inside hand, ( wow), on "that" play and then claimed it to be a habit. Yet you have not given anything close to a list of examples of times he has done this. I've the games on tape. See him do this on occassion sure, but more often than not, he's doing exactly what he supposed to do. You've stated nothing here that nobody here doesn't know when it comes to fundamentals no matter when or what they played. Nothing nobody here can't find in a book or on a google search.



I guess some of you just don't understand how to play football...

It is a basic fundamental. when a running back first is handed the football he recieves it with both arms. the interrior arm (the one on the side of the Quaterback) goes up to supply the QB a pocket in which to put the football, while the exterior arm (the one on the opposite side of the QB) is down. in the initial running back pocket the points of the ball (the most vunerable parts ) are protected by both the hands and the elbows on each side until in the open field when the back can (for speed purposes) shift the ball to one arm[b], the outside arm....the arm closest to the sidelines to protect the ball from the inside out tackling angles of the defense!


Case in point.


http://www.nflhs.com/TipsDrills/features/features_01032000d_db.asp

The back also must make certain that he forms a pocket, with his hands and arms, to receive the ball from the quarterback. Though it is the quarterback's responsibility to place the ball properly in the runner's stomach, once the ball is there it becomes the back's priority to make certain that he has the ball securely in his grasp and well protected until the play is blown dead.

At the point of the exchange, the running back should form a pocket to receive the ball by raising up his inside elbow so that it is almost even with his shoulders. A large percentage of the fumbles which occur on the exchange are caused by the running back not raising his inside elbow high enough and his elbow actually hitting the point of the ball. The forearm of this upraised arm should be horizontal to the ground, extending straight across the runner's chest and forming the top of the pocket. The hand of this arm should bend down so that the palm can grasp the point of the ball.
The bottom of the pocket is formed by the other arm and hand. The forearm of the outside arm should be extended straight across the ball carrier's stom-ach. The palm should be up and fingers extended toward the quarterback



:whew: Real tough there.

Nobody is saying it isn't a fundamental and in some cases, even mine, that he probably needed it to be in the other hand. Most here are saying there was probably a reason or reasons for it and that the coaches are probably aware of that. That's what they do.




Now here is where arrogance really comes into play. The coaches and staff have an untold number of years playing and coaching football. Part of that is....you bet, fundamentals. Could be that they work with C.P. on this or at least remind him of those times when he didn't. Yet here you are, based on little observation, saying that this could help C.P., one of the premier backs in the league and coached by some of the best in the league to dat, be a better back. Assuming that maybe, these guys could miss the little things. Here's a question for you. Have you ever watched film with someone who has coached H.S. ball then do the same with College? Do you understand just how picky these guys are? Just how easy they pick up the smallest details?

Now let's get to this Walter Payton thing. You're going to have to do better. I watched Peyton from the time his rookie year to the time he retired. NO, he did not just do that in the open field, ( btw, you did see that on that TD run by Portis that nobody was around him), he would do so when traffic was in the area. One of his trademark runs was to take the ball and head to to outside, ( switching the ball to his palm. Thing about that), palm the ball and then stutter step or slow down, then accelerate between defenders, all the while palming the ball. Sure, he tucked it when he was going to get hit, but so does C.P. Speaking of whom, quick. What's another trademark move Sweetness would make that C.P. does every now and then. And don't be selective in who you accept as an example simply because they don't fit into your argument. Riggens, Smith, Cambell, and the list goes on. All on occassion did what you saw C.P. do at times for whatever reason.

Now maybe the coaches did ***** at them for it, or maybe they didn't depending on circumstance, or as has been stated, it was in their comfort zone. None of this matters really, because when it comes down to it, this isn't going to make him a better back unless it becomes a problem with him. Hasn't yet. No reason to believe it will be. If you're going to impress around here, you're going to have to better than nitpicking, ( claiming it's for the better of the team), and regurgitating H.S. taught fundamentals. Simply put, if it appears as though it's a nonissue for the guys who do this for a living then more than likely it's non issue for many of this. Not blind faith or loyalty, it's common sense.

[Redskins4ever]

Look I love Portis...he's awsome but the guy is a pro running back and he doesn't put the football in the proper hand when he is running. The other day on his touchdown run he was running left but carrying the ball with his right arm, his inside arm...! NO! NO! NO! put that ball in the outside arm..keep it away from the defense...that is just basics....jeez..

GO Skins!


When you have speed, you can carry the ball in any hand you want.

[ZoEd]

:rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes: :rolleyes::rolleyes:

Never sir, Never did I say to switch hands. I said to put it into the proper arm. in this case the left arm. he was running left of the center that means the defense would be comming right to left. When first decided to take one of his arms off the ball it should have been his right.

I guarantee you that at big schools, small schools, medium sized schools across the country that they tell you to put the ball away from the defense once you remove your other arm from the ball after the hand off. this is no myth

the only myth here is that you know what you are talking about. :silly:

Wow Fox, I am so impressed by your knowledge of the game I am sending you an invitation to replace Earnest Byner as the Redskins running backs coach or better yet why not be the head coach for Detroit. You are so awesome and use big words and all, I bet you have a lot of friends. Blow it out your *****, the dude has more talent in his pinky toe than you have in your entire couch potato body. Find a topic that really matters then start a thread, until then quit trolling smarty farty.

[ZoEd]

Actually I do Portis gets to much air under the ball on those long passes.
That pass to Cooley look more like a punt, and he didnt plant both feet
either.
Wow Bud, you noticed that too. He didn't turn his hips right or hold the ball properly. I think JG should bench CP until he gets his fundementals correct. I mean we don't want to be bad fans by overlooking such basics to the game of football. How dare we as fans settle for anything less than perfection. How many times has Brunell underthrown Moss this year just to end up in the endzone. How dare he not throw a perfect spiral hitting Moss in stride and into coverage. I would much rather see an interception as long as the fundementals are followed. We're merely bigotory fans for settling for anything less than perfection.

[G-Prime]

Actually that would not be a reason for it. The goal line is infinite as long as there is a body part over the pylon. he could stretch the ball out of bounds as he dove sideways and as long as a foot went over the pylon its a touchdown. Vick did that in one of these recent games. Held the ball out of bounds as he dove, but threw a hand over the pylon for a touchdown.

On the other hand I do not see a problem with him holding it in the left arm. Yes I agree you would think it would be better to hold it away from the defense but there must be a reason. If none of his coaches have made him change it from highschool through college and into the NFL then perhaps there is a very good reason for it and we should just let it go...

Dude I've played the position for 20 years ok.. Don't tell me. Not trying to be rude, I'm just sick of you know it alls who wouldn't know a gut from a sweep. Trying to sound like you have a clue, when it's obvious to anyone who's played past pee wee league's that you don't..

[ZoEd]

Desertfox, just wanted to share a little nugget I heard during the Chiefs game today.

Larry Johnson doesn't like running left because he's not comfortable carrying the ball in his left hand. While at Penn State the coaches would only allow him to carry the ball in his right hand. Now in the pro's they encourage him to carry it in his left when running left but he just isn't comfortable doing so.

3yrs in the league he has fumbled 4 times in 450 attempts
1549yds this season in 8 starts

I think if a guy, like Portis, can put up numbers like this he can carry the ball in any damn hand he feels like. Just thought you'd want to know that CP isn't the only one. Oh and by the way so much for it be driven into players heads in College.

[Sticksboi05]

Be quiet will you. Did he fumble at all today? No. Case closed.

The greatest RB of all time is between Payton, Brown and Sanders.

[rtbasye]

Portis "I mean wow... we won, I ran great, I scored... I mean the Xtreme skins site is great....you know what I mean."

(more on the habit portis has of starting statements with "I mean")

[FootballGuy2677]

You know this man named clinton portis who is supposedly carrying the ball wrong only has 3 fumbles this season? Besides what are to tell a Pro Football Running Back how to carry the ball? Especially when he deserved to go to the pro bowl this year and has 1500+ Yards and 11 TD's.

[G-Prime]

I'd just like to add Portis again carried the ball in the wrong hand in the right situation, at the end of his touch down run he stretched out with his right hand to get it in. Bt the looks of it he wouldn't have needed to do that but if he had, had it in his left hand closest to the side line and was pushed out of bounds well then no touchdown for us then.

[JuiceMan_74]

the maker of this thread has al bundy syndrome

[TD Riggo]

Well let me explain it to you....

People, many people call Emmit Smith the best running back of all time...


Well, I don't know who these "people" are, but I would guess they are not very knowledgable about football. Now I WOULD say that he is somewhere about the number 5 to 10 RB's of all time, probably closer to the 10 side than the 5.

[wamo]

thank you ... weren't these same fans complaining about Walt Harris's arm tackling earlier before he honed up on his tackling fundamentals....Now he's kicking ass. good post.
:applause::applause::applause:

Ahhh, that is the difference. We were not complaining when he was tackling well. But still, "kicking ass" is a little overboard, he has a way to go before it's called "kicking ass".

I would like to thank all of you who complained about Walt's tackling though because he is improving!

[MisterPinstripe]

Quote:
Originally Posted by MisterPinstripe
Actually that would not be a reason for it. The goal line is infinite as long as there is a body part over the pylon. he could stretch the ball out of bounds as he dove sideways and as long as a foot went over the pylon its a touchdown. Vick did that in one of these recent games. Held the ball out of bounds as he dove, but threw a hand over the pylon for a touchdown.

On the other hand I do not see a problem with him holding it in the left arm. Yes I agree you would think it would be better to hold it away from the defense but there must be a reason. If none of his coaches have made him change it from highschool through college and into the NFL then perhaps there is a very good reason for it and we should just let it go...



Dude I've played the position for 20 years ok.. Don't tell me. Not trying to be rude, I'm just sick of you know it alls who wouldn't know a gut from a sweep. Trying to sound like you have a clue, when it's obvious to anyone who's played past pee wee league's that you don't..

Alright, I realize this is MORE then a little late but I have been out of the country for a few weeks... You know nothing about me. You know nothing about what I know about football, so do not tell me I know nothing and call me a know it all. I know for a fact that the goal line is infinite as long as there is a body part over the pylon, this making it so that the ball does NOT need to be inside the pylon. Instead of acting like a know it all yourself, why dont make sure you are right before bashing someone and making yourself look like an idiot. There are a couple instances where I can show proof that that is a correct statement on MY part. One such case is an atlanta game ealier this year. Vick dove towards the endzone, but was out of bounds as he was in the air before he got the the endzone. The ball was in his left hand which was out of bounds. He flashed his right hand over the pylon, and the ball was past the edge of the goal line. Ruling on challange was that it was a touchdown because his putting his hand over the pylon extended the goal line to infinite, thus making the ball go over the goal line.

[MoeRedskins]

Wow, this is a very angry thread. I think people need to calm down a bit.

And for the outbounds infinite goal line thing. I think onces a player is in clear possiesion of the ball (no bobbling, two feet inbounds, all that) once the ball breaks the plain of the out of bounds maker it is condsided out. I think if your case were right about the infinate goalline, then players wouldn't be trying to make such an effort to cross the plane inside of the sidelines, they could do it just as easiely by throwing their arm around the pylon. Now, I never saw this Atlanta play with Vick, so I am not sure, but with Reffing the way it was last year, I wouldn't be surprised if the refs got that call wrong.

[twenty-eight]

I dont think any of you should tell clinton what to do! YOu shouldnt even have an opinion simply because youre wrong.

[mcarey032]

HE was the team record holder this year for a single season. I think that portis can carry it however he wants as long as he scores and makes mondo yards.

[themurf]

Look I love Portis...he's awsome but the guy is a pro running back and he doesn't put the football in the proper hand when he is running. The other day on his touchdown run he was running left but carrying the ball with his right arm, his inside arm...! NO! NO! NO! put that ball in the outside arm..keep it away from the defense...that is just basics....jeez..

GO Skins!

Are you talking about his touchdown run in the Eagles game? If so, he kept the ball inside because of the angle he was coming from. If that ball was in his other hand he doesn't get it in the endzone.

[Mister Looney]

I just talked to Portis on the phone and he said the reason he was carrying the ball in the wrong hand was because his other hand was all sweaty from worrying what the fans thought about his running technique.

I can feel the love in here.

[MisterPinstripe]

here are a couple of statements to back mine up.

I can speak to the Vick TD.

The play was ruled a touchdown because:
a: the ball crossed the plane of the goal line before any part of the player touched OOB, AND,
b: ANY part of the player's body crossed the goal line inside of the pylon.

In the case of the Vick play, the ball was in both hands as he ran for the left corner. As he reached the corner, he dropped his right hand off the ball and reached over the pylon with that hand. In watching the replay later, Al Michaels and John Madden gave great kudos to Vick for his quick thinking.

Whether or not Vick thought that quickly or if it was more of an accident, we'll never know. I considered going down to the locker room to ask him about it after the game as I often get a chance to do, but that game, Vick got hurt before the end of the game and left early. In addition, it was the latest ending non-overtime Monday night game in who knows how long (game ended at 12:45am, and I had to go to work the next morning).

After every game, I have to call the league office in New York to see if there are any problems in the game file before closing out the game on the network. That night, when I FINALLY called the office, I asked, "Chris, is this the latest ending monday night game this year?"

He answered: "This year? We're looking it up to see if it's the latest ending Monday Night game EVER!"

And it wasn't even an very good game.

And another:

Old Coach,

I'm not quite sure what you were trying to say. The goal line is extended, but only for a ball in possesion of a runner inbounds (ie. The ball can be over the out of bounds area, but the runner has to be inbounds. Definition 2-25-3:

quote: . . . The goal line is the vertical plane which separates the field of play from the end zone. When related to a live ball in a runner's possession (touching inbounds) while the ball is over the out-of-bounds area, the goal line includes the extension beyond the sidelines. A team's own goal line is the one it is defending.

[Jofizz]

Hey as long as Portis is rushing for 1,500+ and breaking franchise records he can balance the ball on his head for all i care.

Lighten up.

[Die Hard]

Look I love Portis...he's awsome but the guy is a pro running back and he doesn't put the football in the proper hand when he is running. The other day on his touchdown run he was running left but carrying the ball with his right arm, his inside arm...! NO! NO! NO! put that ball in the outside arm..keep it away from the defense...that is just basics....jeez..

GO Skins!

This all goes back to coaching. Obviously, Joe Gibbs and Mike Shanahan haven't spent enough time teaching these football players the fundamentals about football. Rather, these coaches in the game for egotistical reasons and to make money.

Tackle football is a complicated game and should be played by no human until every skill is perfected by the BIG BOOK OF FOOTBALL.

I wish this post was sarcasm... but unfortunately, I'm just echoing the original author's similar sentiments from another thread.

[MLSKINS]

This all goes back to coaching. Obviously, Joe Gibbs and Mike Shanahan haven't spent enough time teaching these football players the fundamentals about football. Rather, these coaches in the game for egotistical reasons and to make money.

Tackle football is a complicated game and should be played by no human until every skill is perfected by the BIG BOOK OF FOOTBALL.

I wish this post was sarcasm... but unfortunately, I'm just echoing the original author's similar sentiments from another thread.
:doh: :doh:
If every football player was pefect what would we talk about.
Edit: Speaking of Portis he will be on NFL Total Acess tonight at 7, along with Macgahee and James. Steve Young will be on there too. It should be a good watch.

[Die Hard]

There are "fundamentals" of the game because there has to be some standardized skills to be taught. All the fundamentals of the game aren't gospel. They are just the ideal.

Any football coach will tell you.... "there's no right or wrong way to do things. THere's just my way."

Geez, a few people learn a few fundamentals of the sport... and all of a sudden they become experts. :rolleyes:

[MLSKINS]

I know people who hate the fundamentals but can still put up 40 points in a basketball game. Hey Iverson.

[SKINZ33]

hes not the only back to use bad technique and if thats all there is to compain about the guy then big deal.

[Die Hard]

:doh: :doh:
If every football player was pefect what would we talk about.

What's the championship formula for football?

Is it a team coached my a disciplinarian? Or a player's coach? Is it an offensive-minded team or a defensive-minded team? Should you stop the run or focus on shutting down the pass? Should you run the ball or should you win by passing the ball? There are pocket passers that have games... and there are scramblers that have won games. Do you win with a bruising running attack? Or play-action pass?

Does every quarterback have the same windup? The same release point? No. Of course not. Favre was criticized for having a horrible throwing motion.... all the way to the Hall of Fame.

Some coaches teach runningbacks to hold the ball with their index finger on the point of the ball. Others teach it by putting the point between the index and third fingers.

There's no hard and fast rules to football... the bottom line is... whatever works.

[Loxley]

Well said.

[MisterPinstripe]

What's the championship formula for football?

Is it a team coached my a disciplinarian? Or a player's coach? Is it an offensive-minded team or a defensive-minded team? Should you stop the run or focus on shutting down the pass? Should you run the ball or should you win by passing the ball? There are pocket passers that have games... and there are scramblers that have won games. Do you win with a bruising running attack? Or play-action pass?

Does every quarterback have the same windup? The same release point? No. Of course not. Favre was criticized for having a horrible throwing motion.... all the way to the Hall of Fame.

Some coaches teach runningbacks to hold the ball with their index finger on the point of the ball. Others teach it by putting the point between the index and third fingers.

There's no hard and fast rules to football... the bottom line is... whatever works.

Well put. There is not just one way to do things. Heck, when Pistol Pete Maravich (sp?) first started playing, he was criticized up one side and down the other. Not drawing a connection between the two. Just pointing out that what may seem ridiculous and not part of how the game should be played at the time does not mean that it doesn’t work just as well if not better.

*edit* Just in case for those of you who do not know, Pistol Pete played basketball. Made it the game it is today. *edit*

[hailtotheredskins89826]

if hes scores who cares

[Peregrine]

Ok... I think Desertfox gets my idiot of the week award. I know its popular for people to harp on basics(we all know coaches tell you to put the ball in the outside hand), but the fact is, talent and skill trump over technique at times. Some QBs also had abnormal throwing motions yet were awesome.

So criticizing portis after all he has done is one thing, its another when he has barely fumbled the ball in his career. Its yet another to call great running backs, including the NFL record holder, overrated. Seriously.

[Renegade7]

That's unreal. The man just broke the single season franchise rushing record, and people are pissed because he held the ball in the wrong hand?

[tiger187126]

Look I love Portis...he's awsome but the guy is a pro running back and he doesn't put the football in the proper hand when he is running. The other day on his touchdown run he was running left but carrying the ball with his right arm, his inside arm...! NO! NO! NO! put that ball in the outside arm..keep it away from the defense...that is just basics....jeez..

GO Skins!

if it's a touchdown run i don't care what arm it's in....when it's a run ending in a fumble (twice this year) then we can talk arms

i think if he's more prone to fumble with his left arm, regardless of sideline he's running to, then he should carry in his right

he makes good money and is better than high school football players, so i say he can fool with mechanics a little bit

[andyburd]

Look at the greatest run in Redskin history, Riggo has the ball in his left hand. Good point

[kwitt]

The lesson learned from this thread is that if you don't agree with desertfox then you are a moron and he will talk down to you.

[skins'89]

He gets the job done, does he not.

[Lil Kenzo]

Portis just came off a great season where he rushed for 1500+ yards and you want to complain about how he carries the football.

[Sticksboi05]

Look at the greatest run in Redskin history, Riggo has the ball in his left hand. Good point

Yeah stop talking. He led us into the playoffs. He rarely fumbles. He gets the job done. You don;t play so you have no right to criticize about half of our offense.

*This is NOT aimed at the person I'm quoting. It's to ther person who started this stupid thread.*

Lol. Riggo had it in the left arm. Shook!

[creamsodas]

Wow I just wasted 30 minutes reading 9 pages of people bashing desertfox.

[Utah]

You know, I have had a chance to do a little coaching in my time and I can say this:

"If it ain't broke, don't fix it"

If I had a kid who had some wild way of doing a particular move in football that seemed to go against the norm, I would ask myself, is he failing at what he is doing?

If the answer is no, then I would shut-up. Let him do what he is doing and as long as he is successful, take credit for putting him in a position to succeed.

Catch a coach trying to change him? Tell him to stop trying to reinvent the wheel. If its rolling, leave it alone.

I have a ton more pithy little sayings to go along for this but the bottom line is:
Micro-managing sucks.

[Dance04]

wow, how the HELL can u say corey dillon is overated desertfox????

[GibbSkins11]

Look I love Portis...he's awsome but the guy is a pro running back and he doesn't put the football in the proper hand when he is running. The other day on his touchdown run he was running left but carrying the ball with his right arm, his inside arm...! NO! NO! NO! put that ball in the outside arm..keep it away from the defense...that is just basics....jeez..

GO Skins!

glossary time GibbSkins11 style.....

frange - not right , off , and just well frange


buddy that stuff u just wasted my eyesight with is well frange:doh:

[Scribble]

I dont care how he carries it if he keeps putting up the big yards and not fumbling. If it was a problem, then yeah it would be a good point you brought up but its not really a problem is it?

[chiplohmillers#1]

Have you thought about a position as Runningbacks coach? Perhaps you have more to offer then Ernest Byner. I mean after all you probibly have a multitude of years of experience dealing with NFL Runningbacks.

[blue_n_silver]

Desert, you are seriously confused. Emmitt did move the ball to the correct hand when he could. As far as being overrated, when did you start watching football? Let me guess, since the skins became an over .500 club?
I for one dont hear a lot of people suggest that Emmitt was THE best that ever ran, rather he is one of the best all time, I would agree with that.

[ChiefPowhatan17]

Sometimes changing hands with the ball is not a priority when a back is using his field vision to look for the hole.

My complaint is about the fact that Portis doesn't always look to see where no one is. So many times he ran in the back of people and pushed when all he had to do was look and bounce outside and he would've had a 1700 yard season.

[redskinsfan17]

how many times did portis fumble this year? like twice?? and oh wait...that was just one bad game he played.

[Doodie987]

yeah dude. he's the man and it has clearly worked for him.