Empty promise

[The Evil Genius]

:laugh:

This should stir the pot.

http://www.thestate.com/mld/thestate/sports/15776471.htm

Empty promise
Fool's gold >> Three years after the Atlantic Coast Conference traded away its principles in a brazen bid for national football supremacy and the riches that go with it, the league has attained neither

By RON MORRIS
rmorris@thestate.com

Three years into its grand attempt to keep up with the Joneses of college football, Atlantic Coast Conference expansion has been a colossal flop.

The national powers added for football have slipped into mediocrity, leaving the ACC where it was before expansion — among the conference also-rans. Meanwhile, the league it raided for expansion teams, the Big East, has emerged as among the nation’s best.

There is more. A central idea behind expansion was to garner extra income by sliding a second team into a Bowl Championship Series game. For the third season in a row, that will not happen.

Then there are peripheral issues. For the sake of expansion, the best basketball league in the country suffers. How else do you explain that Duke and North Carolina State, close rivals since the league’s inception, play each other only once a season in basketball?

Finally, one of the ACC’s new members gave the league a black eye Saturday with an on-field brawl that left 13 Miami players suspended. That is three such incidents — counting Clemson’s fight against South Carolina, and Miami’s tussle with LSU after last season’s Peach Bowl — in the past three seasons for the ACC.

This from a league that once prided itself on being a notch above the rest in the areas that counted most: integrity, high values and all that was good about college athletics. It was founded more than a half-century ago on the idea that academics and athletics go hand in hand, and even established a higher entrance requirement for athletes than all other leagues.

That 800 SAT minimum score requirement was dropped in the early 1970s, but the league still held a sense of balance regarding it during the next three decades that earned respect from every other conference in the country.

Then the ACC got greedy. Instead of standing for what it long believed in, that athletic success could be achieved without succumbing to the temptations of big money and academic shortcuts, the ACC buckled. It gave in. The ACC decided to keep up with its peers no matter the cost to its reputation or to the sport that made the ACC’s name: basketball.

Miami and Virginia Tech were added to the fold for the 2004 football season, and Boston College followed in 2005. It was purely a football decision. By getting to 12 teams, the ACC could add a championship game for football.

As a member of the BCS, the league champion gains automatic qualification to one of the big bowls following the regular season. With the additions of traditional football powers Miami and Virginia Tech, it stood to reason that the ACC increased its chances of placing an extra team in a BCS bowl.

Getting two teams into BCS bowls is a financial windfall for the league. So, too, is a league championship game, although the Florida State-Virginia Tech matchup in the inaugural game fell short of capacity in Jacksonville, Fla.

Although not likely, it remains possible that Wake Forest and Georgia Tech could square off in this season’s ACC championship game. You can be assured that no ACC official imagined a scenario where neither participating team could promise 20,000 in ticket sales for a title game.

Those same ACC officials also probably never anticipated the slow decline of the Florida State program under coach Bobby Bowden, as well as big drop-offs this season by Miami and Virginia Tech.

When Florida State and Miami unexpectedly lost three games apiece during the 2004 season, only league champion Virginia Tech played in a BCS game. Likewise, only Florida State reached a BCS game in 2005, because it defeated Virginia Tech in the championship game.

This season, none of the big three is ranked in The Associated Press poll. Without one of the traditional powers in the national rankings, the entire league has suffered. One ranking of leagues has the ACC sixth, three spots behind the Big East.

Clemson, at No. 12, is the highest-rated ACC team in the initial BCS ratings, with Georgia Tech at No. 19 and Boston College at No. 20. The Big East, which lost league members Miami, Virginia Tech and Boston College to the ACC, has rebounded well and has West Virginia at No. 5, Louisville at No. 7 and Rutgers at No. 16 in the BCS ratings.

It seems fitting that the Big East has a much greater chance of landing a second team in a BCS bowl than the ACC.

Of the seven or so ACC teams in the hunt for a league championship and BCS bowl, Miami is one of them. In the aftermath of Miami’s ugly brawl against Florida International on Saturday, perhaps the ACC should consider removing the Hurricanes from bowl consideration.

That is an old ACC way of thinking. These days, the league would rather reap the benefits of the additional money generated by Miami playing in a bowl game.

Sad, but true.

[hokie4redskins]

Try to hide the smirk on your face, TEG.

This article is ridiculous. Speaking of raiding conferences, what happens when the NFL does it? See ACC 2006. When 51 of your best players are snatched up, the level of play tends to......well....level out.

I'm not worried in the least. With any huge project such as ACC Expansion, there are going to be growing pains. Regardless, for the rest of time, VT will be in a top-notch conference rather than rotting in mediocrity with the likes of South Florida and Cincinnatti.

The guy who wrote this (who is he, and why do I care what some writer from a obscure newspaper in South Carolina thinks?) sounds like a NYT "journalist" proclaiming defeat for the U.S. after only a short three years. Where will the ACC be in 3 years, 5 years, 50 years? Again, I'm not worried in the LEAST.

All teams have down years. FSU's downfall started well before ACC expansion was even in the works. Three years ago, nobody could've foreseen Coker steering UM's ship to the bottom of the ocean. VT is suffering through it's own growing pains as a very young team battling a slug-fest conference and is preparing for '08 and '09. This conference will be back and with a vengeance.

I'll be interested to see WVU's transition when they lose White and Slaton. If you think everything will be hunky dorey because of the genius that is RRod, you're in for a rude awakening.

Anyway, WVU nation would LOVE to be in this conference even today but you know you never will. So what do you do? Search for obscure articles from remote locations in some lame attempt to say, "I told you so." Please, if the ACC invited WVU to join the party, your AD would ditch the Big East in a heartbeat.

Even at the ACC's absolute worst and the Big East's absolute best which seems to be the case this year, the ACC is still in better shape.

Then, now, always.

[SkinsHokieFan]

A bad half of a season and its fools gold?

Does college football just end at the end of 2006? :whoknows:

I dunno, but losing 51 draft picks, 13 of which were first rounders (more first rounders then TOTAL draft picks from the BE) kinda sucks away some serious talent

And it is clearly evident there is a lack of expierenced talent in the conference.

[DarthSidious]

TEG,

Remember the 2004 season when Pitt was the Big East representative for their BCS bid (mind you, a year when WVU was picked to go undefeated and to grab that bid) and got destroyed by Utah in the Fiesta Bowl? After that season, lots of writers, etc were calling for the Big East's head. Well, seems like the conference has rebounded itself from that. ;) Every conference has down years. I'm not going to deny that. But on the bright side, if Clemson, WF, or some other school in the ACC runs the table, I think it would be better long term for the conference because it builds up the conference in terms of depth (outside of the usual Miami, FSU, and VT). So far, Clemson has looked terrific and so has WF. And there's still more games to be played this season so who knows how it shakes out. :2cents:

[SkinsHokieFan]

TEG,

Remember the 2004 season when Pitt was the Big East representative for their BCS bid (mind you, a year when WVU was picked to go undefeated and to grab that bid) and got destroyed by Utah in the Fiesta Bowl? After that season, lots of writers, etc were calling for the Big East's head. Well, seems like the conference has rebounded itself from that. ;)


According to WVU fans 2004 never occured :laugh:

[LeesburgSkinFan]

For those who think that Miami and FSU are in "temporary decline", ask yourselves when the last time Alabama played for a National Championship. Anyone think of Nebraska as more than a shadow of Nebraska teams of Tom Osborne and his predecessor? How long did it take USC to return to glory after John Robinson left? Ohio State took decades to rebuild after Woody Hays left. Texas took two decades between the last national champion contender and the 2005-6 team. Notre Dame is still tinkering to rebuild the program certainly after Holtz, but it could be argued that its decline began under Faust. The decline can be predictable and these things often take a fairly long time to turn around.

[EersSkins05]

1) That newspaper is the largest newspaper in South Carolina, which happens to house the highest ranked team in the ACC right now. Might not want to bash what is essentially an article from ACC country.

2) Several of you have focused on the decline in play of the ACC this year after losing draft picks, but that's only a portion of his argument. He also notes that the ACC diluted what used to be considered the nation's best basketball conference for the sake of football dominance that hasn't come, as well as the fact that two of the new additions to the ACC have had off and on-field "incidents" that have given a black eye to the rest of what used to be considered a distinguished conference.

Say what you will, but after last year's MVII fiasco, Miami's tunnel fight with LSU, Miami stomping on Louisville's logo midfield (before getting destroyed ON the field), last Thursday's Herbstreit tongue-lashing following embarassing on-field bickering, cheap shots, personal fouls, and dancing, and stupefying, unbelievable on-field brawl between Miami and FIU, and you can understand where he's coming from.

The ACC used to be able to hold its head high when stuff like that happened at other schools in other conferences. (This is a league with Duke, Wake Forest, UNC, and UVA, after all.)

No more.

And Hokie4 is probably right that WVU would've jumped at the chance to join the ACC. (Although neither the article nor TEG even mentioned the Mountaineers. Which is worth noting.) Thank GOD we didn't... lol

[EersSkins05]

By the way, I wrote an article for our website basically arguing this same notion about a day before this article came out.

The Big East is better off without Virginia Tech and Miami (http://www.wemustignitethiscouch.com/modules/weblog/details.php?blog_id=156)

[DarthSidious]

1) That newspaper is the largest newspaper in South Carolina, which happens to house the highest ranked team in the ACC right now. Might not want to bash what is essentially an article from ACC country.

2) Several of you have focused on the decline in play of the ACC this year after losing draft picks, but that's only a portion of his argument. He also notes that the ACC diluted what used to be considered the nation's best basketball conference for the sake of football dominance that hasn't come, as well as the fact that two of the new additions to the ACC have had off and on-field "incidents" that have given a black eye to the rest of what used to be considered a distinguished conference.

Say what you will, but after last year's MVII fiasco, Miami's tunnel fight with LSU, Miami stomping on Louisville's logo midfield (before getting destroyed ON the field), last Thursday's Herbstreit tongue-lashing following embarassing on-field bickering, cheap shots, personal fouls, and dancing, and stupefying, unbelievable on-field brawl between Miami and FIU, and you can understand where he's coming from.

The ACC used to be able to hold its head high when stuff like that happened at other schools in other conferences. (This is a league with Duke, Wake Forest, UNC, and UVA, after all.)

No more.

And Hokie4 is probably right that WVU would've jumped at the chance to join the ACC. (Although neither the article nor TEG even mentioned the Mountaineers. Which is worth noting.) Thank GOD we didn't... lol

I'm going to have to disagree with you about the ACC holding its head high before the addition of Miami/VT and BC. The conference had FSU long before we came in. When FSU was making its run in the 90s, a bunch of scandals occured (i.e. Coles and Warrick getting "free clothes", and free shoes, which ironically lead to Steve Spurrier nicknaming FSU- Free Shoe University :laugh: . As for Duke, UNC, and UVA holding their head high, I don't think that's the case at all. I think those 3 insititutions have a snobbish, elitish attitude. Look back a few years ago when UVA and WVU played in that bowl in Charlotte and the UVA band or whoever it was had that segment making fun of the people in the state of WV. Of course, controversy erupted over that. Is UVA holding its head high by generalizing a state with tired stereotypes? I don't think so. And let's not forget the Duke lacrosse scandal. I'm not saying VT or Miami are perfect because we are not, but to say Duke, UNC, and UVA are is a hypocritical statement. :2cents:

[DarthSidious]

By the way, I wrote an article for our website basically arguing this same notion about a day before this article came out.

The Big East is better off without Virginia Tech and Miami (http://www.wemustignitethiscouch.com/modules/weblog/details.php?blog_id=156)

Oh please, you and other WVU fans would still want to play VT in football regardless of what's happening.:laugh: But hey, keep enjoying that yearly series with Marshall. :D

And to call VT and Miami me-first programs and leaving the Big East in shambles, come on! :rotflmao:Every school looks out for themselves! If the SEC came up to WVU and asked them to join, WVU would jump in right then and there and so would Pitt if the Big 10 offered them a spot! And let's not forget the Big East raided Conference USA and left that conference for dead!

In the end, its always about the money in college athletics. No ands, ifs or buts. :2cents:

[TheJoe1013]

The writer is also primarily an antagonist. He loves to stir the pot. Everything he writes should be taken with a grain of salt.

So the Clemson and South Carolina Brawl the year before VT and Miami officially entered the ACC was what? Clemson definitely an ACC school, and definitely embarassed the ACC then.

Glad to see you mention Miami and VT's off and on field problems. A small question I have is how many people have UVA, MD, FSU either dismissed or suspended for off the field problems since 2000? The numbers are similar, and in some cases higher, than VT and Miami.

I'm not a supporter of any of this nonsense going on and off the football field, but this whole "holier than thou" attitudes that people shoot at eachother from every side is somewhat ridiculous. Look at the ESPN headlines for college football:

NCAA to explore adopting policy after Miami FIU fight
BC kicker has been reinstated after suspended for fighting at a bar
2 Ball State players arrested for theft
2 Albany players arrested for rape
Sooner's top tackler arrested on two charges
No. Colorado fullback arrested for third degree assault

All of this since Sunday. That makes me ill.

Nobod is perfect. Nobody is clean. ACC schools were no different before or after expansion. Everyteam has a problem child, every team has bad apples, and every team has skeletons in their closets. Just pray that whatever team you root for doesn't have their skeletons exposed. Basically, whats happened at VT and Miami should be irrelevant in terms of success for the ACC as the same stuff is happening all across the college football landscape. There should be no black eye, unless every conference has a black eye.

[SkinsHokieFan]

Once again, I never realized CFB was ending in 2006

Had it ended in 2004, the ACC would have been "right"

If it ends this year, the BE will be "right"

Once again everyone, its all about the benjamins baby. And who has them $$$$

[EersSkins05]

I'm going to have to disagree with you about the ACC holding its head high before the addition of Miami/VT and BC. The conference had FSU long before we came in. When FSU was making its run in the 90s, a bunch of scandals occured (i.e. Coles and Warrick getting "free clothes", and free shoes, which ironically lead to Steve Spurrier nicknaming FSU- Free Shoe University :laugh: . As for Duke, UNC, and UVA holding their head high, I don't think that's the case at all. I think those 3 insititutions have a snobbish, elitish attitude. Look back a few years ago when UVA and WVU played in that bowl in Charlotte and the UVA band or whoever it was had that segment making fun of the people in the state of WV. Of course, controversy erupted over that. Is UVA holding its head high by generalizing a state with tired stereotypes? I don't think so. And let's not forget the Duke lacrosse scandal. I'm not saying VT or Miami are perfect because we are not, but to say Duke, UNC, and UVA are is a hypocritical statement. :2cents:

First of all, a hypocritical statement would be if I was a fan of Miami and I called VT a bunch of thugs. As is, I'm saying that Duke, Wake, UNC, and UVA are typically head and shoulders above most other programs in the NCAA when it comes to academics, recruiting violations, on-field behavior, etc. Obviously, nobody's perfect, but the standards are there.

Granted, the ACC did have FSU in the 90's, and even then there was an uneasy tension between FSU and those other schools.

And the Virginia band and fans did make asses of themselves in the Tire Bowl a few years ago against WVU, and if I'm not mistaken the band was placed under self-imposed sanctions and a formal apology was issued. Either way, this is a relatively minor incident when compared to arrests, brawls, etc.

[DarthSidious]

And here's Mandal refuting your arguments about Miami:

Mandel's article about the U (http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2006/writers/stewart_mandel/10/18/mandel.bag/index.html)

"You might not believe this -- you might not want to believe this -- but over the past decade, Miami has had fewer player arrests or NCAA-related incidents than almost any other major program in the country. Miami has not had 20-plus incidents involving shoplifting, assault, gun charges and failed drug tests over the past two years, as Tennessee has. Miami has not had to dismiss a star player for earning money through a phony job, as Oklahoma has. Miami has not had a star linebacker accused of sexual assault on the eve of its bowl game as Florida State did last year. And Miami's most recent Academic Progress Rate (956) placed it in the top 20 to 30 percent of all Division I football programs."

[EersSkins05]

And here's Mandal refuting your arguments about Miami:

Mandel's article about the U (http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2006/writers/stewart_mandel/10/18/mandel.bag/index.html)

"You might not believe this -- you might not want to believe this -- but over the past decade, Miami has had fewer player arrests or NCAA-related incidents than almost any other major program in the country. Miami has not had 20-plus incidents involving shoplifting, assault, gun charges and failed drug tests over the past two years, as Tennessee has. Miami has not had to dismiss a star player for earning money through a phony job, as Oklahoma has. Miami has not had a star linebacker accused of sexual assault on the eve of its bowl game as Florida State did last year. And Miami's most recent Academic Progress Rate (956) placed it in the top 20 to 30 percent of all Division I football programs."

What's that got to do with two on-field fights and coming very close to instigating another at Louisville?

THAT's the black eye.

(Edit- that's all since January.)

[DarthSidious]

That was in response to you implying that VT and Miami do not have academic standards, recruiting standards, etc. compared to the likes of UVA, UNC,etc.

[The Evil Genius]

Try to hide the smirk on your face, TEG.

This article is ridiculous. Speaking of raiding conferences, what happens when the NFL does it? See ACC 2006. When 51 of your best players are snatched up, the level of play tends to......well....level out.

I'm not worried in the least. With any huge project such as ACC Expansion, there are going to be growing pains. Regardless, for the rest of time, VT will be in a top-notch conference rather than rotting in mediocrity with the likes of South Florida and Cincinnatti.

The guy who wrote this (who is he, and why do I care what some writer from a obscure newspaper in South Carolina thinks?) sounds like a NYT "journalist" proclaiming defeat for the U.S. after only a short three years. Where will the ACC be in 3 years, 5 years, 50 years? Again, I'm not worried in the LEAST.

All teams have down years. FSU's downfall started well before ACC expansion was even in the works. Three years ago, nobody could've foreseen Coker steering UM's ship to the bottom of the ocean. VT is suffering through it's own growing pains as a very young team battling a slug-fest conference and is preparing for '08 and '09. This conference will be back and with a vengeance.

I'll be interested to see WVU's transition when they lose White and Slaton. If you think everything will be hunky dorey because of the genius that is RRod, you're in for a rude awakening.

Anyway, WVU nation would LOVE to be in this conference even today but you know you never will. So what do you do? Search for obscure articles from remote locations in some lame attempt to say, "I told you so." Please, if the ACC invited WVU to join the party, your AD would ditch the Big East in a heartbeat.

Even at the ACC's absolute worst and the Big East's absolute best which seems to be the case this year, the ACC is still in better shape.

Then, now, always.

:laugh: It's ok, we can't all be as good in football as Wake Forest.

BTW - do you still think you are on par or better than the SEC? As was the claims of many ACC elitists. You know, the same people who claimed the Big East would shrivel up and die without VPI, The "M" - that's for you Theisman!, and BC.

[SkinsHokieFan]

:laugh: It's ok, we can't all be as good in football as Wake Forest.

BTW - do you still think you are on par or better than the SEC? As was the claims of many ACC elitists. You know, the same people who claimed the Big East would shrivel up and die without VPI, The "M" - that's for you Theisman!, and BC.


Well, if college football had ended at the end of the 2004 season, yes

If CFB ends at the end of 2006, then Trainedgeese apologists will come off looking ok

But of course, like draft picks, you need several years to see the true impact.

[The Evil Genius]

Well, if college football had ended at the end of the 2004 season, yes

If CFB ends at the end of 2006, then Trainedgeese apologists will come off looking ok

But of course, like draft picks, you need several years to see the true impact.


...what constitutes several years? Remember, this is a conference whose top team beat teh SEC's top team in a BCS bowl last year. And if (which is still a big if) the BE puts 2 teams into the BCS this year - something that the ACC hasn't done...ever...what does one say then?

[Prosperity]

yeah yeah yeah, take your shots now while you still can

[The Evil Genius]

Take my shots?

I haven't even started. Trust me, this is nothing compared to the people who thumbed their nose at the BE the past 3 years.

If anything, it's karma.

:D

[SkinsHokieFan]

...what constitutes several years? Remember, this is a conference whose top team beat teh SEC's top team in a BCS bowl last year. And if (which is still a big if) the BE puts 2 teams into the BCS this year - something that the ACC hasn't done...ever...what does one say then?


Well there are 2 extra BCS teams this year ;), had this been the case last year the ACC would have certainly had 2 teams in the BCS. And your precious conference went 1-3 in the bowl games and only had a measley 13 players drafted

So once again, apples and oranges

Several years would mean more then 3 years, and if all things were equal

I.E you guys play no conference championship game, there are only 8 teams, AND we are only half way through the season. Crowing now is absolutley silly considering Pitt and Rutgers could end up with those BCS spots you love to speak about

Lets give it till the end of the decade, kapeesh? Plenty of data at that point

[The Evil Genius]

Well there are 2 more extra BCS teams this year ;)

So once again, apples and oranges

Which makes it even more comical that the ACC can't place 2 teams in...especially since they have 4 more teams to start with.

:silly:

[SkinsHokieFan]

Which makes it even more comical that the ACC can't place 2 teams in...especially since they have 4 more teams to start with.

:silly:


Just shows everyone is gonna beat up on each other. Hell, we may end up with a 4 way tie for a title at the end of the year like the BEFC did in 2004 :laugh:

[The Evil Genius]

Just shows everyone is gonna beat up on each other. Hell, we may end up with a 4 way tie for a title at the end of the year like the BEFC did in 2004 :laugh:

I have blocked 2004 from my mind. :D

Rasheed Marshall...........shudder.

[Eagles_Legendz]

:laugh: It's ok, we can't all be as good in football as Wake Forest.



A truer statement has never been written. :D

I am enjoying the season that the smallest Division IA school is putting together though.

And I do agree with Eers. There are many programs in the ACC (specifically the four that he mentioned---Duke,WFU,UNC,UVA) that pride themselves on academics and graduation rates, as well as select few recruiting violations. They've never really meshed in a conference with FSU and the additions of VT and Miami add schools that are certainly closer to FSU in this regard than the four aforementioned.

[DarthSidious]

I have blocked 2004 from my mind. :D

Rasheed Marshall...........shudder.

Interesting. I thought you WVU fans loved Rasheed Marshall. :laugh:

[PleaseBlitz]

Is it just me or it this the wrong week for VT and ACC fans to be talking any smack whatsoever?

[SkinsHokieFan]

Is it just me or it this the wrong week for VT and ACC fans to be talking any smack whatsoever?


Whose talking smack :whoknows:

BEFC 2004 having 4 way tie and a horrid Pitt team in BCS=fact

ACC 2006 suckin ass= fact

Not sure where the smack is?

[PleaseBlitz]

Trying reading the thread again. You'll find it.

[PleaseBlitz]

Try to hide the smirk on your face, TEG.

This article is ridiculous. Speaking of raiding conferences, what happens when the NFL does it? See ACC 2006. When 51 of your best players are snatched up, the level of play tends to......well....level out.

I'm not worried in the least. With any huge project such as ACC Expansion, there are going to be growing pains. Regardless, for the rest of time, VT will be in a top-notch conference rather than rotting in mediocrity with the likes of South Florida and Cincinnatti.

USF and Cincinnatti are a lot better than Duke and UNC.

The guy who wrote this (who is he, and why do I care what some writer from a obscure newspaper in South Carolina thinks?) sounds like a NYT "journalist" proclaiming defeat for the U.S. after only a short three years. Where will the ACC be in 3 years, 5 years, 50 years? Again, I'm not worried in the LEAST.

You should be. The Florida schools are both in freefall and both are about to lose their coaches. When that happens, the ACC becomes VERY mediocre.

All teams have down years. FSU's downfall started well before ACC expansion was even in the works. Three years ago, nobody could've foreseen Coker steering UM's ship to the bottom of the ocean. VT is suffering through it's own growing pains as a very young team battling a slug-fest conference and is preparing for '08 and '09. This conference will be back and with a vengeance.

Yep, all teams have down years. Expect to get ribbed for it on an internet message board.

I'll be interested to see WVU's transition when they lose White and Slaton. If you think everything will be hunky dorey because of the genius that is RRod, you're in for a rude awakening.

So you arent worried about VT in the middle of a down year, but you expect WVU to be in big trouble sometime 3 years down the line. :laugh:

I'll live in the here and now and enjoy this #4 ranking, thanks.

Anyway, WVU nation would LOVE to be in this conference even today but you know you never will. So what do you do? Search for obscure articles from remote locations in some lame attempt to say, "I told you so." Please, if the ACC invited WVU to join the party, your AD would ditch the Big East in a heartbeat.

Even at the ACC's absolute worst and the Big East's absolute best which seems to be the case this year, the ACC is still in better shape.

Then, now, always.

I wouldnt want WVU to join the ACC. If you think the ACC is in better shape than the BE this year, you are high.

[hokie4redskins]

You should be. The Florida schools are both in freefall and both are about to lose their coaches. When that happens, the ACC becomes VERY mediocre.

You think Bobby Bowden is getting fired? Who's high? The great thing about the ACC is its depth. FSU will no longer dominate this conference year in an year out as they did prior to expansion. If FSU, VT, and UM struggle, we have teams like GT and Clemson who are stepping up. Just like you have Rutgers stepping up. :laugh:


I wouldnt want WVU to join the ACC.

PB, King of De Nile. You'd donate a kidney if it meant the ACC extended an invitation to WVU. And you know this.

We'll see who's in better shape at the end of the year.

[PleaseBlitz]

You think Bobby Bowden is getting fired? Who's high? The great thing about the ACC is its depth. FSU will no longer dominate this conference year in an year out as they did prior to expansion. If FSU, VT, and UM struggle, we have teams like GT and Clemson who are stepping up. Just like you have Rutgers stepping up. :laugh:

Who said Bowden is getting fired? READ what i wrote. Florida schools will be losing their coaches. Bowden is nearly 80 years old. He aint sticking around forever.


PB, King of De Nile. You'd donate a kidney if it meant the ACC extended an invitation to WVU. And you know this.




:laugh:


Seriously, youve bought WAY too far into the talk from 3 years ago about how the ACC would be such and such and be some dominant conference. NEWSFLASH! It aint happened. The ACC looks like :pooh: right now, both for on the field performance in games, and all the other shenanigans. And looking at WVU over the past 2 years, I cant see how we could be in any better shape.

I WOULD like to play VT every year still, but as for joining the ACC, no thanks.

[SkinsHokieFan]

Seriously, youve bought WAY too far into the talk from 3 years ago about how the ACC would be such and such and be some dominant conference. NEWSFLASH! It aint happened. The ACC looks like :pooh: right now, both for on the field performance in games, and all the other shenanigans. And looking at WVU over the past 2 years, I cant see how we could be in any better shape.


PB, you keep forgetting, its all about the benjamins baby, the benjamins

The ACC has them, the BEFC won't. Thats it, all about the money baby, the money!!!!!!!!!! :laugh:

And yes, after half a season in 2006, any proclamations are premature. Just like they were after the 2004 season when the BEFC got pooped on with a silly 4 way tie and Pitt getting crushed by a mid major in its BCS game. And just like last year when the BEFC went 1-3 in bowl play and had a meager 13 players drafted.

6 games, guys, 6 games. Half a season remaining this year, and unless college football is ending after this season, plenty of time to evaluate this argument.

[The Evil Genius]

PB, you keep forgetting, its all about the benjamins baby, the benjamins

The ACC has them, the BEFC won't. Thats it, all about the money baby, the money!!!!!!!!!! :laugh:

And yes, after half a season in 2006, any proclamations are premature. Just like they were after the 2004 season when the BEFC got pooped on with a silly 4 way tie and Pitt getting crushed by a mid major in its BCS game. And just like last year when the BEFC went 1-3 in bowl play and had a meager 13 players drafted.

6 games, guys, 6 games. Half a season remaining this year, and unless college football is ending after this season, plenty of time to evaluate this argument.

I can't see how placing 2 out of 8 teams in the BCS (if should happen if the other one is 11-1) would be financially harmful to the BE. The BE is looking at 5-7 bowl teams this year, which is not too bad considering people around here wanted to bury the conference less than 2 years ago.

:)

[EersSkins05]

PB, you keep forgetting, its all about the benjamins baby, the benjamins

The ACC has them, the BEFC won't. Thats it, all about the money baby, the money!!!!!!!!!! :laugh:

And yes, after half a season in 2006, any proclamations are premature. Just like they were after the 2004 season when the BEFC got pooped on with a silly 4 way tie and Pitt getting crushed by a mid major in its BCS game. And just like last year when the BEFC went 1-3 in bowl play and had a meager 13 players drafted.

6 games, guys, 6 games. Half a season remaining this year, and unless college football is ending after this season, plenty of time to evaluate this argument.

When exactly are these benjamins going to mean anything to me as a fan? "Wow, VT sure is making alot of money. I wish we were in their shoes instead of ranked #4 in the nation and making slightly less."

[PleaseBlitz]

When exactly are these benjamins going to mean anything to me as a fan? "Wow, VT sure is making alot of money. I wish we were in their shoes instead of ranked #4 in the nation and making slightly less."


Thank you. When schools start paying a quarterly dividend to their fans based on operating income, ill start giving a **** about money.


Meantime, Ill be happy with winning games. :)

[skinshooligan]

The ACC has the same amount of ranked teams than the Big East. Boston College is ranked and they were in the Big East 2 years ago. The ACC is getting better with those schools being in the conference. Next year a lot of ACC schools will be ranked high.

[Diggs]

The ACC is getting better with those schools being in the conference. Next year a lot of ACC schools will be ranked high.

Based on what?
Miami and FSU are at an all-time low.
BC is a solid but never spectacular team/program.
VT is a mess right now.
Duke still sucks.
UNC is about to fire their coach.


Some people claim that ACC is the deepest conference? Deep with what?

[PleaseBlitz]

The ACC has the same amount of ranked teams than the Big East. Boston College is ranked and they were in the Big East 2 years ago. The ACC is getting better with those schools being in the conference. Next year a lot of ACC schools will be ranked high.

In football? :laugh:

[SkinsHokieFan]

Based on what?
Miami and FSU are at an all-time low.
BC is a solid but never spectacular team/program.
VT is a mess right now.
Duke still sucks.
UNC is about to fire their coach.


Some people claim that ACC is the deepest conference? Deep with what?


FSU and Miami have sr laden lineups next year, and will ALWAYS have talent. My guess is whoever replaces Coker will get a lot more out of those byos

VT a mess? 2 losses a mess? :laugh: Some us saw this season coming and aren't surprised. Lost too much talent from last year

BC will be a top 20 team

Clemson will be top 20 next year

VT, Miami and FSU will be top 20 next year

Wake is improving (hey you guys point at RUTGERS)

After losing 51 players to the NFL draft, 13 in the first round, this year is no surprise for anyone paying attention. I predicted VT going 9-3 to start the year, probably will end up 8-4, so one game off isn't the end of the world

[PleaseBlitz]

FSU and Miami have sr laden lineups next year, and will ALWAYS have talent. My guess is whoever replaces Coker will get a lot more out of those byos

VT a mess? 2 losses a mess? :laugh: Some us saw this season coming and aren't surprised. Lost too much talent from last year

BC will be a top 20 team

Clemson will be top 20 next year

VT, Miami and FSU will be top 20 next year

Wake is improving (hey you guys point at RUTGERS)

After losing 51 players to the NFL draft, 13 in the first round, this year is no surprise for anyone paying attention. I predicted VT going 9-3 to start the year, probably will end up 8-4, so one game off isn't the end of the world


No offense SHF, but your predictions havent been too good so far this year. ;)

[SkinsHokieFan]

No offense SHF, but your predictions havent been too good so far this year. ;)


Actually, besides the Louisville-Miami game, I have been spot on

You actually mocked me for picking VT to go 9-3. :laugh:

Well its time to get back on track, heading out to Champps in Reston to see us beat Southern Miss. Hey, they could help your SOS, PB, you might want to schedule them next year :laugh:

[PleaseBlitz]

Actually, besides the Louisville-Miami game, I have been spot on

You actually mocked me for picking VT to go 9-3. :laugh:

Well its time to get back on track, heading out to Champps in Reston to see us beat Southern Miss. Hey, they could help your SOS, PB, you might want to schedule them next year :laugh:


Hey, maybe you guys will get a win in October after all. :laugh:

[PleaseBlitz]

Wake is improving (hey you guys point at RUTGERS)


Well, Wake is surprising some people this year, but you have to admit that Rutgers, although not quite there yet, will be legit. GS finally has his program where he needs it. Just get a stud QB to lead the team and they will be a force. My how times change.

[skinshooligan]

Wake is a young team

[SkinsHokieFan]

Well, Wake is surprising some people this year, but you have to admit that Rutgers, although not quite there yet, will be legit. GS finally has his program where he needs it. Just get a stud QB to lead the team and they will be a force. My how times change.


You really think Rutgers is legit? It depends how you define legit I guess, because I did see Rutgers have a tough game against UNC to start the year. Honestly they have looked good against weaker and comprable competition, I am curious to see how they do against big boys

And I am real curious to see how long GS stays at Rutgers. There is going to be an open position in Miami this offseason, and the UNC job is going to come avaliable. What is interesting is if UNC actually gave a damn about its football program, it could become a giant. They have the money and facilities but everyone cares about bball at UNC

[PleaseBlitz]

Well Duke is obviously an up and coming team. They nearly beat Miami. :laugh:

Speaks to the DEPTH of the ACC right?

[DarthSidious]

Well Duke is obviously an up and coming team. They nearly beat Miami. :laugh:

Speaks to the DEPTH of the ACC right?

I think the depth the poster was talking about is the emergence of Clemson, WF, BC, and to a lesser extent GT. The experts pegged FSU or Miami to be the ACC champion in the preseason. While Miami still has a shot at that, FSU does not. Seems the ACC is developing its football programs outside of the usual FSU/Miami/VT. And that's the depth for the conference that's being developed for the long term. With that depth, it could mean good things in the future. Look at the SEC, the deepest conference in the nation. Though a gautlet of teams, its hard to go undefeated, but the games are exciting b/c of it.:2cents: As for Duke, every conference has one terrible team.

[PleaseBlitz]

I think the depth the poster was talking about is the emergence of Clemson, WF, BC, and to a lesser extent GT. The experts pegged FSU or Miami to be the ACC champion in the preseason. While Miami still has a shot at that, FSU does not. Seems the ACC is developing its football programs outside of the usual FSU/Miami/VT. And that's the depth for the conference that's being developed for the long term. With that depth, it could mean good things in the future. Look at the SEC, the deepest conference in the nation. Though a gautlet of teams, its hard to go undefeated, but the games are exciting b/c of it.:2cents: As for Duke, every conference has one terrible team.

I was just making a joke about how bad Miami is this year.

If Miami is the ACC champion this year, it will look REALLY bad for the conference from several angles.

[DarthSidious]

I was just making a joke about how bad Miami is this year.

If Miami is the ACC champion this year, it will look REALLY bad for the conference from several angles.

You should root for Miami to be the ACC champion b/c Louisville beat them earlier in the year and if WVU beats Louisville, that victory that Louisville got over the U can only help your strength of schedule in the BCS. Could be the difference in being in the championship game or not. :2cents:

You say it would look bad for the conference, but by saying that, wouldn't it make Louisville's victory against Miami worthless?

[PleaseBlitz]

You should root for Miami to be the ACC champion b/c Louisville beat them earlier in the year and if WVU beats Louisville, that victory that Louisville got over the U can only help your strength of schedule in the BCS. Could be the difference in being in the championship game or not. :2cents:

You say it would look bad for the conference, but by saying that, wouldn't it make Louisville's victory against Miami worthless?


I know. Im "rooting" for Miami to do as well as possible for that reason, but they just arent that good this year, so i dont have much faith in the Miami win holding much weight at this point. I mean, they arent ranked now and have embarrassed themselves in their past 2 games.

I HOPE Miami wins the damn ACC, so when WVU gets screwed out of the BCS championship, we can demolish Miami in a BCS game. (Though im not sure if that is possible with the conference/bowl agreements. :whoknows: ) That cant happen. Can it?