I have a feeling Lloyd might not be back...

[gca61087]

Sorry for another Lloyd thread, and search isn't working for me.

Here are the reasons I believe he won't be back...

1. Let's face it, he has been a bust. Whether it's because he isn't getting open, or because he isn't being seen, Lloyd has hardly produced at all. Season ticket holders/film guys give me some help here.

2. His attitude. Gibbs is a guy who appreciates character, and I have a feeling Lloyd's outbursts on the sideline didn't go over well with Joe. As a competitor myself, I know the guy is mad that his team is losing, but helmet throwing and stuff like that shows an attitude problem.

3. We are lacking a true possesion reciever. I think Lloyd was an overachieving #2 in SF who caught everyone's attention with his highlight reel catches. I don't see him as a true possesion reciever; a guy you can count on take the hit on 3rd and 5 over the middle on a slant and move the chains.

As for who we can get to help in that respect, however, I am at a loss. We have that in Cooley, but I think we need it at wideout too.

I love the guy's ability to make the acrobatic catch, and I would love to see him progress, but I don't see where he fits in here. He hasn't proven to be the reliable #2 we need opposite Moss, and we have a great #3 and special-teamer in Randle-El. Lloyd is a project WR, and based on the past impatience of the front office I wouldn't be surprised to see him gone as early as this offseason.

If we can work out the cap hit, I think it is a done deal.

[Lil Kenzo]

At times I see him in a skins' uniform, and at other times I don't.

This season has just been a disaster from top to bottom and I am at a loss for words. No, Lloyd has not lived up to expectations but I think that now that Jason Cmapbell is starting and they will have a full off-season to work together, Lloyd might be in for a turnaround and be able to produce.

However, sometimes I think that he is a mini-TO and will cause problems in the lockerroom with his character. Will he spit in another players face, accidently overdose on pills, state to the press that he falls alseep during coaches speeches? No, not likely. But he will gripe about his role in the offense and show that he is not a Gibbs guy.

[bulldog]

can't dump Lloyd in 2007, there are too many other moves to cover for that are going to take up cap dollars...........releasing Archuleta and some of the older players on defense, etc...............

[deejaydana]

This is just ANOTHER case of the "ad hoc" Front Office not doing its due diligence before breaking out the check book. He had alienated himself w/more than a few Niners players when he was there, we never should have inked the fool to begin with. Good riddance.

[HOF44]

I think Lloyd will be around and maybe even have a decent year. He does get open more than people give him credit for. The thing that worries me most about him are his hands. We do not need another 50/50. I think when he and Campbell get some time together over the offseason he could have a pretty good year.

[isle-hawg]

I agree with your points and don't claim to be an expert IRT the CAP hit we would take for Lloyd should we cut him this year, but most of the contracts DS makes are extremely backloaded making Lloyd a relative bargain to keep next year and very expensive to cut. Considering the needs we have for a pass rusher, MLB and cornerbacks combined with only 1 first day draft pick, and absorbing the huge cap hit we will take when AA is cut I don't see the FO getting rid of Lloyd this offseason. If they were going to do that IMO he would of already been keeping AA company on the bench these past few games.

[gca61087]

This is just ANOTHER case of the "ad hoc" Front Office not doing its due diligence before breaking out the check book. He had alienated himself w/more than a few Niners players when he was there, we never should have inked the fool to begin with. Good riddance.

It is a well known fact that we aren't very good at evaluating talent, and now character. I think that kind of info would be harder to come by though.

[skinsrbeast]

hes gettin paid wont go anywhere

[gca61087]

but most of the contracts DS makes are extremely backloaded making Lloyd a relative bargain to keep next year and very expensive to cut.

yeah most NFL contracts are made like that. i wouldn't mind us keeping lloyd, i would love to see him progress. i wouldn't be surprised either way.

[Mercuryrising]

This is just ANOTHER case of the "ad hoc" Front Office not doing its due diligence before breaking out the check book. He had alienated himself w/more than a few Niners players when he was there, we never should have inked the fool to begin with. Good riddance.

I agree. Talk to any Niner fan from season ticket holder to 15 yo kid and they will respond to our gripes about Lloyd with: "...and you didn't know this before you traded for him?" or "is that supposed to be new? He always made the crazy catch, then dropped the next 4 easy ones...."

Oh well what can we do but love our skins?

[JWB]

I think Lloyd deserves another year. He wasn't given enough chances to prove himself. Even Santana only has 49 catches...

[kwitt]

I think Lloyd deserves another year. He wasn't given enough chances to prove himself. Even Santana only has 49 catches...
:doh:

[Capt. Jack]

I think Lloyd will be given next season. If he improves and becomes a solid #2 reciever, then he will stay. If he continues to struggle, then he will probably be let go after next season. It would be silly to cut Lloyd after one season full of quarterback inconsistency.

[goofyreba]

maybe it's just me but i think his outburst is just what Joe wants from this team. He will deff be back I hope!

[Uno Boss]

I agree. Talk to any Niner fan from season ticket holder to 15 yo kid and they will respond to our gripes about Lloyd with: "...and you didn't know this before you traded for him?" or "is that supposed to be new? He always made the crazy catch, then dropped the next 4 easy ones...."

Oh well what can we do but love our skins?


Thats the same thing we would have said to them about Walt Harris...:rolleyes:


Fair is Fair and as a #1 receiver Santana Claus Moss is stinking up the joint


he is not even in the top 45 in any catagory so why not cut him too?..:rolleyes:

[RedskinsFan72]

Its hard to evaluate talent when things are going so bad. When he was going deep, Brunell was throwing a -5 yard pass. Granted he has dropped balls, maybe he just cant get open, but with how bad the offense was this year, its virtually impossible to tell.

Keep him as a 3rd or 4th receiver, we'll still need a solid number 2, since Patten most likely will be cut, and Randel El isnt much a of #2.

I say bring in Steve Harris, Jimmy Farris or Mike Espy to try, they did fairly well in preseason.

[RedzoneHunter]

It's way too early to close the book on Brandon Lloyd. I believe he will be a keeper. No doubt, his athletic ability is there. The problem is, that he was forced to go back to square one in learning a new system this year. And the entire offense struggled to learn this new system, and it was frustrating.

When you think about it, none of the free agents that were brought in this year had great seasons, although Randle El proved that he was more mature and prepared himself better. Some players need to go thru a humbling experience before they learn to get their head right. I think Gibbs is doing the right thing by demoting Lloyd, and in the end, this will be a great motivating tool for Brandon. Some people actually need a fire lit under their butt to get them pointed in the right direction.

Brandon is so young and the big fat contract he signed could have gone to his head? Now we will see what he is made of. He's gonna have to work diligently to crack the starting line up, but I still believe he has it in him. He's gonna be a good one!

[Chris Worthy]

When Lloyd put up crazy numbers next year AFTER he works out with Jason this off-season I want to see the same amount of positive Lloyd threads as the neg ones around here. I see him working real hard to get his routes down and his rapore with Jason down tight. I also see him attending the McNabb camp with Jason.

The thing that stands out with me is Jason having to go to Miami to work out with Moss. I understand the whole U-crew only working out together but Moss also have been dropping balls. Hell Portis can come as well...lol

Moss, Jason, ARE and Lloyd need to go off somewhere on there own and get it together. They all showed their unhappiness when the ball wasnt coming their way. Now they have a guy that wants to get better and make them better.

Get it done and support all your WR's

[RabidFan]

Lloyd will be back and will be good if not great when Saunders opens up the whole playbook with Campbell having his time this year and all offseason....we are going to be explosive!!!

[One Shot]

You must give these players who have been doubted this year one more year (with the exception of AA). After the 2007 season, the Front Office will truly be able to evaluate who belongs and who doesn't.

[lavredskin56]

lloyd will definetly be back. we cant afford getting new players into our system. This team has done this to many times, we get players who havent performed up to expectations, then we go out and get new guys. We need to keep our players in the system so they get used to it and form a good chemistry with the team. Until this happens, i dont see the redskins being a good team in back to back seasons.

[darrell1106]

I wonder what would be considered a good showing for the first year for a receiver w/ two completely different quarterbacks to skins fans? We're 5-10 and had a rough season all around. When did we all of a sudden give guys one year under these conditions to prove their worth and if things don't work out just cut them?

The guy is much better than what we had last year and I believe will turn out to be a descent number 2 receiver...JEESH!

And AA will be back. Just too much money to eat for nothing...IMO.

[Chick_in_B&G]

I know Lloyd has dropped some catchable balls, but the guy is simply not thrown to enough. Now, that could be due to the fact that he doesn't get enough separation, but Campbell didn't even try throwing to him at all in St. Louis. I would think Moss would be drawing the double coverages, so that would mean Lloyd would have to be open sometime. :( I'm hoping the chemistry will improve in the offseason.

[Doctorfro]

I think he'll be back. The STAFF needs to figure out how to get that many footballs on the field for all these playmakers. Lloyd is OK and probably not worth all that money but he does hold value and can be productive if we actually throw his way!

[TaylorPickSix]

Give him another year then see what happens.
Archuleta should be given another year too but he has more of a chance at leaving than Lloyd

[BuryYourDuke]

It's way too early to close the book on Brandon Lloyd. I believe he will be a keeper. No doubt, his athletic ability is there. The problem is, that he was forced to go back to square one in learning a new system this year. And the entire offense struggled to learn this new system, and it was frustrating.



I never played in an NFL system, but learning a system as a wide receiver is probably the easiest thing in the world. Here is your route. Run it. Get open. Catch the ball if it is thrown to you. Block for guys if it is not. The hardest thing is learning to read defenses enough to pick your route on options.

With that said, I think he deserves another year to improve.

[TD Riggo]

Lloyd HAS been open, numerous times. Unfortunately, Jason throws to a triple-covered Santana instead. Which tells me that there may be a significant flaw in either Jason's ability to check off his receivers, or more likely, a flaw in Al Saunders playbook. Because JC is doing similar throws as Brunell did.

Now .. I am NOT saying we should return to Brunell as QB, because Jason is the future. I am also NOT saying that Jason has an inability to check off receivers that cannot be fixed. In actuality, reading receivers in the NFL is an acquired skill that comes with getting more starts. It also comes with getting more mid-week practice as the starter which Jason has only been getting since the BYE. A good offseason and training camp with Jason at the helm will change things dramatically.

Now .. what does all this have to do with Lloyd? The fact that Jason WILL have to spread the ball around among his receivers, instead of what both Jason AND Brunell have been doing all season (and much of last) and that is throwing almost every pass to Santana.

Lloyd ain't going anywhere. He has been open on many plays, as has ARE, but our QB's will only throw to Santana or Cooley. The few throws to Lloyd that HAVE been made have often been poor throws .. often too high or at his feet, or behind him. Jason has a cannon, but he needs to get more finesse and more control on his throws. THAT is the problem with our passing game.

[luckydevil]

They are not going to cut Lloyd and Adam Archuleta in the same offseason. But it is clear his tenure will be short here, unless he has good year next year ( which is unlikely). The truth is our wr core isn't all that much better than it was last offseason.

[NAILBOMB9]

Wow!! AA and Lloyd have it made!!! Got paid one year and get to get out the next and probably sign for alot less on an actual good team that has SB hopes. Where have I seen this before...???

[Uno Boss]

I wonder what would be considered a good showing for the first year for a receiver w/ two completely different quarterbacks to skins fans? We're 5-10 and had a rough season all around. When did we all of a sudden give guys one year under these conditions to prove their worth and if things don't work out just cut them?

The guy is much better than what we had last year and I believe will turn out to be a descent number 2 receiver...JEESH!

And AA will be back. Just too much money to eat for nothing...IMO.



If the guy came here and scored 10 TD's and 1000 yards it would not be enough because he is not a draft pick or a character "redskins guy"...:rolleyes:


Like I said we have a historic franchise but our fans are short sighted and most of them are guilty of what they accuse the front office of doing...

Not being patient...

[gca61087]

i pretty much agree with all of you. i'm glad only one person tried to indicate that i wanted to get rid of lloyd, because that wasn't the point.

i would love to see lloyd progress in the offseason into next season. he will have his chance for sure with a year in the system and a quarterback who can throw down the field to work with.

i'm just worried about our hot-headed and quick to act FO trying to deal him somehow. don't dismiss any stupid action as beyond them.

[Lombardi's_kid_brother]

If the guy came here and scored 10 TD's and 1000 yards it would not be enough because he is not a draft pick or a character "redskins guy"...:rolleyes:


Like I said we have a historic franchise but our fans are short sighted and most of them are guilty of what they accuse the front office of doing...

Not being patient...

Does Lloyd have 1000 yards receiving in his career yet?

My issue with him is that he has been in the league 4 years and has produced NOTHING.

[andyburd]

Loyd = DEAD WEIGHT

[TLusby]

Crazy!! Lloyd never got the opportunities. He's open every play on my TIVO screen! How has Moss done this year; 600+ yards??? Everyone of our WR's have had a poor season because of MB's dump off to the back play, and then the change to JC which is a week to week learning process. Lloyd is a stud waiting to make a decent run. How are you a bust when you have only had 30 or so balls thrown to you? Please don't say he's not open because he beats his man by 2-3 steps every pattern.

[Lombardi's_kid_brother]

Crazy!! Lloyd never got the opportunities. He's open every play on my TIVO screen! How has Moss done this year; 600+ yards??? Everyone of our WR's have had a poor season because of MB's dump off to the back play, and then the change to JC which is a week to week learning process. Lloyd is a stud waiting to make a decent run. How are you a bust when you have only had 30 or so balls thrown to you? Please don't say he's not open because he beats his man by 2-3 steps every pattern.

According to Football Outsiders, he's had 58 passes thrown his way this year.

[NVskinsfan]

Offensive struggles the first 12 games of the year...:doh: Then when we "start" putting things together, injuries hit the defense again and they are in the toilet.
We need to pull all facets of this tema together and look to what needs to be corrected and "who" needs to go!
Campbell will and needs to start this offseason getting a repoir with all the receivers to make the offense a success!!! :D

[Uno Boss]

According to Football Outsiders, he's had 58 passes thrown his way this year.


Mother of God if people dont stop with that awful stat.....


If i throw the ball out of bounds and its in your direction that counts as in your direction so that stat is way of and not a good judge of what really goes on....


the stats say Warick Holdman is our 4th best defensive player ...
You watched the games this year tell me how true is that...:doh:

[stuck_N_virginia]

I say we keep him. I can definitely see potential in him especially when JC and him get together in the off season to get the patterns and the rythym thing down...

[waterwagen]

I don't understand wanting to cut him. When he's gotten the ball thrown his way, he has made plays. All of a sudden he showed up when Campbell got in the game. Plus he's in a new offense. I think it would be crazy to cut him after only one year - he's not Arch Deluxe.

[lavredskin56]

he was probably a bust with brunell behind center only because hes new and brunell always threw to cooley and moss because he formed a good chemistry from previos seasons. Just give it some time, not everything develops as fast as us skins fans would like them to.

[Lombardi's_kid_brother]

the stats say Warick Holdman is our 4th best defensive player ...
You watched the games this year tell me how true is that...:doh:

No they don't. They show him as our fifth-leading tackler...and still only 2 ahead of Archuleta - which is simply amazing. But tackles alone don't show you what kind of defender someone is. They are like wins for pitchers in baseball - a stat that everyone loves, but which is almost completely void of meaning.

No one has come up with a great stat for defenders yet, at least not one that I have found.

[JC girl]

I think Lloyd will be much better next year. This year we had Brunell, who only through to Betts, Cooley and occasionally Santana, and the Campbell who is just being asked to manage games and doesn't quite have his time right with any of the receivers, usually throwing over or under them.

And with the helmit throwing, at least he is passionate and wants to win, and is showing some fire, which seems to be lacking from most of the other players on this team.

I think working with Campbell over the offseason, as for all of the receivers, will greatly improve this offense, and allowing it to open up and go down the field more will be great to see once we get this playbook down and Gibbs and Saunders figure out a way to mesh two versions of an offense. Should be exciting to see IMO. It's what should happened this year...

[Hooper]

The guy is a complete punk. Everyone knew it except the skins front office apparently.

He'll be back -- only because after releasing our other disastrous signing, we can't afford to release Lloyd.

[str8jacket]

I think he is one that deserves another shot. I am really hoping that with Campbell coming in as a starter next year and hopefully maturing that this offense can really open up and get it to Lloyd and all the receivers. I know he has the talent.

[TLusby]

According to Football Outsiders, he's had 58 passes thrown his way this year.


...and how many of those were actually catchable? 30??

[Lombardi's_kid_brother]

...and how many of those were actually catchable? 30??

Catchable is in the eye of the beholder, isn't it? If Lloyd ran the wrong route and the ball went to the place he was supposed to be, it looks like the QB over-threw him.

Anyway, there is a reason he's been benched.

[Uno Boss]

The guy is a complete punk. Everyone knew it except the skins front office apparently.

He'll be back -- only because after releasing our other disastrous signing, we can't afford to release Lloyd.

What is a punk

[monkforhall]

Catchable is in the eye of the beholder, isn't it? If Lloyd ran the wrong route and the ball went to the place he was supposed to be, it looks like the QB over-threw him.

Anyway, there is a reason he's been benched.


True, but they through the ball away in his direction a lot. First row in the stands. Do they count that? I don't remember him getting that many legit shots. But the coaches have the tape, they know if he is running the right routes. I say give him this year, give Saunders this year, and give the whole offense this year. Next year once they get some cohesiveness down. Could be great. And they won't go into next year thinking that they are the next greatest show on turf. But they might need to be with all the holes on defense.

[phatboy41]

I see what some of you mean... sometimes I really can't see Lloyd as a Redskin and at other times I think he really can be a good receiver for this team. If we let him go, I'm not sure who'd fill his shoes... I love Randle El, but we would have the shortest receiving corps in the league. I think we need that one receiver who has good height to get up there and try to disrupt defenses.