Escalating misbehavior of some NFL players, what do you think ?

[FrFan]

Some facts out of many others :
In 2006 35 players were arrested on different charges, including 8 Bengals players.
Minnesota Vikings players were charged with misdemeanors for lewd conduct during a boat cruise.
Most recently see what's happening to Pacman Jones and Charles Sharon.
I'm starting this thread because it's seems to me that they are more and more players involved in criminal behavior.
They bring us joy and exitement on the football field and pandemonium on their family and relatives off the field.
They're making big bucks they got the fame but still screwing up with their life. It seems that there are too many things to handle for them: the fame, the $, the growing egos, the pressure.
Even though most of them don't do time, and there is some media hype around them, they should care about how children and fans perceive them. I think they have a responsability to be role models for kids.
I'm sure NFL teams do background checks on their future players before they enter the league, but does the league have some sort of counseling program ? Shall the league start kicking players out for a season ?
From the net : "The Bengals helped a local high school keep kids off the streets (and away from their players) by donating $250,000 to install artificial turf."

[flexxskins]

Wrong forum. :)

Good subject though.

[pvkeeper19]

Every time I see "[Player X] arrested for [Reason Y]" on NFL.com, I thank my lucky stars that it's not a Redskin's name. Then I shake my head because it's usually Chris Henry or Pacman.

I applaud the stance the NFL takes in dealing with these arrests, usually doling out suspensions and/or fines. But it seems that if the justice system's penalties for such actions aren't stiff enough to deter players from conducting themselves in such a manner, there's little else the NFL can do to stop them.

[pjfootballer]

Too much money, too little Brains.

[turbodiesel#44]

Too much money, too little Brains.

Dead on. Plus, I think cops are less likely to let things "slide" for the hometown sports hero these days.

[Siven]

Dead on. Plus, I think cops are less likely to let things "slide" for the hometown sports hero these days.

It's one thing if you are like, Lebron James, who is a good guy, who does a lot to help out the city of Cleveland, or a thug like Pacman.

I think cops might let it slide if you are someone good, oweing to the "In the wrong place at the wrong time" but if you are a repeat offender, even if you may be innocent, they will arrest you on suspicion.

[Chump Bailey]

It either is or it is just more visible because of the media coverage in sports and in general today I suppose. It's hurting the NBA according to some analysts - the All-Star game only amplified that sentiment I think.

The players are only human of course, but I still think they're more good guys than bad as a whole in the NFL. People are going to make mistakes of course, but in extreme cases as Pac-man's, I think an example must be made.

Pac-man would cease to be a Titan were the decision mine. I think most folks just want these guys to have some semblance of humility and appreciate what they have and where they are in life, to respect the game and themselves.

I think players should be made to visit a children's hospital from time to time for some perspective. Seeing a child with a terminal disease can do such things. I think about them when I start to feel sorry for myself and are upset with my current situation.:2cents:

[BuryYourDuke]

These athletes are products of our society. In a hip-hop culture that does nothing but glorify illegal drugs and violence, objectifies women, vilifies law enforcement, and tells people that making money is the only purpose of life, it cannot be surprising that these athletes emulate what they've grown up seeing and listening to in movies, tv, and music. I know Russel S. would just say it's a case of art reflecting life, and that is true, in the ghetto...but rather than telling the stories of what life is like on the streets and how to rise above it, the culture glorifies it and perpetuates it until it spreads to other portions of society.

[Loxley]

They should get booted out of the nfl imo. If a person is put on that much of a pedestal and then cant even stay out of trouble (a la Pacman) they should just be released by the club and ejected from the league.

Ok its a harsh thing to do but it would make others think twice in future about what theyre doing off the field.

[Lombardi's_kid_brother]

I honestly don't have an opinion on it. I know that is practically a sin on the Internets, but I don't.

Mainly, because I spend way way too much money on the NFL to then "tsk tsk" the players to whom I am essentially paying. And I simply can't imagine a point where I say "I'm not watching anymore."

I mean, yea, in a perfect world, I would prefer that PacMan Jones not shoot people. But aside from not watching him play, what should I do?

[Chanhillbilly]

All I know is that if I did what some of these guys have done (pac-man, henry, s. taylor, Ray Lewis), I'd still be looking through bars and trying my best not to drop the soap in the shower. I wouldn't have my job anymore or the opportunity to gain employment in the same field with another company. So, with that said.... Its sad that some of these guys litterally get away with murder.

[Cheers, Beers and Mountaineers]

Every time I see "[Player X] arrested for [Reason Y]" on NFL.com, I thank my lucky stars that it's not a Redskin's name. Then I shake my head because it's usually Chris Henry or Pacman.


just imagine how i feel when i see those two get arrested :doh:

[SPRINTxBOMB]

Wow... All of the immediate and incessant whining over my " Browns to the Superbowl " thread has somehow actually paid off for the countless " how dare you start a new thread " and the " I cant believe the Mods let you talk about poop "cry-babies around here... Unbelieveable.

It was a very legit thread. Not sure where in the rules it says that " Any and all humor will not be tolerated here at ES!!! "

Jeez... Lighten up guys.

[megared]

Some facts out of many others :
In 2006 35 players were arrested on different charges, including 8 Bengals players.
Minnesota Vikings players were charged with misdemeanors for lewd conduct during a boat cruise.
Most recently see what's happening to Pacman Jones and Charles Sharon.
I'm starting this thread because it's seems to me that they are more and more players involved in criminal behavior.
They bring us joy and exitement on the football field and pandemonium on their family and relatives off the field.
They're making big bucks they got the fame but still screwing up with their life. It seems that there are too many things to handle for them: the fame, the $, the growing egos, the pressure.
Even though most of them don't do time, and there is some media hype around them, they should care about how children and fans perceive them. I think they have a responsability to be role models for kids.
I'm sure NFL teams do background checks on their future players before they enter the league, but does the league have some sort of counseling program ? Shall the league start kicking players out for a season ?
From the net : "The Bengals helped a local high school keep kids off the streets (and away from their players) by donating $250,000 to install artificial turf."

35/1696 = 2.06% of the players in the NFL that got in trouble. Look around at your job, is that even a reflection upon society? I'm sure more than 2% of the people at your job have been/are currently/will be in some kind of legal trouble.

There's far more media coverage now to keep tabs on athletes. Without the internet, before sportscenter, other than the radio & newspaper, how were you going to hear about the things that an athlete does in his private time?

[kevin11]

Wow... All of the immediate and incessant whining over my " Browns to the Superbowl " thread has somehow actually paid off for the countless " how dare you start a new thread " and the " I cant believe the Mods let you talk about poop "cry-babies around here... Unbelieveable.

It was a very legit thread. Not sure where in the rules it says that " Any and all humor will not be tolerated here at ES!!! "

Jeez... Lighten up guys.Why don't you contribute something to the thread?

My thoughts is that the NFL is doing a decent job but they waited too long.

Also, these "criminals" are working for money for all their lives, especially the ones that grew up in a poor town. Once they get money, they start to party, some think they are above the law, and end up dead, arrested, or on espn. com with the main title "Player A got arrested in location a"

[laurent]

It's easy to pass judgement on those young guys, but very few understand the environment they grew up with and the pressure they're facing as a result of the company they kept and are still keeping.

Most of these athletes struggle with the concept of cutting off the hangers on and guys that enabled them a lifestyle they wouldn't have been able to afford before they became pros.

Ultimately guys like that have nobody to blame but themselves, but the league also carries some responsibility and should do a better job of working with those young men. The NFL and the teams have a real opportunity to make a difference here and I really hope they manage to reach young players before something serious happens.

[cmorina69]

Dead on. Plus, I think cops are less likely to let things "slide" for the hometown sports hero these days.

Agreed, i think they should go to jail like any other person. kick them out of the NFL too.

[FunBunch7]

35/1696 = 2.06% of the players in the NFL that got in trouble. Look around at your job, is that even a reflection upon society? I'm sure more than 2% of the people at your job have been/are currently/will be in some kind of legal trouble.

There's far more media coverage now to keep tabs on athletes. Without the internet, before sportscenter, other than the radio & newspaper, how were you going to hear about the things that an athlete does in his private time?

You make a perfect point here with the ratios...

I'm certainly no fan of some of the ludicrous acts made by players, but it is about "due process" of the law and just because someone is charged does not mean they should be deprived of going to work.

I think the NFL Rookie Symposium is the best thing the NFL does regarding off field behavior...the NFL brings in former and current NFL players and warns rookies about who they hang out with and where they hang out at and the possible consequences.

Obviously some of the "boys" remain just that though...

"You can take the boy out of the hood, but can't take the hood out of the boy."

[LoudMouth12thMan]

35/1696 = 2.06% of the players in the NFL that got in trouble. Look around at your job, is that even a reflection upon society? I'm sure more than 2% of the people at your job have been/are currently/will be in some kind of legal trouble.

There's far more media coverage now to keep tabs on athletes. Without the internet, before sportscenter, other than the radio & newspaper, how were you going to hear about the things that an athlete does in his private time?
Uhhh...yeah...8 players from one team in less than a full calendar year...bit of a red flag though don't cha' think? :laugh:

I see what you mean with "the 2% theory", but in recent days there are tougher restrictions being put on athletes that have conduct problems whether on/off the field, court, ring, ice, etc. These leagues have standards of conduct and I believe they need to continue to increase the penalties for idiots that behave like Mrs. Pacman, that Islanders idiot, and Marvin's Inmates :) :2cents:

[FunBunch7]

I honestly don't have an opinion on it. I know that is practically a sin on the Internets, but I don't.

Mainly, because I spend way way too much money on the NFL to then "tsk tsk" the players to whom I am essentially paying. And I simply can't imagine a point where I say "I'm not watching anymore."

I mean, yea, in a perfect world, I would prefer that PacMan Jones not shoot people. But aside from not watching him play, what should I do?

...Hmmm...be careful or you might be in danger of having an opinion...lol

But I here ya man...I feel the same way...I would prefer there be peace and harmony, but all I really care about is the Skins crossing the goal line...and I hope they don't kill anyone and have good lawyers...

[FrFan]

35/1696 = 2.06% of the players in the NFL that got in trouble. Look around at your job, is that even a reflection upon society? I'm sure more than 2% of the people at your job have been/are currently/will be in some kind of legal trouble.

There's far more media coverage now to keep tabs on athletes. Without the internet, before sportscenter, other than the radio & newspaper, how were you going to hear about the things that an athlete does in his private time?

No one at my job earn what they earn and lots of them don't have a high school education. I don't think you can compare this percentage to the all society, only to the most educated and wealthiest.
They know when they enter the League that they will become some kind of "TV stars". That's why they should me more careful about their behavior and image.
Some people don't have much in life (education, good living, money, support), they keep on struggling every day not to stumble.

[SkinsFTW]

Somehow I think that 35 number is a little low.

[stwasm]

What happens is that, all their lives, because they're athletes and can score a touchdown or make a tackle, they're emboldened to think that the rules of society don't apply to them. Then, when they get all the money and fame of the NFL, they forget what got them there and ignore the sacrifices their predecessors had to make for them to be where they are today. Additionally, they just don't relate to the blue-collar fans who can barely afford to attend games. It's sad and it's a ripple effect of escalating salaries.

[SkinsFTW]

Naa, they are just treated different by 99% of society and then when that 1% comes along they get arrested.

I've seen the same thing over here in Japan being an American non-Japanese. Just being American here makes you an instant celebrity. I can drive 200Kpm on the expressway at 3AM and the cops just pull along side and wave for me to slow down. I could be loud and obnoxious in clubs in Tokyo and people would like me more because of it.

But sooner or later the 1% who aren't going to let it slide will come around.

[Taylor 36]

These athletes are products of our society. In a hip-hop culture that does nothing but glorify illegal drugs and violence, objectifies women, vilifies law enforcement, and tells people that making money is the only purpose of life, it cannot be surprising that these athletes emulate what they've grown up seeing and listening to in movies, tv, and music. I know Russel S. would just say it's a case of art reflecting life, and that is true, in the ghetto...but rather than telling the stories of what life is like on the streets and how to rise above it, the culture glorifies it and perpetuates it until it spreads to other portions of society.

:applause: :applause: Very well said!!!!:cheers:

[Cdowwe]

Being from Cincinnati, I could shed some light on it. IMO, alot of players probably get away with stuff because of the police looking the other way. I could see this in New York with someone like Jeter, although Jeter isnt like this.

In my experience, Cincinnati police are basically tough on anyone, possibly letting Pete Rose get by. Im sure they tried to calm Huggins down when he got his DUI, but ended up arresting him and it eventually led to him leaving UC.

But, the Bengals players are idiots. Everyday in the Newspaper you read how Chris Henry is arrested for the 4th time. The Bengals are not the pride of the town, so the police probably dont feel so bad arresting them. Just me ranting.

But for the Bengals, Mike Brown definately doesnt give a rats ass about the character of his players and it shows.

[SkinsFTW]

"AMPA, Fla. (AP) - Jacksonville Jaguars receiver Charles Sharon was charged with stealing a handgun that police said was found under the seat of the player's sport utility vehicle during a drug-related search."

[DC_Native,NC_Fan]

We have to do our best to ignore the big pink elephant in the room and give "alternative" reasoning. :D

[Veretax]

I'm not sure if its on the rise, or if there is just more media now with the internet thus more exposure and opportunities for these things to come to light. I think a few years ago alot of this would have been brushed under the rug

[Troy Fakeman]

It is probably best that I ignore this topic and keep my opinions to myself.

[JC girl]

I really hope the start some kind of league penalty, like missing games, not just fines, because when you have that much money it doesn't really matter, but when you start hurting your team because you can't play then your teamates get mad at you. Something has to be done, this is ridiculous, esp when they are let off for everything they do. These people are supposed to be our heroes not the dregs of our society.

[NewCliche21]

It's extraordinarily disappointing. My dad raised me using people such as Art Monk and Darrell Green as examples of what it meant to be a person.

Now I think of who we have, and who I'll raise my kids on, and I don't know if I'd ever use any of them as role models.

[mikeyf316]

Agreed, i think they should go to jail like any other person. kick them out of the NFL too.

Then ST would be in prison. He plead nolo contendre, which is him pleading guilty without assuming guilt. Want him kicked out, too?

People make mistakes, and these are generally still young guys who become instant millionaries and don't have any training to handle the fame or fortune. Let's make sure that we note the differences between basic minor offenses which people are being arrested for, and some of the major things that they are getting locked up for.

[Matt [Redskins Fan]]

Sign of the times, baby. It's not just pro athletes who are acting up more.

[Mooka]

These athletes are products of our society. In a hip-hop culture that does nothing but glorify illegal drugs and violence, objectifies women, vilifies law enforcement, and tells people that making money is the only purpose of life, it cannot be surprising that these athletes emulate what they've grown up seeing and listening to in movies, tv, and music. I know Russel S. would just say it's a case of art reflecting life, and that is true, in the ghetto...but rather than telling the stories of what life is like on the streets and how to rise above it, the culture glorifies it and perpetuates it until it spreads to other portions of society. :doh:
Not all athletes come from the ghetto.
Not all athletes listen to Hip Hop.
Not all athletes buy into that culture.


You're mentality is a product of society if you ask me.

[pvkeeper19]

Then ST would be in prison. He plead nolo contendre, which is him pleading guilty without assuming guilt. Want him kicked out, too?
That's not really true. It literally means "I do not wish to contend" the charge. It's usually the plea in cases where there is enough evidence and witness testimony to convict the defendant, when a plea bargain is being offered.

In connection with the plea, he was fined almost $72,000 by the NFL, but since there was no conviction, he was not suspended.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2006/08/07/AR2006080701017.html

[NewCliche21]

Then ST would be in prison. He plead nolo contendre, which is him pleading guilty without assuming guilt. Want him kicked out, too?

People make mistakes, and these are generally still young guys who become instant millionaries and don't have any training to handle the fame or fortune. Let's make sure that we note the differences between basic minor offenses which people are being arrested for, and some of the major things that they are getting locked up for.

I agree that we need to remember that these guys are only 22 (Okoye will only be 19!) when they suddenly become richer than we can even imagine. A lot comes with that.

After mulling over this thread, I'm sure that the same things would've been said 20 years ago. Riggins was a "drunk", LT was using, Manley was using, etc. Things are publicized a lot more than they were back then, and the NFL is infinitely more glamorized now that it's making billions and billions a year than it was back in "the day." People made mistakes back then, too, but you just didn't hear about them. As a social work student, I'd say that things are definitely worse now, but they weren't A+ back then, either.

[pvkeeper19]

I agree that we need to remember that these guys are only 22 (Okoye will only be 19!) when they suddenly become richer than we can even imagine. A lot comes with that.
Point of information: Okoye will actually be twenty before the season begins. His birthday is in June.

But anyway, I do think that we should hold these players responsible for their actions. I think it's reasonable to assume that they know the difference between right and wrong by their early twenties, and also have the werewithal to deduce the probable illegality of their actions. The problem lies with their unwillingness to do right for the sake of right. I guarantee that for every player who gets caught breaking the law, there are at least two more who get away with it. They know that they can afford the best attorneys in the country, so they'll face little or no penalty from the legal system. The only way to deter them is to hit them in the wallet, which is what the league tries to do. If that doesn't stop them, I don't know what else will.

[SkinsFTW]

I think I was right when I said 35 arrests in a year was way off.

Do arrests like this one count:

"Unrestricted free agent tight end Jerramy Stevens, the former first-round draft choice whose five-year tenure with the Seattle Seahawks was marked by bad hands and poor off-field decisions, was arrested early Tuesday morning in Scottsdale, Ariz., and charged with driving under the influence and possession of marijuana. "

Or the one I posted earlier? Thats 2 in the past day.

[fansince62]

35/1696 = 2.06% of the players in the NFL that got in trouble. Look around at your job, is that even a reflection upon society? I'm sure more than 2% of the people at your job have been/are currently/will be in some kind of legal trouble.

There's far more media coverage now to keep tabs on athletes. Without the internet, before sportscenter, other than the radio & newspaper, how were you going to hear about the things that an athlete does in his private time?

oh please. that' a bit slippery don't you think? 2.06% of the people I work with are not snorting cocaine, speeding in ferraris over 100 mph on city streets, involved in night club shootings...or spitting in people's fcaes for that matter....not to mention irrelevant.

break the law...pay the price. end of story.

[NewCliche21]

Point of information: Okoye will actually be twenty before the season begins. His birthday is in June.

But anyway, I do think that we should hold these players responsible for their actions. I think it's reasonable to assume that they know the difference between right and wrong by their early twenties, and also have the werewithal to deduce the probable illegality of their actions. The problem lies with their unwillingness to do right for the sake of right. I guarantee that for every player who gets caught breaking the law, there are at least two more who get away with it. They know that they can afford the best attorneys in the country, so they'll face little or no penalty from the legal system. The only way to deter them is to hit them in the wallet, which is what the league tries to do. If that doesn't stop them, I don't know what else will.

And if he signs his contract before June, then my statement was still right. ;) Gotta love semantics.

As for the hits in the wallet, who cares? What's 10K for a night of fun when you're making four million that year?

[MartinC]

A lot of good thigs being said which I agree with but I think its more complex than just young men who become instant milionaires and don't know how to handle it or the influence of being raised in a poor background and/or surrounded by negative messages from rap/heavy metal/hip hop music or whatever etc. Though all these things do have an effect I'm sure.


I think you also need to consider a system where these players have been singled out since High School as 'stars'. They get adulation, corners cut on tests and even maybe the odd brush with the law gets swept under the table - nothing major maybe but its let go.

Then they recruited like heck by major Colleges - flown in on private planes, shown around town and a good time, get a free education, great accomodation, national TV exposure, more adulation, maybe even who knows a bit of 'expenses' get paid for them or their families (see Bush Reggie) they get to cut classes and still make their grades and maybe graduate (did you know Dexter Manley left University UNIVERSITY unable to read?).

Then comes the draft the NFL and the money which just adds yet more complexity and many more ways to get into trouble now they can afford to pay for all kinds of interesting things;)

Bottom line should we be surprised that kids who have been told they are special and gifted and treated with kid gloves since they were about 12 end up acting like the spoiled kids many of them still are and thinking they are above the law and untouchable?

They need to be handled better by their High Schools, Colleges and The NFL and the teams - taught how fortunate they are to have the gifts they do, made aware early of the pitfalls and the responsibilities that they have to themselves and their schools/league/team and helped to manage their cash and given lifetsyle counselling and assistance. If they then still screw up - and being people some will - they need to be held accountable for their actions at every stage of the process - not just when somebody gets hurt or a major felony is committed.

Rant over ......

[MartinC]

What's 10K for a night of fun when you're making four million that year?

Sadly - I have no idea :(

[TheU2689]

parents, its usually the parents. or these guys, just get all of this money. and they just think they are invincible. and can do whatever they want, cause they think that money is gonna buy them out of everything. its a shame when these people make these ignorant actions, cause there are some of us who would play this game, blue collar wise. Wouldnt want the big pay check and just play for the love of the game.

See : Darrell Green

[BuryYourDuke]

:doh:
Not all athletes come from the ghetto.
Not all athletes listen to Hip Hop.
Not all athletes buy into that culture.


You're mentality is a product of society if you ask me.

I'm going to give you the opportunity to rethink what you wrote here. At no point did I say that all athletes come from the ghetto, or listen to hip hop, or buy into that culture. However, the VAST, VAST majority of those in legal problems do. If anyone wants to disagree with me on that, then you are proving your ignorance on the subject. My mentality is common sense.

[megared]

oh please. that' a bit slippery don't you think? 2.06% of the people I work with are not snorting cocaine, speeding in ferraris over 100 mph on city streets, involved in night club shootings...or spitting in people's fcaes for that matter....not to mention irrelevant.

break the law...pay the price. end of story.

Out of 1696 people ya'll are stuck on the 2%...that isn't a reflection of even a large portion of the NFL. You could say unequivocally that noone at your job has ever broken the law? Never has sniffed cocaine? Never sped on the highway? Never been in a bad situation at a nightclub? Never been in a physical altercation? Why are athletes held to a higher standard than the rest of society? All they do is play a sport.

Big bank account doesn't = class, doesn't give you maturity or wisdom. These are all things people gain throughout their lifetime....

[Troy Fakeman]

Boys will be boys........enough said.

[fansince62]

Out of 1696 people ya'll are stuck on the 2%...that isn't a reflection of even a large portion of the NFL. You could say unequivocally that noone at your job has ever broken the law? Never has sniffed cocaine? Never sped on the highway? Never been in a bad situation at a nightclub? Never been in a physical altercation? Why are athletes held to a higher standard than the rest of society? All they do is play a sport.

Big bank account doesn't = class, doesn't give you maturity or wisdom. These are all things people gain throughout their lifetime....

agree with the last para.

"never" is an absolute that no one can prove. on average, based on anecdotal evidence, I would say that folks in the company I work for (which happens to have a more aged population) do not do the sorts of things NFL thugs have done. many have security clearances they would immediately lose for these kinds of activities - in short...their livelihoods. Do I have data? No. Do I know anecdotally after many years the people I work with and what is happening behind the scenes? Yes. I can say this just as comfortably as I can assert that Joe Gibbs doesn't do any of these things.

[megared]

agree with the last para.

"never" is an absolute that no one can prove. on average, based on anecdotal evidence, I would say that folks in the company I work for (which happens to have a more aged population) do not do the sorts of things NFL thugs have done. many have security clearances they would immediately lose for these kinds of activities - in short...their livelihoods. Do I have data? No. Do I know anecdotally after many years the people I work with and what is happening behind the scenes? Yes. I can say this just as comfortably as I can assert that Joe Gibbs doesn't do any of these things.

You're talking about being caught doing it. Just because they've never been caught or charged doesn't mean that they haven't ever done it. Especially (in your case) if they're older and were working before a rise in the regularity of preemployment drug screens...and before the time it became easy to run a comprehensive background check. I've worked extensively with clearances as well, and anecdotally alot of the people I knew (not most or all, but more than the outsider would think) have been in shady situations as well.

These are guys in their early twenties that went from not even being able to accept gifts to waking up with millions in their bank account. They should definitely be given some leeway, especially when a good portion of them aren't coming from homes grounded in morality...