"We play to the stregnth of our team, the defense, we had a conservative game plan.."

[SkinsHokieFan]

That was Al Saunders after the game yesterday and the quote I heard on my morning drive today

Saunders basically said the game plan was run run pass, keep things conservative and let the D win the game, which is basically how things went

Now the only rational I can think of is going back to the GB game last week. JC was harrased and hounded in that 2nd half and didn't have much of a chance to do anything but get sacked

With the makeshift o-line (3/5 gone) I think we all understand the coaches thought that this was the best chance NOT TO LOSE the game. Doc said that game plans are installed on Wednesday and coaches cannot go with who they think will play, they have to gameplan based on who is practicing at that moment, and as of Wednesday it didn't even seem like Todd Wade would play

Is it the most irritating thing ever? Yes. I would have loved to have seen far more 3 and 4 wide formations and passes on 1st down

However was it prudent? The way the Cards d-line was playing, I gotta say yea it probably was the best course of action, not to allow JC to get clobbered. We saw a few plays where JC was left out to dry, either with a miscommunication where nobody was blocked (Wade giving up a sack), via a blitz where nobody was picked up, or the way the Cards d-line destroyed the shovel pass to Portis, but JC ran it

If Rabach is back next week, the team has to trust the o-line to block well enough to allow for more 3, 4 and even 5 wide sets. The run run pass game plan will end up with a big fat 0 on the scoreboard

[SkinsNoles21]

well...whats the game plan going to be for the Pats?

Conservative? itll be over by the third series.

[SkinsHokieFan]

well...whats the game plan going to be for the Pats?

Conservative? itll be over by the third series.

Well, I am sure the coaches are smart enough to realize you can't go up to NE and try and run run pass. That'll net us about 10 yards

They also have to know the D probably won't win the game like they did this week. It was a very Ravenesque win, with the D getting us a TD.

The offense at minimum needs to score 24 points for there to be a chance. We need a special teams and/or D big play

Against the Cards this game plan could work because our D was clearly better then their O. This won't be the case in NE

[onnie007]

well...whats the game plan going to be for the Pats?

Conservative? itll be over by the third series.

The Pats don't have Darnell Dockett AND Alan Branch in their front 4. I like the young and strong front 4 of the Cardinals over the Patriots. So I'd like to say we will do better next week especially with Rabach back. Plus Pats strength is the LBs and I like our chances running the ball against them because we should have a better opportunity to block at the second level. I don't think people are giving the Cardinals credit on D. There is a reason they beat the Steelers.

[LiveStrongSkins]

Thats bull **** if you ask me. That tells me they are going into games scared. There is no killer instinct with this team. When you even plan to be conservative days before the game, how much confidence is that showing in your players. We are now taking the aggression out of our players 5 days before kickoff. What a joke. I love Gibbs to death, but whoever comes in next needs to be a hungry go for your throat type of coach. If the plan was to keep JC safe, then you spread out the defense and throw quick patterns where the ball is out. I'm so frustrated with this offensive staff. Last year when our record sucked is the only time this offense was worth a damn. We went into games with aggressive gameplans and Campbell was hitting guys deep. Now that the defense is back, they used it as an excuse to coach with their tail between their legs.

[RonJeremy]

Makes sense. I don't like it but it does makes sense.

...but they will need to throw the ball early and often this Sunday if they are going to have a chance.

[KingGibbs]

Thats bull **** if you ask me. That tells me they are going into games scared. There is no killer instinct with this team. When you even plan to be conservative days before the game, how much confidence is that showing in your players. We are now taking the aggression out of our players 5 days before kickoff. What a joke. I love Gibbs to death, but whoever comes in next needs to be a hungry go for your throat type of coach. If the plan was to keep JC safe, then you spread out the defense and throw quick patterns where the ball is out. I'm so frustrated with this offensive staff. Last year when our record sucked is the only time this offense was worth a damn. We went into games with aggressive gameplans and Campbell was hitting guys deep. Now that the defense is back, they used it as an excuse to coach with their tail between their legs.

A bit harsh isn't it? Too bad it's the truth. :(

[Brandon Lloyd Christmas]

hearing that this morning disgusted me. i cant believe our offensive game plan was to have the D win the game. horrendous.

[PigSkins47]

This team has a ton of talent on offense...and that's why we as fans are so angry/frusterated. We KNOW we can be better. The only things that are holding us back are playcalling and execution...Luckily, those two should be a lot easier to overcome than a lack of talent.

[ttr77]

So the guy in charge of the offense on this team calls the defense the 'strength of our team'? Man, that's sad.

[Henry]

Thats bull **** if you ask me. That tells me they are going into games scared. There is no killer instinct with this team. When you even plan to be conservative days before the game, how much confidence is that showing in your players. We are now taking the aggression out of our players 5 days before kickoff. What a joke. I love Gibbs to death, but whoever comes in next needs to be a hungry go for your throat type of coach. If the plan was to keep JC safe, then you spread out the defense and throw quick patterns where the ball is out. I'm so frustrated with this offensive staff. Last year when our record sucked is the only time this offense was worth a damn. We went into games with aggressive gameplans and Campbell was hitting guys deep. Now that the defense is back, they used it as an excuse to coach with their tail between their legs.

You can't spread the defense out if they can get to the QB with only four. We proved that against the Lions and Packers. The Cards would have done that to us, except it would have been far, far worse. Our line right now is horrid. It's so banged up it's unrecognizeable. You do have to account for that when you game-plan.

And that's why we didn't lose by three TDs.

[BigMike619]

Thats bull **** if you ask me. That tells me they are going into games scared. There is no killer instinct with this team. When you even plan to be conservative days before the game, how much confidence is that showing in your players. We are now taking the aggression out of our players 5 days before kickoff. What a joke. I love Gibbs to death, but whoever comes in next needs to be a hungry go for your throat type of coach. If the plan was to keep JC safe, then you spread out the defense and throw quick patterns where the ball is out. I'm so frustrated with this offensive staff. Last year when our record sucked is the only time this offense was worth a damn. We went into games with aggressive gameplans and Campbell was hitting guys deep. Now that the defense is back, they used it as an excuse to coach with their tail between their legs.

I want to yell "go **** yourself" and "shut the hell up" but you are 100% correct here. I am such a supporter of Gibbs but he is playing like he lost his mojo. We ran that ball so much and just went 3 and out so many times that I knew we were going to lose that game.

What happened to us scoring on opening drives? We didnt and havent done that in so long that I have forgotten what it was like.

I wish JG would just wake up and get his killer instinct back.

[fwo40]

The Pats don't have Darnell Dockett AND Alan Branch in their front 4. I like the young and strong front 4 of the Cardinals over the Patriots. So I'd like to say we will do better next week especially with Rabach back. Plus Pats strength is the LBs and I like our chances running the ball against them because we should have a better opportunity to block at the second level. I don't think people are giving the Cardinals credit on D. There is a reason they beat the Steelers.

If Seymour is back you can throw that assestment right out the window. Wilfork and Seymour alone are enough to fear their front 4 more than the Cards.

Denver was horrendous at stopping the run, and they Willie P under 100 yards last night. The Cards do NOT compare with the Pats on any level.

[WhoRUSupposed2Be]

You can't spread the defense out if they can get to the QB with only four. We proved that against the Lions and Packers. The Cards would have done that to us, except it would have been far, far worse. Our line right now is horrid. It's so banged up it's unrecognizeable. You do have to account for that when you game-plan.

And that's why we didn't lose by three TDs.

Heny, are these excuses?

[jthor99]

Thats bull **** if you ask me. That tells me they are going into games scared. There is no killer instinct with this team. When you even plan to be conservative days before the game, how much confidence is that showing in your players. We are now taking the aggression out of our players 5 days before kickoff. What a joke. I love Gibbs to death, but whoever comes in next needs to be a hungry go for your throat type of coach. If the plan was to keep JC safe, then you spread out the defense and throw quick patterns where the ball is out. I'm so frustrated with this offensive staff. Last year when our record sucked is the only time this offense was worth a damn. We went into games with aggressive gameplans and Campbell was hitting guys deep. Now that the defense is back, they used it as an excuse to coach with their tail between their legs.

Spread the defense out, and throw slant patterns all day? Come on bro this isnt madden, and that isnt in Al Saunders or Joe Gibbs scheme.

Look i agree with the killer instinct mentality, and ive been ranting and raving about that for weeks now. You have to look at the situation this football team is in right now. We are playing with a backup Center, Guard, and Tackle, and to be completley honest all of those backups arent really great at filling those roles as you've seen in the last couple weeks.

Im with you on the aggressive gameplans, but we have to have the horses to do so. If we could of went aggressive against the Cards we most than likely would of lost the football game becaue Jason either would of fumbled the ball under emens pressure or would of thrown a INT forcing a throw. We have to realize this coaching staff is trying to gameplan around an offensive line that is mostly backups, and not Good ones at that!! Hopefully we can get Casey back for next week he certainly will have his hands full against Vince Wilfork in the 3-4 scheme. My main concern is Wade, and Fabini getting communication down quickly because you know Belicheck and company will dial up the blitz to that right side often.

[SkinsHokieFan]

Heny, are these excuses?

I don't think Henry ever makes excuses

More like trying to figure out what the coaches were thinking

I am with most people on here, I would have tried running a few more 3 wide sets, if not 4 wide sets, and doing some quick hitting stuff

You saw how it worked with ARE on his big gainer

However we don't ever see how these guys are in practice or what the defense really is

I just wish we had hit on that screen at the end of the first half, that had big gain written all over it

[Veretax]

They are scared. Scared they might get someone else injured :/

[Taylor 36]

Our o-line is pathetic right now. What is so hard to understand about that??? If they can't protect the QB for a three step drop back (which they couldn't), what makes anyone believe that we could toss the ball around all day???

[Henry]

Heny, are these excuses?

Excuses for what? Winning?

[skinsdude]

That was Al Saunders after the game yesterday and the quote I heard on my morning drive today

Saunders basically said the game plan was run run pass, keep things conservative and let the D win the game, which is basically how things went

Unfortunately it was run for two yards, then run for three yards, then pass for another two yards which doesn't equal or exceed ten yards.

[RedskinsFanatic]

This team has a ton of talent on offense...and that's why we as fans are so angry/frusterated. We KNOW we can be better. The only things that are holding us back are playcalling and execution...Luckily, those two should be a lot easier to overcome than a lack of talent.


Mr. PigSkins47 I'd like to introduce you to our BANGED UP O LINE :doh:

[LiveStrongSkins]

Our o-line is pathetic right now. What is so hard to understand about that??? If they can't protect the QB for a three step drop back (which they couldn't), what makes anyone believe that we could toss the ball around all day???

What dont you guys understand about still having to be aggressive? That does not mean you dont even try to get your best playmakers the ball. Instead of handing the ball off every first down, take your playaction deep shots on first down sometimes. I mean we have to do something. It's embarrasing to watch. We dont even look like a pro offense. Our defense has the same chance of scoring as our pathetic unit that is being handcuffed.

[ttr77]

Perhaps the Skins should focus on drafting and developing some decent backups so that they are better prepared for this type of predicament. Every team in the league has injuries. The best ones are prepared for them and can overcome. Sadly, it appears that the Skins were not.

[Warpath11]

Im with you on the aggressive gameplans, but we have to have the horses to do so. If we could of went aggressive against the Cards we most than likely would of lost the football game becaue Jason either would of fumbled the ball under emens pressure or would of thrown a INT forcing a throw. We have to realize this coaching staff is trying to gameplan around an offensive line that is mostly backups, and not Good ones at that!! Hopefully we can get Casey back for next week he certainly will have his hands full against Vince Wilfork in the 3-4 scheme. My main concern is Wade, and Fabini getting communication down quickly because you know Belicheck and company will dial up the blitz to that right side often.

Bingo hit the nail on the head here. The Pats can spread people out with multiple WRs because their OL is playing lights out. I think they are the best offensive line in football at the moment. As Jthor said our line is in no position to be an aggressive pass unit. I would have hoped better in the run game but that seems to have taken a dive as well.

[Loxley]

Heny, are these excuses?

No, I think theyre called facts. F comes after E in the dictionary. Look it up.

Then look up Line (Offensive), ours was basically backups.

When I saw who we were fielding on the line I knew it was going to be difficult. Its not an excuse in the slightest as we did win a scrappy game. We could have been better but the important thing is the scoreline ended with a W. Its over and we have to look forward to a new week and a new challenge.

[Henry]

Perhaps the Skins should focus on drafting and developing some decent backups so that they are better prepared for this type of predicament. Every team in the league has injuries. The best ones are prepared for them and can overcome. Sadly, it appears that the Skins were not.

I agree with your overall point. We should be drafting more linemen than we have been.

However, even given that, our line is more banged up than good drafting can account for. Again, reading the posts here I don't think people realize just how badly we are hurt up front right now.

[skinsdude]

Our o-line is pathetic right now. What is so hard to understand about that??? If they can't protect the QB for a three step drop back (which they couldn't), what makes anyone believe that we could toss the ball around all day???

How do you know that they couldn't protect him? He only threw 6 incomplete passes and was only sacked once. He was only hurried on a couple of those incompletions. Jason could have had some success against the D-line pressure that the Cardinals were bringing yesterday. The bottom line is the running game was not working, try something else.

[armada58]

Well, I am sure the coaches are smart enough to realize you can't go up to NE and try and run run pass. That'll net us about 10 yards

They also have to know the D probably won't win the game like they did this week. It was a very Ravenesque win, with the D getting us a TD.

The offense at minimum needs to score 24 points for there to be a chance. We need a special teams and/or D big play

Against the Cards this game plan could work because our D was clearly better then their O. This won't be the case in NE

Don't be so quick to assume the coaches will change from Run-Run-Pass. They may choose that same formula in a "Keep the Patriots Offense off he field" strategy.

Would that be my choice?? HELL NO!! But, I also would have chosen a totally different strategy than the one they used against The Cardinals. At this point, I don't think any of us can truly know what to expect out of this coaching staff.

:whoknows:

[TankRizzo]

In today's NFL, that's how you LOSE games, not win. You can't become complacent with any kind of lead. You have to take every point you can get.

If you're in the lead in NASCAR, you don't let off the gas, you keep going.

[tex]

The game plan worked. Cool enough for a win which is A OK with me.

Against the Pats? Better hang at least 40 points on them so the Skins will need to crank it up a bunch just to be competitive.

[Brandon Lloyd Christmas]

i think we just need to accept the fact that we just arent a good offense this year. nobody is stepping up and making big plays, our line is screwed, and our coaching staff is calling horrible 1942 game plans.

its just a matter of time before our O gets pissed off and mouths off to the media. sellers started to yesterday, portis isnt far behind.

[SkinsHokieFan]

Perhaps the Skins should focus on drafting and developing some decent backups so that they are better prepared for this type of predicament. Every team in the league has injuries. The best ones are prepared for them and can overcome. Sadly, it appears that the Skins were not.

Even then, how many teams survive when you lose 3 of your 5 starting o-lineman?

How many times does that ever happen? At any level?

[radagast5]

hearing that this morning disgusted me. i cant believe our offensive game plan was to have the D win the game. horrendous.

See, the problem with your viewpoint is that it emphasizes your frustration over the fact that we're winning.

If you want to raise the hue and cry that being conservative is frustrating, I'm there with you. But "conservative" and "playing not to lose" has gotten us a 4-2 record. They keep that up and we're in the playoffs.

In short, whatever we're doing is working.

[Bryan81]

I think the coaches game planned based on the number of injuries they have on the Redskins & to try & get the running game going. Now it didn't turn out to be as easy as they thought it might, but the thought process makes sense. The execution of the players just hasn't been there on the offensive side of the ball. That has to fall on Saunders & the players both.

[tryfuhl]

Okay that's great and all, but maybe we could give them just a bit of rest too? Maybe a couple first downs so that if we think punting is better than maybe throwing an INT, it's way on the other side of the field?

I'd rather a deep bomb go incomplete or have the possibility of an INT with no guarantee than to know we're just giving the ball up...

[SkinsHokieFan]

What is ironic is reading the Iggles messageboard

People are pissed, pissed that Andy Reid would throw the ball with under 4 minutes left

Ah, football fans crack me up :laugh:

[tryfuhl]

Another thing, if the pass won't be successful with a banged up O-Line, how the hell do you think the run is going to work?

[armada58]

Even then, how many teams survive when you lose 3 of your 5 starting o-lineman?

How many times does that ever happen? At any level?

Right on. Considering the circumstances, I'd say we've done very well. Losing 3 of 5 linemen and we still won.

For those of you, "We should draft O-Linemen" people. Remember Jim Molinaro!! In other words, it's not that easy. You don't just call a name on draft day and say, "Problem solved!"

[BKSkinsFan]

We were conservative yesterday, we passed the ball under 40% of our putred 47 offensive plays. The scary part is, even with a conservative game plan, we still managed a turnover that set up a touchdown for the Cards.

Arizona's d-line is much tougher than they get credit for. I'm kind of hoping we have Bertrand Berry on our free agent radar, I don't know if he'd play LDE or not though. They got INSTANT pressure up the middle, and even though Pucillo had a decent game, in the limited passing oppurtunities, we had guys getting beat bad and missing assignments exposing JC to getting a beat down.

This instant penetration we saw yesterday also caused our running game to be pretty much non existant also. The only chance we seemed to have was running some quick slants and screens all day, but slants can be risky, and we played conservative, our attempt at a screen resulted in the INT.

[tex]

Right on. Considering the circumstances, I'd say we've done very well. Losing 3 of 5 linemen and we still won.

For those of you, "We should draft O-Linemen" people. Remember Jim Molinaro!! In other words, it's not that easy. You don't just call a name on draft day and say, "Problem solved!"
Here's a prospect for you.
Gosder Cherilus.
College: Boston College Number: 77
Height: 6-7 Weight: 315
Position: OT
Class/Draft Year: 2008
40 Time: 5.14 40 Low: 5.08 40 High: 5.26

[WhoRUSupposed2Be]

Excuses for what? Winning?


That maybe this offensive line is worst than it really appears?

[ttr77]

Right on. Considering the circumstances, I'd say we've done very well. Losing 3 of 5 linemen and we still won.

For those of you, "We should draft O-Linemen" people. Remember Jim Molinaro!! In other words, it's not that easy. You don't just call a name on draft day and say, "Problem solved!"

With a good scouting department it should be solved. And just because they swung and missed on Molinaro it doesn't mean they should stop trying.

[Hooper]

Another ultra-conservative Gibbs game plan. Play not to lose instead of to win. Saunders is being a good soldier but he must being going crazy inside. Even when his line was in complete disarray in KC, he was attacking, attacking, attacking.

[Campbell's_da_man]

Thats bull **** if you ask me. That tells me they are going into games scared. There is no killer instinct with this team. When you even plan to be conservative days before the game, how much confidence is that showing in your players. We are now taking the aggression out of our players 5 days before kickoff. What a joke. I love Gibbs to death, but whoever comes in next needs to be a hungry go for your throat type of coach. If the plan was to keep JC safe, then you spread out the defense and throw quick patterns where the ball is out. I'm so frustrated with this offensive staff. Last year when our record sucked is the only time this offense was worth a damn. We went into games with aggressive gameplans and Campbell was hitting guys deep. Now that the defense is back, they used it as an excuse to coach with their tail between their legs.

BINGO!!

You just broke the head off of the nail!!

[Henry]

That maybe this offensive line is worst than it really appears?

I don't think the line could be worse than it appeared, because it appeared to be pretty freaking horrible.

That's not a knock on the guys that stepped up and played on that line, but the combination of backups and injuries appeared to be just overwhelming.

[monkforhall]

If Rackers makes that kick, the game plan looks even worse. Just because he missed it people act like that made the game plan a good one. They deserved to lose that game with that mentality, what confidence it must give Jason. Hey Jason, just don't lose it. Guess we haven't learned our lesson yet. We didn't win that game, the Cards lost it.

[The Full Monty]

With a good scouting department it should be solved. And just because they swung and missed on Molinaro it doesn't mean they should stop trying.
LOL, the poster you replied to brought up a late round scrub...

How about we actually invest a 1st day pick on a lineman?

Instead of trading a 3rd and 4th for Blloyd.

I mean, 3rd rounders can't be starters, right?

Oh wait...uh...Dockery was found in the 3rd...and that other guy who plays for us...oh yeah...Cooley.

[Henry]

LOL, the poster you replied to brought up a late round scrub...

How about we actually invest a 1st day pick on a lineman?

Instead of trading a 3rd and 4th for Blloyd.

I mean, 3rd rounders can't be starters, right?

Oh wait...uh...Dockery was found in the 3rd...and that other guy who plays for us...oh yeah...Cooley.

Just so you all don't think I agree with everything Gibbs does, let me say I completely agree with this post. :)

[Campbell's_da_man]

Makes sense. I don't like it but it does makes sense.

...but they will need to throw the ball early and often this Sunday if they are going to have a chance.

Are you kidding me? If we were scared of Arizona's defense, one could reason that we should just forfeit next week. Why risk more injuries if we're only gonna lose anyway, right?:laugh:

The lights are on, but nobody's home.:doh:

[SonnyJ]

Even when his line was in complete disarray in KC, he was attacking, attacking, attacking.

For instance?

I thought one of the noteworthy things about K.C.'s line was that they trotted out the same unit for every game for 5 or so seasons. When did they ever have to patch like this?

[Brandon Lloyd Christmas]

What is ironic is reading the Iggles messageboard

People are pissed, pissed that Andy Reid would throw the ball with under 4 minutes left

Ah, football fans crack me up :laugh:



because theyre not injured like we are, and westbrook is a complete monster. id be pissed too if we had a healthy oline and stud like westbrook and we were passing (and their receivers are awful to boot).

[dieselfan44]

think of how good we would be if we opened up the playbook a little. I'm sick and tired of us relying on our defense to shore up every game for us. By operating the offense like we did yesterday all we do is tire out our defense because we can't move the ball. This allows the other team to come storming back and make a late run. Thanks god we were playing the cards yesterday,whose two point conversion call was almost as bad as our own offensive intellect. How can our coaching not see this for themselves. I love Gibbs but this **** is on the verge of being ridiculous.

[ncr2h]

You guys harping on a supposed lack of depth on the o-line are ridiculous. Our team has good O-line depth. Period. The problem is, NO team in the NFL has appropriate depth on the O-line to lose 3 of 5 starting linemen and not miss a beat. Todd Wade is a relatively good backup right tackle. Pucillo is a good backup guard. Fabini is a solid backup as well. However, there is a difference between a backup getting plugged in as a stopgap solution for an injured starter, and a team who is basically playing their B-team offensive line. 60% of our line was backups, and even then 1 of them was playing hurt AND the backup to our backups (Heyer) was hurt as well.

Imagine if Fred Smoot, Sean Taylor, and Shawn Springs were simultaneously out with injuries, and Pierson Prioleau was playing hurt. Would you expect Williams to employ a gameplan that left our corners on islands all game? No. You would expect a gameplan that would be tailored to the talents of the players in our lineup. Would you be infuriated when our offense was forced to win the game for us? Would you call it unacceptable if the opposing team put up 20-25 points on that defense?

I think at some point you have to be realistic and gameplan with the talent you have available. 60% of your offensive line being out or injured is no small thing.

[ciacbw]

Another ultra-conservative Gibbs game plan. Play not to lose instead of to win. Saunders is being a good soldier but he must being going crazy inside. Even when his line was in complete disarray in KC, he was attacking, attacking, attacking.

Must have worked since the skins won right??? When exactly was Saunders line in disarray in KC?

[ciacbw]

You guys harping on a supposed lack of depth on the o-line are ridiculous. Our team has good O-line depth. Period. The problem is, NO team in the NFL has appropriate depth on the O-line to lose 3 of 5 starting linemen and not miss a beat. Todd Wade is a relatively good backup right tackle. Pucillo is a good backup guard. Fabini is a solid backup as well. However, there is a difference between a backup getting plugged in as a stopgap solution for an injured starter, and a team who is basically playing their B-team offensive line. 60% of our line was backups, and even then 1 of them was playing hurt AND the backup to our backups (Heyer) was hurt as well.

Imagine if Fred Smoot, Sean Taylor, and Shawn Springs were simultaneously out with injuries, and Pierson Prioleau was playing hurt. Would you expect Williams to employ a gameplan that left our corners on islands all game? No. You would expect a gameplan that would be tailored to the talents of the players in our lineup. Would you be infuriated when our offense was forced to win the game for us? Would you call it unacceptable if the opposing team put up 20-25 points on that defense?

I think at some point you have to be realistic and gameplan with the talent you have available. 60% of your offensive line being out or injured is no small thing.

Stop it you are making too much sense!