What did Clinton accomplish in office?

[redman]

And my fellow Republicans, spare the "stained dress" or comparable comments.

I'm just taking stock if you will of all of the things he accomplished. I'm looking for good things, things that he should brag about.

We'll discuss them in a bit.

[Tommy-the-Greek]

Redman I have been thinking the same thing since I heard that guy on the radio. This is going to be a really short thread.:laugh: :laugh: :laugh: :laugh: :laugh:

[The Evil Genius]

Saw this other day - as always - a lot of a President's accomplishments are up for debate.

Peace.

Pres. Clinton's accomplishments...

Almost 6 million new jobs were created in the first two years of his Administration -- an average of 250,000 new jobs every month.

In 1994, the economy had the lowest combination of unemployment and inflation in 25 years.

As part of the 1993 Economic Plan, President Clinton cut taxes on 15 million low-income families and made tax cuts available to 90 percent of small businesses, while raising taxes on just 1.2 percent of the wealthiest taxpayers.

President Clinton signed into law the largest deficit reduction plan in history, resulting in over $600 billion in deficit reduction. The deficit is going down for 3 years in a row for the first time since Harry Truman was president.


The President signed into law the Brady Bill, which imposes a five-day waiting period on handgun purchases so that background checks can be done to help keep handguns away from criminals.

The President's Crime Bill will put 100,000 new police officers on the street. More than 1,200 communities have already received grants to hire 27,000 additional officers.

The Crime Bill also punishes criminals by expanding the number of offenses eligible for the death penalty and implementing the "three-strikes-and-you're-out" provision.

And, the Bill banned the manufacture of 19 specific types of deadly assault weapons, while simultaneously protecting hunters' rights by exempting over 650 hunting rifles.


President Clinton signed the Family and Medical Leave Act. The law, which covers over 42 million Americans, offers workers up to 12 weeks of unpaid, job-guaranteed leave for child birth, adoption, or personal or family illness.

President Clinton expanded the Earned Income Tax Credit to cut the taxes of 15 million working families with incomes of $27,000 or less.

President Clinton granted waivers to 25 states -- half the nation --providing for comprehensive welfare reform demonstrations.

President Clinton ordered the U.S. Justice Department to conduct the first-ever crackdown on deadbeat parents who refuse to accept financial responsibility for their own children.

Signed an Executive Order cracking down on federal employees who owe child support.


President Clinton cut the federal bureaucracy by more than 100,000 positions.And, he reduced the White House staff by 25 percent.


Under the President's Direct Student Loan program, students can borrow money directly from the government at a lower interest rate and with many flexible repayment options, including the option to repay with a percentage of their after-graduation salary. Taxpayers will save at least $4.3 billion over five years.

In 1994, over 20,000 AmeriCorps members tutored students, immunized children, reclaimed urban parks, and patrolled neighborhoods. In return, they earned $4,725 per year of service towards college tuition or job training.

President Clinton signed into law Goals 2000, a national standard of excellence for our public schools. Already, 41 states and territories have received federal grants to raise academic standards and improve schools.

President Clinton's Safe and Drug Free Schools and Community Act and the Safe Schools Act provide funding to schools to fight violence and drug abuse. Schools can use up to 25 percent of their funds to purchase metal detectors, develop safe zones, and hire school security personnel.

The President's School-to-Work program provides venture capital to spark a nationwide system for moving America's young people from high school to a job with a future. In 1994, all states received planning funds for their school-to-work program.

Charter School legislation signed by President Clinton encourages states and localities to set up public school choice.




Expanding Markets for American Products
The Clinton Administration forged a bipartisan coalition to pass NAFTA, after concluding tough negotiations on side agreements covering workers' rights, the environment, and import surges. Exports to Mexico rose 23 percent in the first 11 months of 1994.

President Clinton led the fight to pass GATT, which lowers tariffs worldwide by $744 billion over ten years -- the largest international tax cut in history. GATT cuts tariffs on manufactured goods by more than one-third overall and eliminates tariffs in major markets in a number of sectors in which the U.S. is particularly competitive.




Protecting Our Environment
Under President Clinton, the EPA launched its "Common Sense Initiative" to make health protection cheaper and smarter by focusing on results rather than one-size-fits-all regulations.

The President's Northwest Forest Plan is putting communities in the Northwest back to work, while conserving ancient forests.

After decades of conflict, the Clinton Administration negotiated a consensus plan to protect California's most valuable natural resource -- its water. The San Francisco and Delta estuary supplies dr inking water to two-thirds of the state's people, provides irrigation for 45 percent of the nation's fruits and vegetables, and sustains 300 aquatic species.




Promoting Security and Freedom Abroad
President Clinton hosted the signing of the Israeli-Palestinian Declaration of Principles in September, 1993, and the signing of the Israeli-Jordan Washington Principles in July, 1994 -- historic agreements between the leaders of Israel and her Arab neighbors to settle differences by peaceful means.

To enhance European security and stability, the Clinton Administration proposed the Partnership for Peace program, offering former Soviet republics and Central/East European states closer ties with NATO. Already, 22 nations have signed on, since NATO's adoption of the program in January, 1994.

As of May, 1994, nuclear missiles in Russia and the United States are no longer targeted against any country. And, as a result of other Clinton Administration efforts, the Ukraine is ahead of schedule in reaching the goal of transferring 1,500 nuclear warheads to Russia for dismantlement.

President Clinton peacefully restored democracy to Haiti, curbing the violence that threatened tens of thousands of Haitians, securing our borders, and upholding our commitments and the commitments made to us in the process.






CREATING ECONOMIC OPPORTUNITY AND SECURITY FOR ALL AMERICANS
Signed the Economic Package, August 10, 1993.
The economy created 7.7 million new jobs in the first 34 months of this Administration.
Passed the largest deficit-cutting plan in history -- saving more than $1 trillion over seven years.
On track for three consecutive years of deficit reduction -- for the first time since Harry Truman.
Cut federal spending by $255 billion over 5 years.
Made new tax cuts available to over 90% of small businesses.
Unemployment has fallen from 7% when President Clinton took office to its current rate of 5.6%
Lowest combined rate of unemployment and inflation since 1968.
1994 real GDP growth was the highest in a decade.
Proposed a plan to balance the budget while protecting critical investments in education.

PROMOTING A FUTURE OF OPPORTUNITY
Increased Head Start funding by almost $760 million.
Passed the Student Loan Reform Act, August 10, 1993.
Implemented the National Service Act, September 21, 1993.
Signed the Goals 2000: Educate America Act, March 31, 1994.
Enacted the School-to-Work Opportunities Act on May 4, 1994.
Signed the Elementary and Secondary Education Act Reauthorization

MAKING COMMUNITIES AND SCHOOLS SAFE FOR OUR FAMILIES
Passed the toughest most comprehensive Crime Bill ever, September 13, 1994
Signed the Brady Bill, November 30, 1993.
Enacted the Assault Weapons Ban as part of the Crime Bill.
Put 100,000 new police on the street -- nearly 31,000 more officers have been funded.
Signed the Violence Against Women Act as part of the Crime Bill.
Signed the Safe and Drug-Free Schools Act, October 20, 1994.
Issued Presidential Directive enforcing a "Zero Tolerance" gun policy in schools, October 22, 1994
Submitted and fought for the most comprehensive Drug Control budget ever.

MAKING GOVERNMENT WORK BETTER AND COST LESS
Already cut the Federal Workforce by over 200,000 -- on the way to lowest level in 30 years.
Abolishing 16,000 pages of obsolete regulations and rewriting 31,000 more pages.
$58 billion in savings are already in the bank. $46 billion in savings are still to come.
Over 180 new recommendations will save $70 billion. Eliminated 284 federal advisory committees.
Developed government-wide Customer Service Standards for the first time.
Appointed the most diverse Cabinet and Administration in history.
Signed the most important federal procurement act ever to streamline government purchasing.
Reformed Pension Benefit Guarantee Corporation to protect 8.5 million pensions.
Signed the Unfunded Mandates Reform Act, March 22, 1995.

CREATING OPPORTUNITY IN AMERICA'S COMMUNITIES
Created nine Economic Empowerment Zones and 95 Enterprise Communities.
Signed the Community Development Banking Financial Institutions Act, Sept. 23, 1994.
Signed the Interstate Banking Bill, September 29, 1994.
Instituted the Defense Reinvestment and Conversion Initiative.
Reformed the Community Reinvestment Act to focus on performance rather than paperwork.
Made the Low-Income Housing Tax Credit and Mortgage Revenue Bond Program permanent.

PROTECTING THE ENVIRONMENT AND OUR PUBLIC HEALTH
Issued a new executive order to require polluters to disclose information to the public and expanded the public's right-to-know about toxic releases.
Launched "reinventing environmental regulation" to cut red tape and better protect public health.
Issued a new standard to cut pollution from chemical plants 90% by 1997.
Signed executive orders to increase recycling and cut pollution in federal buildings.
Signed the California Desert Protection Act, October 31, 1994.
Issued a new standard to cut pollution from incinerators 95%.
Introduced comprehensive Safe Drinking Water and Superfund reforms.
Developed a plan to restore Florida's Everglades.
Ended decades of conflict over the allocation of California Bay-Delta water.

PROMOTING HEALTH CARE FOR ALL AMERICANS
Passed the Family and Medical Leave Act, February 5, 1993.
Signed a comprehensive Child Immunization Plan.
Revoked the Reagan/Bush restrictions on abortion counseling ("the gag rule"), abortions in military hospitals, "Mexico City" policy and RU-486 imports.
Increased Ryan White CARE Act funding for outpatient AIDS care over 100% in first 3 budgets.
Put the Women, Infants and Children Program (WIC) on a full-funding path.
Increased funding 65% for breast cancer research.
As part of the balanced budget plan, introduced health care reform initiative which strengthens Medicare and expands coverage.
Proposed a $1.3 billion increase in veterans' benefits -- of which $1 billion will be directed to the VA health system to provide treatment for 43,000 more veterans.

PRESERVING AND STRENGTHENING OUR FAMILIES
Expanded the Earned Income Tax Credit providing tax relief for 15 million working families.
Introduced the Work and Responsibility Act - comprehensive welfare reform.
Passed the Family Support and Preservation Program.
Passed major funding increases for homeless programs in both Houses.
Approved 35 waivers to states permitting comprehensive welfare reform demonstrations.
Collected a record $10 billion in child support through enforcement in 1994.
Signed the Social Security Independent Agency Act.
Increased adoption and foster care funds by almost $600 million from 1994-1995.

RESTORING TRUST IN OUR GOVERNMENT
Signed the National Voter Registration Act (Motor-Voter), May 20, 1993.
Eliminated the tax deduction for lobbying expenses.
Imposed strictest Administration ethics guidelines in history.
Barred top officials from becoming foreign lobbyists after leaving government.
Signed the Lobbying Disclosure Act of 1995 -- the first overhaul of lobbying rules in 50 years.
Fought for passage of and signed into law the Congressional Accountability Act, January 22, 1995.
Fought for passage of line-item veto and campaign finance.

OPENING FOREIGN MARKETS TO AMERICAN GOODS
Signed NAFTA into law, December 8, 1993, which will create hundreds of thousands of US jobs.
Signed GATT into law, December 8, 1994, the largest trade agreement in history.
Secured free-trade commitments from Asia-Pacific Economic Cooperation (APEC) leaders.
Hosted Summit of the Americas and agreed to negotiate a Free Trade Area of the Americas by 2005
Developed National Export Strategy, eliminating outdated export controls on $35 billion in exports.
Opened 15 different market sectors in Japan ranging from telecommunications procurement to rice.
Reached historic agreement with Japan on opening its automotive market to billions of dollars worth of American cars and parts.
Reached agreement with China to provide intellectual property rights protection for billions of dollars worth of U.S. exports.

AMERICAN LEADERSHIP
Helped Israel and Jordan achieve an historic peace treaty and Israel and the Palestinians fulfill their historic accord.
Contributed to an historic cease-fire in Northern Ireland.
Restored democratically elected Haitian President Aristide to power; will continue to stop the flow of refugees to Florida.
Undertook, with NATO allies and UN, military and diplomatic actions to alleviate the suffering and lead the effort to broker a comprehensive peace agreement in Bosnia.
Russian nuclear missiles are no longer pointed at our cities.
Persuaded Ukraine, Belarus and Kazakhstan to give up the nuclear weapons left on their land when the Soviet Union collapsed.
Agreed to framework with North Korea that freezes and leads to the eventual elimination of North Korea s dangerous nuclear program.
Led the international effort to secure the indefinite and unconditional extension of the Nuclear Non-Proliferation Treaty (NPT) further reducing the danger of nuclear proliferation around the world.
Working to prevent nuclear weapons from ending up in the hands of terrorists or international criminals.
Air-lifted more than half a ton of vulnerable, highly enriched uranium, enough to make dozens of nuclear bombs, from Kazakhstan to safe storage.
Assisted South Africa's transition to democracy, providing support for elections and development.
Bringing the nations of Europe closer:
-- Modernizing NATO;
-- Working with Russia;
-- Reforming the former Soviet Union economies

Waging a tough counter-terrorism campaign with stronger laws and more training for law enforcement.
Maintaining strong sanctions against states that sponsor terrorism and defy the rule of rule, such as Iran, Iraq, Libya and Sudan.
Sent our planes, ships and troops to turn back a new Iraqi threat to the Persian Gulf.

[Ignatius J.]

Clinton had an uncanny way of making friends.

I am sure there are moany who would take this lightly, but remember the peace talks Clinton got going between arafat and I think it was rabin....

This new flare up in violence int he middle east came immediately after bush took office. I'm not going to blame bush for any of it as there were certainly many factors going into the turn of middle eastern events for the worse, but Clinton was great at getting people to talk about thier problems face to face.

He didn't like war, but he got us into and out of Kossovo with minimal casualties.

HE had many negatives in the area of foreign policies as well. Somalia being by far the worst of them. HE took minor strides int he war terror, and many will say not enough was done here. In hindsight this is absolutely correct.

He made Tony Blair a staunch ally. Being somewhat young I don't really remember too much about US britain relations, but it seemed to me (but I could be wrong here, so older guys speak up) that clinton and blair seemed to spark US-Britain relations. They spent an aweful lot of time together, and if the British support we are seeing right now is any thanks to that, then that relationship would be a giant accomplishment.

-DB

[luckydevil]

Ill say this about clinton, he wasnt a liberal

[phanatic]

Downsized the military--we could really use them now. Increased taxes to achieve a balanced budget. Did not attempt to do anything with Osama when Syria/Sudan/Yemen were willing to give him to us. Allowed for 19 U.S. soldiers to be slaughtered in the streets of Mogadishu, Somalia--this would have never happened had he the stones to commit heavy ordinance to the area. Stood by and watched North Korea further develope their nuclear program. Allowed Germany and France to dictate to us how we would handle the sanctions and inspections of Iraq when it is a known fact those counties have a tremedous financial interest in the SADDAM HUSSEIN Iraq. Passed the N.A.F.T.A. resolution wich subsequently caused the evaporation of the middle class trade worker. Instilled the American youth with the belief that it is alright to consistantly lie and betray all those, including your spouse, who look to you as a leader, mentor,father or spouse. And last but not least, he single handidly revived the popularity of the BigMac!;)

[redman]

Originally posted by DrunkenBoxer
This new flare up in violence int he middle east came immediately after bush took office. . . .

He made Tony Blair a staunch ally. Being somewhat young I don't really remember too much about US britain relations, but it seemed to me (but I could be wrong here, so older guys speak up) that clinton and blair seemed to spark US-Britain relations. The current Intifada began in September 2000, two months before the election. Clinton was of course in office at the time, and has received criticism for trying in his final days to force an agreement upon the Palestinian and Israeli leadership in a desperate attempt to be able to claim resolution of the problem as his own accomplishment.

As for U.S.-Britain ties, they've been quite strong now since WWI. Clinton-Blair was a marriage made in idealogical heaven as the two are from left-of-center parties, but espouse more moderate and occasionally even right-of-center economic policies. But our relations with the Brits were just fine before them. I'd remind you of Margaret Thatcher's famous line to Bush The Elder around October 1990 when he was hemming and hawing about the level of commitment to troops in Iraq: "Now don't get wobbly, George."

[redman]

TEG, that strikes me as something that's from either Clinton's "personal" website, or the DNC. That's not helpful as most of the stuff is fluff.

I'm looking for what his supporters tout.

If you like, break it into categories and let's discuss those.

[chiefhogskin48]

Originally posted by phanatic
Increased taxes to achieve a balanced budget.

Guys, this isn't a bad thing. Despite the habit that our government has gotten into, deficits are not a good thing. It just means higher taxes in the future since we have to pay interest on the debt. Actually, over 20% of the taxes we pay go to paying interest on the national debt. I wouldn't run my household like that, and we shouldn't run our country like that either.

[fansince62]

Chiefhog...it's not that cut & dried: if the existing taxes were used more wisely then there may not have been a need to raise taxes in the first place. and, always, there is the expenditure side of the equation.....

[The Evil Genius]

Originally posted by redman
TEG, that strikes me as something that's from either Clinton's "personal" website, or the DNC. That's not helpful as most of the stuff is fluff.

I'm looking for what his supporters tout.

If you like, break it into categories and let's discuss those.

Well, out of that "fluff", I would suggest the most meritorious in our homefront was getting the Brady Bill passed, the Crime Bill, the Family Leave Act passed, and the 1993 Economic Package passed.

Internationally, Clintons involvement in Haiti appears to have worked out well. Obviously, Somalia was a disaster. Clinton internationally was average or even below average.

The motor-voter bill didnt have a large impact per se - but appealed to the GEN X crowd. The expansion of theEarned Income Tax Credit (EIC) also hit home with the working class.

But really, this all doesnt matter because most people are going to remember Clinton for 2 things - a booming economy (right or wrong) and Monica Lewinsky (right or wrong)..

[phanatic]

So the answer to this is to increase taxes on those who make the money? I don't think so! If continually tax the top half of wage earners in the nation you drive down the ablity of those individuals to cotribute to the economy. Can't spend as much. Increasing taxes has never stimulated the economy.

[redman]

Deficits and debt are not universally bad.

Debt and deficits are perfectly appropriate when facing a national crisis. We ran a huge deficit to fight WWII. That's justified.

It's also within the realm of reason for the government to go into debt as an investment in a long-term venture that will generate future tax income. For example, many governments, particularly the "Asian Dragons" incurred government debt as a way to encourage industrial growth in the 70's and 80's, knowing that there would be a long-term benefit from those industries.

The problem we've had is that our national spending does not reflect a unified, disciplined plan given that the nature of our government in budgetary matters is made up of comprimise among competing interests, aka "pork". That's why it's awfully difficult to pin blame on - or give credit to - one president or person for debt or deficit reduction.

[The Evil Genius]

Maybe someone can explain this too me - since I have never been able to "get" it.

If raising taxes is disadvantageous to a booming economy (see Reaganomics) - why did Clinton's tax increases in 1993 still lead to a booming economy?

Was it blind luck?

[Skins24]

Blind luck? no.

It was Al Gore. His invention of the internet helped boost the economy tremedously.

[redman]

You have to understand: while I think certain economic policies can be beneficial or harmful, fundamentally I believe that presidents get too much credit and too much blame for the economy.

Clinton is one of those who gets too much credit. He was lucky in that he got to experience the greatest continuous period of economic expansion in the last 50 years. And it happened despite the fact that he raised taxes. I have yet to hear a coherent explanation as to why he gets credit for that other than to have been in office at the time.

[Mad Mike]

Stood by and watched North Korea further develope their nuclear program.

Now, now... lets keep this truthfull. Actualy he paid them billions. :doh:

[Sarge]

Almost 6 million new jobs were created in the first two years of his Administration -- an average of 250,000 new jobs every month.

And what exactly was it that clinton did to create these jobs? Specifics, please.


The President signed into law the Brady Bill, which imposes a five-day waiting period on handgun purchases so that background checks can be done to help keep handguns away from criminals.

Yeah, and all of about 5 people have been tried under this. Meanwhile, us lawabiding folks that want a gun have to jump through even more hoops.


The President's Crime Bill will put 100,000 new police officers on the street. More than 1,200 communities have already received grants to hire 27,000 additional officers.

This is a horse**** number. My Dad just retired as a cop after 40 years on the job. There was never 100, 000 new cops. Plus, the funding for these cops was only good for 2 years. After that , the individual municipalities had to pick up the tab or let them go.


President Clinton signed the Family and Medical Leave Act. The law, which covers over 42 million Americans, offers workers up to 12 weeks of unpaid, job-guaranteed leave for child birth, adoption, or personal or family illness.

Another burden on small businesses.


President Clinton granted waivers to 25 states -- half the nation --providing for comprehensive welfare reform demonstrations.

It only took three tries to get it passed. This was a Republican isssue that he co-opted. if it weren't for Republicans, this would ahve never seen the light of day.


President Clinton cut the federal bureaucracy by more than 100,000 positions.And, he reduced the White House staff by 25 percent.

Aside from the 5 potential blow job candidates that were let go form the White House staff, you realize these cuts came from the military? What an awesome move! If we had those folks back, you think korea would be talking the smack they are now?


Under the President's Direct Student Loan program, students can borrow money directly from the government at a lower interest rate and with many flexible repayment options, including the option to repay with a percentage of their after-graduation salary. Taxpayers will save at least $4.3 billion over five years.

Great, more defaulted student loans that will never be payed back.


The Clinton Administration forged a bipartisan coalition to pass NAFTA, after concluding tough negotiations on side agreements covering workers' rights, the environment, and import surges. Exports to Mexico rose 23 percent in the first 11 months of 1994.

Again, a republican initiative. Also, exports of our nuclear secrets and MERV technology to the Chicoms rose 100%. Thanks to bubba, the Chicoms went from barely being able to lauch a toy roket to having the capabilty to shower the West Coast with nukes. Thanks bill!


Promoting Security and Freedom Abroad

A joke catogory at best. the Haiti thing is BS as well. Last time I looked, haiti doean't border the US


Imposed strictest Administration ethics guidelines in history.

What a joke.


Waging a tough counter-terrorism campaign with stronger laws and more training for law enforcement.

We know better than this now too, don't we?

[tex]

Originally posted by redman
You have to understand: while I think certain economic policies can be beneficial or harmful, fundamentally I believe that presidents get too much credit and too much blame for the economy.

Presidents have very little real economic power as they can only effect the margins. However if a president were able to push through a blockbuster program such as universal healthcare, then the president's actions would indeed have a profound effect upon the economy.

[Storm]

Stood by and watched North Korea further develope their nuclear program. Allowed Germany and France to dictate to us how we would handle the sanctions and inspections of Iraq when it is a known fact those counties have a tremedous financial interest in the SADDAM HUSSEIN Iraq.


Actually it was Clinton who agreed to give N Korea food and fuel in exchange for them shutthing down their nuclear program--which worked well. We actually have a treaty with them for this effect. the Bush government defaulted on these food and fuel agreements and thats why N Korea is doing the current Saber rattling.

Meanwhile if you really want to place blame on the Iraq situation today you can go as far back as 1981 when the Reagan govt sold Saddam all his stock of chemical weapons precursors and Anthrax. He used the chemicals to gas that kurdish town. Once the gassing was done the first thing the Reagan govt did was try to shift the blame to the Iranian side but that didnt fly. It was also Bush Sr who kept Saddam in power.

[Storm]

Originally posted by phanatic
So the answer to this is to increase taxes on those who make the money? I don't think so! If continually tax the top half of wage earners in the nation you drive down the ablity of those individuals to cotribute to the economy. Can't spend as much. Increasing taxes has never stimulated the economy.

However you want to characterize it it led to seven years of continuous and unprecedented economic growth. I think its simplistic to assume that the govts policies had nothing to do with this.

[Ignatius J.]

redman,

as far as the british- U.S. Thing, I admitted that I wasn't very clear on the issue, I was fairly young when Clinton took office.

I am by no means a clinton apologist, and if you read my initial post my attribution of the current violence to bush was more in passing than anything else, it certainly occured around the same time so you can forgive my misconception there.

However, this does not discount clinton's earlier work with arafat. While we have certainly slid all the way back down the hill, we should remember that progress was made at one point. Clinton played a major role in that development. We might be living in a very different world right now without the assasination of Rabin.


-DB

[phishhead]

Republican, Democrat, left wing, right wing..It doesn't matter.
Politicians are criminals. This whole thread is crap. But thats my opinion.

[Mad Mike]

Originally posted by Storm



Actually it was Clinton who agreed to give N Korea food and fuel in exchange for them shutthing down their nuclear program--which worked well. We actually have a treaty with them for this effect. the Bush government defaulted on these food and fuel agreements and thats why N Korea is doing the current Saber rattling.

Meanwhile if you really want to place blame on the Iraq situation today you can go as far back as 1981 when the Reagan govt sold Saddam all his stock of chemical weapons precursors and Anthrax. He used the chemicals to gas that kurdish town. Once the gassing was done the first thing the Reagan govt did was try to shift the blame to the Iranian side but that didnt fly. It was also Bush Sr who kept Saddam in power.

N. Korea broke the treaty and was continuing to develop it's Nuclear program. They admited they this. THAT is why this is happening. If you think this is Bush's fault you are an idiot.

As for Iraq we made a mistake in judgment in an efort to hold Iran at bay. You remember the Iran hostage situation? At the time they were considered the biggest threat. Bush Sr. untill the invasion of Kuwait was following the continuing policy of trying to guide Iraq into becoming a more moderate state. To say "It was also Bush Sr who kept Saddam in power." is a blatant misrepresentation of the truth to put it mildly.

[Mad Mike]

Originally posted by Storm


However you want to characterize it it led to seven years of continuous and unprecedented economic growth. I think its simplistic to assume that the govts policies had nothing to do with this.

No. It is simplistic to think Clinton had anything to do with the "economic growth". In reality it was the burst of technological growth which in turn fueled the internet bubble. Unless you think Al Gore acualy *did* invent the internet, Clinton had NOTHING to do with it. Nor did Bush's election have anything to do with the bubble bursting. THAT was happening before Bush took office.

[Sarge]

Actually it was Clinton who agreed to give N Korea food and fuel in exchange for them shutthing down their nuclear program--which worked well. We actually have a treaty with them for this effect. the Bush government defaulted on these food and fuel agreements and thats why N Korea is doing the current Saber rattling.

You need to check your facts. We did have a deal with the N Koreans as you described. However, it was a goatrope. North Korea kept right on with their nuke program all the while getting paid by us. How phucking stupid was that? That's like me saying, "I'll pay you a hundred bucks a month not to screw my sister", yet you keep on doing her all the while getting paid. Bush quit the terms of the sham "treaty" because we were giving them food and fuel for nothing. You aren't stupid enough to think they just started their nuke program up out of the blue, do you? Actaully, because we are such chumps......er, uh....nice guys, we're still giving them food as a "humanitarian" gesture. Too bad that food feeds their military.

[Buford]

Could the same question be asked for the last 4 Presidents?

What exactly did they do?

Someone should start 3 new threads

Ronnie, Georgie and Georgie II. What did they do also?

[Henry]

Originally posted by redman
Clinton is one of those who gets too much credit. He was lucky in that he got to experience the greatest continuous period of economic expansion in the last 50 years. And it happened despite the fact that he raised taxes. I have yet to hear a coherent explanation as to why he gets credit for that other than to have been in office at the time.

Nothing wrong with that opinion, redman. But you'll hear the same thing from the left about Reagan and the fall of the Berlin Wall.

You asked the question. What's the point if you are simply waiting around to say "that was good luck"?

[gbear]

I'll take Nafta, government debt reduction, Gatt, keeping the peace for the most part, increasing international respect for America, and I'll go out on a limb and say he was ahead of his time on his healthcare propposal.

I'll even grant that the first three were a combination of him and a Republican congress. What I have to ask is why we aren't having similar things happen under a republican administration? We get steel tarrifs. We get record defecits even if you dont' count the war spending. We get increases in government. I'm sorry, but Republicans might have been able to take all of the credit if they had continued along the path once Clinton was gone.

In the keeping the peace department, I think many on here discount that slick willy was very adept at keeping everybody passably happy. Even though the intafada had begun, he had cease fires there and in Northern Ireland. I know, you'll say it was only temporary and didn't last. I can only reply, a permanent truce has to start somewhere, and it's hard for that to happen while everybody is shooting and blowing themselves up.

I think his ability to appear to compromise also greatly increased America's prestige. You might say it was increased by doing wrong things, but I tend to think many on this board count international opinion a little lightly. With a sister in Germany, I hear all the time about the differences in opinions on Americanism now as apposed to 5 years ago. Clinton would never have just rejected UN emmissions standards. He would have gone along with them while they were in the news and killed them in congress when the spotlight was elsewhere. He was very adept at managing opinion here and abroad. That's something I'm not sure the right ever appreciated.

I'll also go out on a limb and say that with increasing healthcare costs, don't be surprised to see a return to universal healthcare proposals. He was just ahead of his time and to the left of center at the time. We'll see if that comes back. Only time will tell.

Of course there were lots of reasons not to like him as president. I wasn't thrilled with him by the end either, but I'm not willing to discount what he accomplished either.

[Kilmer17]

The problem with this thread is that it asks what he accomplished. The answer is he accomplished alot. The real issue though is what did he accomplish that was/is helpful. A different animal.

My answer is a short list.
1- NAFTA. A great program IMO.
2- He passed GOP sponsored Welfare Reform (albeit after 3 tries, but it still passed)
3- He re-energized the GOP. And shifted the swing voters away from the Dems. This was obviously unintentional, but a huge benefit for our country.

[Buford]

I don't know if he helped the GOP win. If Clinton ran again in 2000, he would of crushed G.W.. How sad is that?

[Kilmer17]

There is no way you could prove that Bandit, and no way I could disprove it. But just to play along.

No he couldnt. W would have destroyed him.

[Buford]

W. barely beat a boring Gore. How would he of crushed the more popular guy?

[Kilmer17]

I would argue that Gore would have won if it werent for Clinton. He lost the middle of the road voters.

Again, neither of us can prove this, but the fact remains that the GOP is much more powerful now than it was in 96.

[Buford]

fair enough. Its all in cycles. The people vote for one group, then that group gets a few years to let everybody down....then the other guys get elected and get their years.

The Circle of Life.........................errr Politics.

[Art]

Bufford,

You're dead wrong on the last part of this. Bush and Gore both received more votes than Clinton in either of his runs for office. Both Gore and Bush would have beaten Clinton handily in a head to head race. People tend to remember Clinton as something more popular than he was. He wasn't that popular. He would have gotten shelled in an election race this time around with just about any competent opponent.

As for Clinton and what he did there are a few points that are good here, but good is relative since there's very much a counterbalancing point to go with it. The economy was booming. We entered a new age and Clinton was the leader during this time. While credit can be given, what can't be ignored is the widespread and unchecked corruption in business during that time. The scandals of Enron, Global Crossing, Worldcom and the dozens of others were going on during Clinton's watch too. So, he deserves similar credit for being the man in office during the greatest period of economic growth in our history just as he deserves similar blame for being the man in office during the greatest period of economic fraud in our history. Except, he ran the SEC and didn't get it to make a difference, unlike Bush's SEC which has done more to uncover and punish the fraud than anything Clinton's SEC did in eight years.

Clinton deserves credit for "peace"? I'm not sure how, but, please bear in mind, Clinton wanted his Presidential legacy to be peace in the Middle East. Before he left office he told Arafat that his mistake as President was thinking he could work with Arafat and he helped poison the waters with the Bush administration by telling Powell not to work with Arafat as he can't be trusted. So, in the end, his major aim as a President was to bring peace to a region and he failed. If that's his legacy, so be it, but, it wasn't a positive end. It was a sad one.

Earlier in this thread someone wrote that raising taxes to pay down the budget is not a bad thing. First off, yes it is. More in a second on that. More importantly though, the deficit didn't start to come down until the last couple to few years of the Clinton White House when the economic boom was just outrageous, especially gains on the market that fed revenue. Still, it's ludicrous to be so brainwashed to think it's not a bad thing to raise taxes to pay down the debt. It's always a bad thing to raise taxes. The only time it's an ok thing is during a period of war. The reason it was a bad thing for Clinton is because he could simply have cut government spending. He didn't.

He could have done the good thing of paying down the debt by simply spending less than they brought in. It's a novel concept, but, people need to understand, if the government took 100 percent of our earnings and still had a deficit, they'd have to cut spending. So, my thought is, let's start that cutting now. :)

Overall Clinton was not a President that got a lot done. He was impeached. He had a hostile Congress on one side of him and he had his own lack of center to guide him and he was guided poorly by not really standing for anything but what was the majority view in polls. Leadership by poll does not make a President good. Bush is an interesting guy to judge now as he seems to lead from positions that aren't clearly the popular view. How this will effect him down the road remains to be seen.

[Buford]

Art, you're always right.


seriously though, I am not talking about numbers. The totals for every election are different, especially if its going to be a close one. People feel that if their guy is either way ahead or getting blown away, they don't need to vote. That wasn't the case in 2000.

As much of a dirty perv as Clinton is, I think he would of beaten Bush. Especially in the debates. Doesn't matter if what he is saying is true or not. The guy can talk and connect with a crowd while not looking like he was reading the teleprompter. Gore looked stale and boring while reading the prompter and Bush looked at times like he didn't fully understand what he was saying. He's got smart people writing for him.

[Riggo-toni]

Originally posted by DrunkenBoxer
This new flare up in violence int he middle east came immediately after bush took office.
-DB

This is simply not true. The flare up in Palestinian violence came when Clinton was pressuring Barak and Arafat into a settlement on the status of Jerusalem. Barak agreed to give back 95% of the West Bank, along with part of Isreal proper to equal 100% in land the areas taken in the 67 war. In addition, Barak agreed to a Palestinian capital in East Jerusalem. Rabin's widow decried Barak's concessions, saying her husband would be turning in his grave if he could see what Barak was giving up. Arafat still refused to make a commitment, since doing so would cause him to lose support of his primary base - which is not West Bank residents but rather diaspora Palestinians opposed to any compromises with Israel that might diminish their right of return. Clinton applied more and more pressure, and the radical Palestinian element used a visit by Sharon to the Temple Mount as a pretense for returning to the Intifada and rioting. All this was happening while Clinton was still in office, and Bush merely inherited it.

[Riggo-toni]

Some points about the Clinton Presidency from a non-Republican, non-Democrat (In case you don't read my posts, I'm a Libertarian)

Clinton made two major accomplishments on the Economic front that he deserves considerable credit for: NAFTA and GATT. He took the lead in both situations and assembled bi-partisan support. Steel exports quintupled in the 90s, and the average salary in export-related industries was I believe around 50% higher than other industries. Clinton was actually far more principled regarding free trade than W (who passed damaging tariffs on steel imports as a sop to Union Workers).

Clinton's successes in the economy and particularly in the budget were primarily due to concessions he made to the GOP congress. In particular, most of the increases in revenue were primarily from capital gains, not from his '93 tax increases. The capital gains tax cut that Congress finally got through in the mid-90s did exactly what its proponents claimed it would do. It actually increased revenue and created an entire new "investor class" of middle-class Americans (approx 50% of the population now owns stocks either directly or through mutual funds). Clinton's original budget proposals had $200billion dollar deficits projected for over 10 years. Again, credit should go to the supposedly "extreme" GOP House for extending the limits set in the Bush 1990 agreement through 2000. Also, the Congress was the leading force behind "ending welfare as we know it." To Clinton's credit, he recognized the public support behind these movements and signed off on them. He had a brilliantly effective procedure for capitalizing on all these things. He would start off by vocally opposing such measures as "extreme" or callous, and threaten to veto them. Then, when it became obvious the legislation would go through, he would demand some insignificant token additions that he would claim would "protect innocent Americans" from whatever social ramifications. Had things backfired, he could then have claimed he was opposed to them, but had things forced down his throat. When things went successfully, particularly in the case of wlefare or the budget, he would subsequently claim he was behind them from the beginning, and claim all credit for them.
One thing Clinton did push for, that Congress refused to deliver, was a reform of Corporate practices and conflicts of interest. This might well have prevented the severity of scandals like Enron,but it's hard to say.
By the same token, the GOP congress is to blame for letting spending and the budget go back to he!l in a handbasket. Hastert, who replaced Gingrich, turned out to be a horrid choice for the country. He made political deals by following the example of 80s Dems - buying everyone off with pork.

[JackC]

Art,

Isn't it true that reforms requested by the Clinton SEC were shot down by the Republican congress?


Clinton would have crushed W like a grape in 2000 IMHO!

[luckydevil]

Clinton would have beaten Bush, but it would have been close

[Henry]

I think I sense a poll in our midst. :)

[gbear]

I wanted to add one more thing Clinton did or benefited from (depends how one looks at it). I thik Clinton inspired some confidence in his ability to handle the economy. I think a lot of the stock markets volitility relates to the misguided but still prevanlent belief that Bush is an idiot. People still worry he'll mess things up more. I agree though I disagree with the rationale.

I think people generally thought Clinton was doing a good job sheperding the economy. They trusted him to do right by the economy no matter how wrong he was in his private life. To some extent, that positive belief in him was self fulfilling. Even though it's been pointed out on here many times that the inflection point in our economy's growth happened under Clinton, most people still believed the economy was going to be okay. I'd also argue that the lack of belief in Bush has hurt the economy. Confidence in the economy was sky high under Clinton (unreasonably so) and it's down in the dumps now (exagerated fears).

The ability to make people believe everything was going to be alright is an underappreciated gift of the Clinton presidency that probably prolonged the boom times.

[luckydevil]

gbear................ good......cough.........cough...........post

[inmate running the asylum]

What did Clinton accomplish in office?

He had a good time with Monica. :laugh: