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STaylor#21
July-18th-2008, 10:39 AM
http://mvn.com/nfl-redskins/2008/07/17/just-how-good-were-the-redskins-dbs-last-year/

Just How Good were the Redskins DB’s Last Year? (http://mvn.com/nfl-redskins/2008/07/17/just-how-good-were-the-redskins-dbs-last-year/)

By Greg Trippiedi (http://mvn.com/nfl-redskins/author/greg.trippiedi) | July 17th, 2008


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Among some legitimate reasons for Redskins fans to temper their expectations for the upcoming season is that the defensive backfield is thin, tragedy ravaged, and aging. For an analyst that is unfamiliar with the team, it could be forgiven if a quick glance at the roster shows a unit which is deeply void of talent.

After all, merely a year before last, the Redskins DB’s set all sorts of records for blown coverages, missed tackles, and yards/points against. But when we start to dig deeper into the pieces and production of the 2007 Redskin DBs, we find that what occured last season was perhaps the greatest rebound by a single unit in NFL History.

Sean Taylor

In 2006, Sean Taylor was pretty good against the run, for a safety, but horrible against the pass.

In 2007, Sean’s numbers against the run regressed, likely due entirely to the philosophical switch that kept him in deep coverage most of the time.

That switch must have done some good, because in 2007, Sean Taylor was — for half a season at least — unquestionably the best safety in all of football.

Opposing quarterbacks who targeted Taylor (foolishly, but perhaps based on 2006 scouting reports), something that happened 18 times in 2007, were rarely successful. Taylor ranked 2nd in the NFL in Stop Rate among safeties, creating a ’successful play’ 68% of the times he was targeted. Taylor picked 5 of those 18 passes off, and allowed 2.7 yards…per play when he was targeted (remember, dude was a safety), firmly making him the best statistical safety in the NFL last year.

Taylor’s rebound was the most significant reason for the team rebound, but certainly not the only one, as evidenced by the team playing shutdown pass D down the stretch without him.

Shawn Springs

In 2004, Shawn Springs signed a 6 year contract with the Redskins. No one expected him to play it out, but here we are in the 5th year of the deal, and not only is he still around, but he’s the best CB on the team. In fact, that doesn’t nearly begin to do him justice.

Springs was a pro bowler in 2004. In 2005, he was the NFL’s best CB, per Stop Rate. After an injury riddled 2006, Springs returned to the lineup last year, and again led the NFL in Stop Rate for CBs, pitching in a Taylor-esque 62. He also held opposing receivers to 6.0 yards per pass attempt, which ranks him in the top ten in the NFL in that metric.

All of that is even more impressive when you consider that Springs was targeted 94 times by opposing QBs, most on the entire team.

Thing was, if the first seven games of the season were any indication, Springs wouldn’t have been the best CB in the NFC last year if not for one injured knee to a teammate.

Carlos Rogers

When I referred to Rogers as the “X factor of the 2007 Redskins”, I had no idea that he would perform so well, and yet, have his season shortened by half.

Rogers, in seven games, was targeted 37 times by opposing QBs (not enough to qualify for the leader’s rankings), and posted a 66% stop rate, and gave up a stingy 5.7 Y/A against. That stop rate was the best in the entire NFL, and had he qualified for it, that 5.7 Y/A against would have ranking him as a top 5 corner in the NFL, just behind Nnamdi Asomugha and Champ Bailey.

The fact that his season was cut short means you have to take those statistics with a grain of salt regarding Rogers: perhaps given more time in the lineup, those would have evened out. Additionally, we may never see Rogers perform at this level again, being that he’s coming off major knee surgery.

But at the very least, Gregg Williams is off the hook for that draft pick. Rogers has clearly shaken the bust label, and although he may never play at this level again, he should become a fixture in the starting lineup for years to come.

Fred Smoot

When Rogers went down for the year, the oft hurt but never silenced Smoot jumped right into the lineup, and just happened to produce the best season of his career. For so long, Smoot’s biggest knock was that he was soft against the run. So, I guess it’s ironic that when his team needed Fred Smoot the most, his biggest impact on the game was his run defense: Smoot was the best corner in the league against the run last year, giving up a paltry 2.1 yards per carry when opponents attacked him on the outside. 90% of the time, those runs were charted as “unsuccessful”, by far the top percentage in the league for a corner.

Smoot was money against the pass as well. Teams that through against Smoot averaged 5.6 Y/A, third best in the NFL among cornerbacks.

Reed Doughty

Reed Doughty was the biggest surprise of the season last year. He’s got a reputation as a run stuffing safety, and the numbers certainly suggest that’s his craft: No. 2 among all safeties in yards allowed per rush attempt (3.8). The team probably feels he can be a run stuffing dynamo (thanks, Mel Kiper) for the next ten years for them.

Where Doughty was more surprising was against the pass, where he actually had the numbers of a top no. 2 safety. Doughty ranked 26th in stop rate last year and 29th among safeties last year with 6.6 yards per attempt against the pass.

LaRon Landry

Landry gave up 4.4 yards per pass in which he was targeted last year, which places him at 6th in the NFL by that measure among safeties. Here’s the fun part: the guy was a rookie who played his best football after he didn’t have Sean Taylor to show him the ropes any more.

Landry wasn’t all that great against the run last year, which was a bigger problem when he was at Strong Safety than it was after he moved to free. However, there’s no reason to think that Landry won’t be a pro bowler in the very, very near future.

Review

The Redskins, despite all the luck that went against them last season, clearly struck gold as they tried to fix the defensive backfield from it’s 2006 performance. In the process, they found tons of optimism for the future. Though a lot of that optimism was squelched along with the death of Sean Taylor, there are still building blocks in this backfield. Rogers, Smoot, Doughty, and Landry will create a great core for the team to build around, in both the near and distant future.

Sean Taylor may have gotten the pro bowl nod from this group, but in essence, his selection was indicative of the job this entire unit did last season, turning the mess that was 2006 into a playoff run in 2007.

Source: Pro Football Prospectus 2008

Zzj
July-18th-2008, 10:46 AM
very nice. thank you.

CaptChaos86
July-18th-2008, 10:55 AM
Nice read, although i do disagree that Carlos wont play at the level he was last year again. I think he will come back and have a great year, and become the shutdown corner we havent has since Champ left. Im guilty or ripping on him but he was playing some ball last year before his injury. Just please dear god no more 30 yard cushions.

Morneblade
July-18th-2008, 10:57 AM
Which is why we need DL help. Ranked 16th against the pass and apparently it wasnt due to crappy DB play. But I've been saying that for years now, a bad DL makes an apparently great DB core look very average. Hopefully well get more pressure on the QB this year.

Lombardi's_kid_brother
July-18th-2008, 11:10 AM
Interesting article. Hard to argue with it, but I think there is a lot to be concerned about.

Taylor, obviously, is gone. Springs is old. Rogers is coming off a major injury. And Smoot seriously out-performed all his career metrics.

In baseball, stat geeks generally know the age when you can expect a hitter to begin a steep decline. At 33, Springs would seem to be past that age for a CB. Maybe he will keep performing at a high level, but - at some pont - a sharp decline is bound to happen. Or will it?

Smoot is intriging. Who knows if 2007 was an aberration or not? He is young enough that it is conceivable that he is actually on an upward trend. He is probably the key DB next year. If he continues to play at a high level, the secondary should be fine. If he regresses to his career mean, the secondary could be in trouble.

Rogers. It all depends on health.

Landry will be fine.

Doughty will be interesting to watch. Maybe he is as good as he appeared. Maybe teams will study tape and figure out his weaknesses.

I think the secondary will ultimately be fine next year, but there are some long-term issues in it.

darrelgreenie
July-18th-2008, 11:35 AM
I hope the coaching staff doesn't needlessly shake up our secondary.

Keep Landry at FS - Doughty at SS.

ESPN has our secondary rated #12 and we were 16th against the pass last year, that ain't bad fellas.

Alot people talk about our depth but i don't think very many teams have a better nickleback than Leigh Torrence. People have been speaking highly of the rookie J.T Tryon as well.

I can't freakin wait for the season!
:cheers:
http://www.extremeskins.org/NYG07/NYG069.JPG


http://www.extremeskins.org/Cowboys07/DAL021.JPG

http://www.extremeskins.org/NYG07/NYG088.JPG

pictures from the murf

Spartacus87
July-18th-2008, 12:31 PM
Carlos Rogers

When I referred to Rogers as the “X factor of the 2007 Redskins”, I had no idea that he would perform so well, and yet, have his season shortened by half.

Rogers, in seven games, was targeted 37 times by opposing QBs (not enough to qualify for the leader’s rankings), and posted a 66% stop rate, and gave up a stingy 5.7 Y/A against. That stop rate was the best in the entire NFL, and had he qualified for it, that 5.7 Y/A against would have ranking him as a top 5 corner in the NFL, just behind Nnamdi Asomugha and Champ Bailey. Uh ohhhh.

Blind Rogers haters, please stand up.

Hello?

Hunter_R
July-18th-2008, 12:39 PM
Will Rogers and Doughty get more respect around here? Not a chance, but I do love the praise they got in the article.


Uh ohhhh.

Blind Rogers haters, please stand up.

Hello?
They'll think of something. Doughty haters, too.

CPortJGibbs89
July-18th-2008, 12:43 PM
Excellent read, I knew our secondary was playing great ball but I didnt know that good. Gets me very pumped up for next season but also makes me miss ST....

No Excuses
July-18th-2008, 12:48 PM
We were having a great season defensively until the injuries hit in the secondary.

Now only if the offense can score some points in the 2nd half :doh::rolleyes:

Thinking Skins
July-18th-2008, 12:56 PM
Which is why we need DL help. Ranked 16th against the pass and apparently it wasnt due to crappy DB play. But I've been saying that for years now, a bad DL makes an apparently great DB core look very average. Hopefully well get more pressure on the QB this year.

But Morneblade, the article points out that so many of our DBs were having their best years of their careers last year. How much of that do you think was due to the pressure from our D-Line?

I know we had a secondary coach/cornerback coach problem in 2006 as well, I wonder how much that problem contributed to the poor performances in 2006. All in all, I think the main problem we have to worry about on our defense is the scheme. As much as I want to have faith in Blache, you got me worried (at least I think it was you), when you brought up the Transition from Marvin Lewis's defense to whoever it was after him, and how badly our defense dropped. If Blache can do a good job with this transition, I think we can be a dominant defense this year.

Califan007
July-18th-2008, 01:02 PM
Uh ohhhh.

Blind Rogers haters, please stand up.

Hello?
"He cost us the Seattle game in the 2005 playoffs!! I'll never forgive him for that!! He plays 50 yards off the line!! He can't catch a cold!! We could have had Ware!!"

(just thought I'd help 'em out a bit lol)...

ouvan59
July-18th-2008, 01:29 PM
Which is why we need DL help. Ranked 16th against the pass and apparently it wasnt due to crappy DB play. But I've been saying that for years now, a bad DL makes an apparently great DB core look very average. Hopefully well get more pressure on the QB this year.

I'm not sure that says that at all. We were second in the entire NFL in pass attempts against behind only Minnesota. Only two teams in the entire NFL were better than us in yards per pass attempt against (Pittsburgh & Indianapolis). Our QB rating against was top 10 as was our 20+ yard gains against. Teams decided to throw because they couldn't run on us. Our #16 ranking is due to the fact that teams had to throw so many times not because our D-line didn't do their job.

STBonecrusher21
July-18th-2008, 02:17 PM
Sean Taylor

In 2006, Sean Taylor was pretty good against the run, for a safety, but horrible against the pass.

In 2007, Sean’s numbers against the run regressed, likely due entirely to the philosophical switch that kept him in deep coverage most of the time.

That switch must have done some good, because in 2007, Sean Taylor was — for half a season at least — unquestionably the best safety in all of football.

Opposing quarterbacks who targeted Taylor (foolishly, but perhaps based on 2006 scouting reports), something that happened 18 times in 2007, were rarely successful. Taylor ranked 2nd in the NFL in Stop Rate among safeties, creating a ’successful play’ 68% of the times he was targeted. Taylor picked 5 of those 18 passes off, and allowed 2.7 yards…per play when he was targeted (remember, dude was a safety), firmly making him the best statistical safety in the NFL last year.

Taylor’s rebound was the most significant reason for the team rebound, but certainly not the only one, as evidenced by the team playing shutdown pass D down the stretch without him.

:notworthy :notworthy :notworthy

We miss you Sean!

TheLongshot
July-18th-2008, 02:34 PM
Smoot is intriging. Who knows if 2007 was an aberration or not? He is young enough that it is conceivable that he is actually on an upward trend. He is probably the key DB next year. If he continues to play at a high level, the secondary should be fine. If he regresses to his career mean, the secondary could be in trouble.

I think some discounted Smoot because he didn't do well with the Vikes, but in his first stint here he did quite well. I'm not surprised that he was able to step up and play big when it counted.


I'm not sure that says that at all. We were second in the entire NFL in pass attempts against behind only Minnesota. Only two teams in the entire NFL were better than us in yards per pass attempt against (Pittsburgh & Indianapolis). Our QB rating against was top 10 as was our 20+ yard gains against. Teams decided to throw because they couldn't run on us. Our #16 ranking is due to the fact that teams had to throw so many times not because our D-line didn't do their job.

Also, the defensive philosophy last year was to force opponents to play little ball. Teams were going to rack up some yards, but the point was to force a mistake that would either turn the ball over or force a punt.

Jason

Morneblade
July-18th-2008, 02:51 PM
But Morneblade, the article points out that so many of our DBs were having their best years of their careers last year. How much of that do you think was due to the pressure from our D-Line?

We didnt get that much pressure from the D-line.


I know we had a secondary coach/cornerback coach problem in 2006 as well, I wonder how much that problem contributed to the poor performances in 2006. All in all, I think the main problem we have to worry about on our defense is the scheme. As much as I want to have faith in Blache, you got me worried (at least I think it was you), when you brought up the Transition from Marvin Lewis's defense to whoever it was after him, and how badly our defense dropped. If Blache can do a good job with this transition, I think we can be a dominant defense this year.

Nope wasnt me on that. My thing is how bad Blaches defenses were in Chicago. Here are the things that stand out to me:

Blache was supposedly have had alot of input in play calling last year, upwards to 60%. I dont know for sure about this, but that is what the 'pro Blache" people were saying. It also points how the defense changed from 04'-05'.

Blitzes stopped coming and cushions got deeper. I see alot of people using "bend but dont break" as a Williams style of defence. You people are IDIOTS. That was BLache, people. Look at Tennessee, Buffalo and Washington 04-05. THAT was Williams.

Aggressive.

I think we'll see more of the same this year, in terms of things that drive us nuts. Big cushions. D-line that worries about the run first on every play. No blitzing. Those are the kinds of things that kill a secondary, and ours played pretty damn will with that lack of support. This was the Chicago Defense that Blache had. Even in their lone "great season", middle of the pack in yards given up. And tended to be in the bottom 3rd in passing defense. Maybe our new D-Line coach will have our guys attacking more than Blache did.

TheLongshot
July-18th-2008, 03:18 PM
Blitzes stopped coming and cushions got deeper. I see alot of people using "bend but dont break" as a Williams style of defence. You people are IDIOTS. That was BLache, people. Look at Tennessee, Buffalo and Washington 04-05. THAT was Williams.

Aggressive.

And it destroyed Williams in 2006. Every time we tried to be aggressive in 2006, we got burned by it. Even in 2005 we saw signs that teams were getting wise to the blitz and we didn't do it quite as often.

I think fans like aggressive, because people would rather lose by "doing something" rather than being more passive and letting things come to you. Course, it doesn't always make for a better defense. When you blitz, you are running the risk of leaving a player open if you don't disguise it well enough.

Jason

Lombardi's_kid_brother
July-18th-2008, 04:24 PM
And it destroyed Williams in 2006. Every time we tried to be aggressive in 2006, we got burned by it. Even in 2005 we saw signs that teams were getting wise to the blitz and we didn't do it quite as often.

I think fans like aggressive, because people would rather lose by "doing something" rather than being more passive and letting things come to you. Course, it doesn't always make for a better defense. When you blitz, you are running the risk of leaving a player open if you don't disguise it well enough.

Jason

Aggressively blitzing defenses tend to be gimmicky. And they can rack up huge numbers at times but good teams generally find ways to expose them. If you follow Lebeau in Pittsburgh, you can see that the years in which he blitzes the least tend to be the years when he is most successful. Last year, they blitzed like crazy, and couldn't stop anyone in December and January.

The problem with a blitz is that it pretty much has to work. The only coach who seems to consistently get away with blitzing at insanely high levels is Johnson in Philly.

Titaw
July-18th-2008, 06:49 PM
The fact of the matter is simple there is a trickle down effect in football as far as coaching is concerned. Gibbs had a set # when he wanted to slow down the game. Didn't you ever notice that when Gibbs and CO. were ahead by 14-17 points the play calling on BOTH sides of the ball became more conservative.

Gibbs says to Williams, "bend don't break. Let their O have the ball for a long time to eat up the clock." Williams passes this to his assitants and so forth. The reason why we looked PUTRID with a lead was simple, Gibbs' MO was to allow the opponent to move the ball, but chew up alot of clock in the process.

Hopefully, Zorn will remain aggressive and won't tell Blache to call off the dogs.

RIDETHEWALRUS
July-19th-2008, 12:10 AM
While I agree with the assessment, it is hard to take it seriously when it is riddled with spelling errors. Does the man not have spellcheck?

If he puts so little effort into the publication, it is hard to trust the effort in the number crunching and analysis.

RenegadeTK
July-19th-2008, 12:20 AM
VERY interesting read. odd statistics you dont hear much about either. it just gets me more pumped for this upcoming season....

thesubmittedone
July-19th-2008, 03:38 AM
This thread needs to be bookmarked for whenever the inevitable time arises that anyone feels the need to bash our DBs or repeat the same old arguments that have no bearing anymore against them. This article should put it all to rest really.

veteranskinsfan
July-19th-2008, 04:40 AM
After Smoot and Springs there is a considerable drop off in talent level in the secondary with the exception of Laundry. Lets hope the younger guys have a great year especially the nickel back. We need good cover guys and defenders who can tackle; so for example, what should have been a 10 yard completion actually does not turn into a 20 yard pass and run play. Nothing worse when the nickel back comes into the game and then the opposing QB throws right at him and gets a first down. The lineman get tired too. We need our offense in the game for more plays this year controlling the clock and generating more touchdowns compared to last year. Hopefully the D-line will be more effective this year and the front four will generate a better pass rush so we do not have to blitz the linebackers as often. I really like a surprise corner blitz every once in a while too.

mudhog
July-19th-2008, 06:02 AM
I thought it was a fantastic article. It really says something about how our guys stepped it up in the second half of the 2007 season, after the death of Taylor and the loss of Rogers.

I like how the story shed light on the fact that ST played his best football after GW finally bent his scheme and relocated a player to play to his strength, rather than shaping the player to the scheme. The 2006 GW-EGO would for some reason not allow this kind of out-of-the-box thinking, which eventually contributed to the downward spiral of our D. I remember how much of an ass I thought GW was being in 2006 during TC with some of his comments to players and it continued to the regular season games. Besides the many injuries we had to that D that decimated us, GW's loss of respect among the Vets in 2006 was the singular damming nail in the coffin for us. Of course, this is only my opinion. I think GW learned alot in 2006, about the men, scheme and his own ego. This made it easy for him to move LL to FS after Sean's passing.

Now this year we are already addressing the scheme to player correlation up front, with our safety's abilities. It can only be a good thing.

Hail

Morneblade
July-19th-2008, 10:49 AM
And it destroyed Williams in 2006. Every time we tried to be aggressive in 2006, we got burned by it. Even in 2005 we saw signs that teams were getting wise to the blitz and we didn't do it quite as often.

I think fans like aggressive, because people would rather lose by "doing something" rather than being more passive and letting things come to you. Course, it doesn't always make for a better defense. When you blitz, you are running the risk of leaving a player open if you don't disguise it well enough.

Jason

We were aggressive for about 2-3 games and got burned trying to blitz Arch. Then we tried to use him in coverage which was not the reason we went out and got him and we sat on our heels the rest of the 06 season. CB's started to get off the WR's more and more. And it got ugly. Lack of a pass rush from your front 4 will do that.