Bullfighting

[Heisenberg]

Before watching 60 Minutes last night I had no clue what a unbelieveably cruel "sport" this was. After checking out Youtube and seeing the torture these animals must go through before being killed - all for entertainment of a rowdy crowd is pretty disturbing.


I think the countries that still practice this form of "traditional" entertainment should be ashamed.

[dcnativenerd]

Yeah, bullfighting is an extremely cruel and inhumane sport, and I'm not a crazed animal rights person. I think it's a terrible exhibition of animal cruelty.

[Rdskn4Lyf21]

Did you see that guy get tossed?

That douchebag deserved it. God didn't put animals on this earth for humans to abuse and harass them...

[PokerPacker]

someone was just talking about this yesterday. they wondered why it was called bullfighting because the only thing they knew of bullfighting was the guy with the flag and dodging the bull. he didn't know that they actually stab it until it dies (I think the objective is to get it in the heart?)

[Ray Brown]

you're entitled to your opinion on it, but its never going to change. bull fighting/**** fighting, whatever is part of a culture and will remain that way.

[Prosperity]

yes, animals deserve moral consideration, they should not be killed in such a way for entertainment, though you'd probably find animals killed for the sake of gluttony treated in a worse way

[Heisenberg]

you're entitled to your opinion on it, but its never going to change. bull fighting/**** fighting, whatever is part of a culture and will remain that way.


Eventually it will AT LEAST go underground I would have to think.


This is the cruelest exhibition I have ever seen - and as one other poster put it, I'm no crazed PETA member or anything. The bull sits there bleeding to death, moaning and grunting, all to the amusement of the crowd while being harassed by the guys with their capes or whatever while they continually stab it, once the bull is laying on the ground they cut ears off and stab it in the head and then drag the body around on the back of a horse - all while the bull is still alive.

It's incredible that this is allowed to go on in "civilized" countries.

[Ray Brown]

Eventually it will AT LEAST go underground I would have to think.


This is the cruelest exhibition I have ever seen - and as one other poster put it, I'm no crazed PETA member or anything. The bull sits there bleeding to death, moaning and grunting, all to the amusement of the crowd while being harassed by the guys with their capes or whatever while they continually stab it, once the bull is laying on the ground they cut ears off and stab it in the head and then drag the body around on the back of a horse - all while the bull is still alive.

It's incredible that this is allowed to go on in "civilized" countries.

i'm not saying its right, but i still have to disagree with the notion that it will have to go underground. I haven't seen the 60 minutes so i don't know where they were talking about, but in many countries it is widely accepted and supported, and i don't see that changing for a long, long time. In more "uncivilized" or poorer countries where a lot of cockfighting and what not goes on i don't see that every going away. those countries have much bigger problems to worry about.

[Heisenberg]

i'm not saying its right, but i still have to disagree with the notion that it will have to go underground. I haven't seen the 60 minutes so i don't know where they were talking about, but in many countries it is widely accepted and supported, and i don't see that changing for a long, long time. In more "uncivilized" or poorer countries where a lot of cockfighting and what not goes on i don't see that every going away. those countries have much bigger problems to worry about.


You're probably right, but I'm still appalled that this could go on and actually be a form of entertainment for people. It's a really sad sight to watch.

[Teller]

I think we need more of this stuff, especially in the United States. I mean hell, when was the last time you actually got to see a Christian tangle with a lion?

;)

jk

[Prosperity]

I think we need more of this stuff, especially in the United States. I mean hell, when was the last time you actually got to see a Christian tangle with a lion?

;)

jk

the good old days?

[CandaceM23]

yes, animals deserve moral consideration, they should not be killed in such a way for entertainment, though you'd probably find animals killed for the sake of gluttony treated in a worse way

That's the truth ....
Animals that are going to be slaughtered for food are treated horribly. It's quite disgusting.

[Heisenberg]

I think we need more of this stuff, especially in the United States. I mean hell, when was the last time you actually got to see a Christian tangle with a lion?

;)

jk


lol


I could go for some good ol' Gladiator type action.


:laugh:

[Teller]

lol

I could go for some good ol' Gladiator type action.

:laugh:

:)

Generally speaking, I don't have any qualms with killing animals for sport, so long as the playing field is relatively equal. (i.e. deer hunting. Yes, the hunter has a high-powered rifle, but the deer has a high-powered nose, instinct, and is in its natural habitat.) But I also want to see the animal die with as little suffering as possible; and for the meat and hide, etc, to be used productively.

Let's not pretend that humans are civilized though. We've learned to pretend that we are, pretty well. But ultimately, we're the most brutal animal there is, IMO.

[Heisenberg]

:)

Generally speaking, I don't have any qualms with killing animals for sport, so long as the playing field is relatively equal. (i.e. deer hunting. Yes, the hunter has a high-powered rifle, but the deer has a high-powered nose, instinct, and is in its natural habitat.) But I also want to see the animal die with as little suffering as possible; and for the meat and hide, etc, to be used productively.

Let's not pretend that humans are civilized though. We've learned to pretend that we are, pretty well. But ultimately, we're the most brutal animal there is, IMO.


No even playing field here, so I'm not sure whether you were arguing against my stance or not.

I don't have a problem with deer hunting, etc. but after watching the videos it's very clear that this is nothing like hunting.

[Teller]

No even playing field here, so I'm not sure whether you were arguing against my stance or not.

I don't have a problem with deer hunting, etc. but after watching the videos it's very clear that this is nothing like hunting.

I'm not agreeing, nor disagreeing. I have to plead "ignorance" on bullfighting.

I did half-watch the 60 minutes piece whilst drunk off my ass and playing madden, but I wasn't paying much attention to it.

[Heisenberg]

I'm not agreeing, nor disagreeing. I have to plead "ignorance" on bullfighting.

I did half-watch the 60 minutes piece whilst drunk off my ass and playing madden, but I wasn't paying much attention to it.


Like I said, a bunch of guys dressed in funny outfits harassing a bull and repeatedly spearing it while it bleeds out, then once it's so weak it can't support itself they take a sword and stab it repeatedly and cut the ears off, drag the body behind the horse while it's still alive - before finally slitting the throat.


The bull's fate is sealed and it has no chance - much different than hunting.

[Teller]

Like I said, a bunch of guys dressed in funny outfits harassing a bull and repeatedly spearing it while it bleeds out, then once it's so weak it can't support itself they take a sword and stab it repeatedly and cut the ears off, drag the body behind the horse while it's still alive - before finally slitting the throat.


The bull's fate is sealed and it has no chance - much different than hunting.

As you've described it (and I have no reason not to believe you) I'd be opposed to it.

[Midnight Judges]

I went to Pamplona last summer for the running of the Bulls. I didn't go into the arena to watch the Bull fighting because I just don't want to see that. Most of the people I talked to in Spain are apalled by Bull fighting. A lot of them think the running of the Bulls is for idiots as well, and it is. When I went from the crowd outside the gates into the area where the bulls run I saw some crazy mofos. And it seemed like most of the people who got gorred were Americans. At one point these two brothers from Ohio got gorred at the same time, one horn up each of their arses. They went to the hospital but were OK.

I don't think bull fighting is any better than dog fighting.

Anyway, my point is, I don't think the entire countries should be ashamed because a lot of those people don't support the bull fighting. Take away the bull fighting at the end and I don't think the running of the bulls is inhumane although it is pretty dumb.

[cbeals]

I never knew how cruel the sport was either until a friend of mine got back from her trip to spain and showed me pictures of the bull fight she watched. The bull just has hooks latched in his back bleeding, while running around and being harassed. I didn't see any pictures past that...I think she stopped watching at that point?? I surely didn't want to see any pictures past that. I still had no clue on the cutting it's ears and dragging part?? That's just terrible.

[skinsfan_1215]

Alright I'll be the guy... I went to Spain 2 years ago, and I was actually fascinated by bullfighting. The way the matadors work is imo comparable to a work of art. Sure it is brutal and certainly not for people with weak stomachs, but I'll actually disagree about the cruelty part, to a degree.

If you compare the lives of these bulls to the lives of the cows that live out crappy lives just to be slaughtered for your Mcdonalds burger, you can actually in many cases say that the slaughterhouse cows live lives that are much more cruel. The thing with the bullfight bulls is the people really have respect for them. They are treated with a sort of reverence. And accordingly, they live the life of luxury everyday of their lives until it is time for the bullfight. And I'm not saying that the way they kill them is not inhumane, because it definitely is. I'm just saying that for that 20 minutes or so that bull is suffering, but meat cows suffer their entire lives only to humanely killed at the end.

It is certainly a cultural thing for the Spanish people, even if most of them now don't support it. I found bullfighting to be one of the most intriguing parts of my trip, and I personally would not like to see it banned, despite the obvious pain the bulls suffer in the bullfight.

[Heisenberg]

Alright I'll be the guy... I went to Spain 2 years ago, and I was actually fascinated by bullfighting. The way the matadors work is imo comparable to a work of art. Sure it is brutal and certainly not for people with weak stomachs, but I'll actually disagree about the cruelty part, to a degree.

If you compare the lives of these bulls to the lives of the cows that live out crappy lives just to be slaughtered for your Mcdonalds burger, you can actually in many cases say that the slaughterhouse cows live lives that are much more cruel. The thing with the bullfight bulls is the people really have respect for them. They are treated with a sort of reverence. And accordingly, they live the life of luxury everyday of their lives until it is time for the bullfight. And I'm not saying that the way they kill them is not inhumane, because it definitely is. I'm just saying that for that 20 minutes or so that bull is suffering, but meat cows suffer their entire lives only to humanely killed at the end.

It is certainly a cultural thing for the Spanish people, even if most of them now don't support it. I found bullfighting to be one of the most intriguing parts of my trip, and I personally would not like to see it banned, despite the obvious pain the bulls suffer in the bullfight.


Fair enough, you're entitled to your opinion.

[brandymac27]

I think if they had something else to entertain themselves with, like American football or MMA (something where a lot of physical contact is involved), they wont be so fascinated with bull fighting. Then again, it is a cultural thing, so I dunno.

[skinsfan_1215]

Fair enough, you're entitled to your opinion.
I figured I wouldn't find a lot of people who would agree with me in this respect. I think pretty much the only people who would really share that opinion would be the 20% or so of Spanish people who actually still follow bullfighting.

[squatch66]

i actually saw the commercial for that story. they showed some great bullfighter getting ****ed up by the bull in the commercial. i might have to see if they have a website i can watch the story on. i agree though that it is pretty ****ty for them to kill the bull like that.

[Hersh]

Alright I'll be the guy... I went to Spain 2 years ago, and I was actually fascinated by bullfighting. The way the matadors work is imo comparable to a work of art. Sure it is brutal and certainly not for people with weak stomachs, but I'll actually disagree about the cruelty part, to a degree.

If you compare the lives of these bulls to the lives of the cows that live out crappy lives just to be slaughtered for your Mcdonalds burger, you can actually in many cases say that the slaughterhouse cows live lives that are much more cruel. The thing with the bullfight bulls is the people really have respect for them. They are treated with a sort of reverence. And accordingly, they live the life of luxury everyday of their lives until it is time for the bullfight. And I'm not saying that the way they kill them is not inhumane, because it definitely is. I'm just saying that for that 20 minutes or so that bull is suffering, but meat cows suffer their entire lives only to humanely killed at the end.

It is certainly a cultural thing for the Spanish people, even if most of them now don't support it. I found bullfighting to be one of the most intriguing parts of my trip, and I personally would not like to see it banned, despite the obvious pain the bulls suffer in the bullfight.

Having been to a bullfight many years ago, imo the matadors are not artful. They wave a flag and dodge a bull that's been so badly wounded that it is not nearly at full strength. It's chicken **** and I love when the bull gets them. As far as cows living a worse life, try buying meat at the farmers market from local farmers that grass feed. I won't say there life is great considering the end, but they aren't confined to a box.

Personally, I am opposed to all these "sports" that force animals to race or fight only to be discarded in the most cruel ways. There are easy steps to make a "sport" like horse racing safer for the animals, but HH said (and I agree) "we're the most brutal animal there is."

[d0ublestr0ker0ll]

I'd enjoy bullfighting if the humans didn't have weapons or a red cape to "olay" with.

I disagree with Skinsfan_1215, but I MORE than disagree with him that bullfighters display a "work of art" out there. Get back to me when these sidesteppers can make a song like Stevie Wonder, paint a picture like Michaelangelo, or break 90 tackles in one run like Barry Sanders.

[SkinsTerps26]

I'm torn, I am agains t animal cruelty, but a part of me loves the old romantic aesthetic of bull fighting. My grandfather was a fan for bullfighting, so much so that he took my mother when she was a child to watch it live, and although my mother is a very huge advocate for animal rights, she couldn't help but be absorbed in the whole thing.

Either way, I'm not aware of the political nature of bull fighting in other countries, nor do I know whether the popularity of the sport is dying away. But a part of me thinks that as Americans, its almost impossible to really understand the significance of this type of event. IMO, its lasted this long for a reason.

[Forehead]

I'm conflicted on this one. I've never witnessed a bullfight personally, nor do I believe I would want to.

I suppose I could sit here and condemn the matadors for their cruelty, the fact that they're being wussy by practically disabling the bull first, etc. but I can't because I happily go home and fire up my grill for steaks and burgers, so I'd feel a little hypocritical doing so.

That all being said, I don't shed any tears for the bullfighters when a bull manages to spear them. Good for the bull, I say.

BTW, did I see someone talk about moving it underground? How would you do that. I mean, underground cockfighting or dogfighting happens because there isn't much room required, but how would you possibly have an underground bullfighting ring? Aren't those things enormous?

[Heisenberg]

I'm conflicted on this one. I've never witnessed a bullfight personally, nor do I believe I would want to.

I suppose I could sit here and condemn the matadors for their cruelty, the fact that they're being wussy by practically disabling the bull first, etc. but I can't because I happily go home and fire up my grill for steaks and burgers, so I'd feel a little hypocritical doing so.

That all being said, I don't shed any tears for the bullfighters when a bull manages to spear them. Good for the bull, I say.

BTW, did I see someone talk about moving it underground? How would you do that. I mean, underground cockfighting or dogfighting happens because there isn't much room required, but how would you possibly have an underground bullfighting ring? Aren't those things enormous?


LOL maybe you're right, I didn't think that one all the way through.

Although it's unbelieveably cruel when you watch it and I'm just surprised it's allowed to go on. Growing up I remember learning about it in elementary school but from what I remember we were just taught how they used the cape to dodge the bull - I just realized in the past week exactly what goes on.