PFT: Jim Brown spills the beans on Holmgren (Indirectly Redskins Related)

[Jeffro]

http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2009/11/17/jim-brown-spills-the-beans-on-holmgren/


And here's more evidence why the Browns shouldn't give former players positions of influence in the organization.

Though we have immense respect for Jim Brown's on-field accomplishments, he tends to be a little loose in the lips when it comes to exercising discretion. The most recent example? He let the cat out of the bag today regarding the pursuit of former Packers and Seahawks coach Mike Holmgren by Browns owner Randy Lerner.

"At this moment, right now Randy Lerner is meeting with one of the great football minds in this country," Brown said at a Tuesday luncheon. "And if things work out, that person will come in to run the football side of the Browns."

Brown would not disclose the name of the person, but when asked if the person was Holmgren, Brown said, "You said it . . . and I heard it (http://www.cleveland.com/browns/index.ssf/2009/11/jim_brown_cleveland_browns_own.html)."

But if Lerner isn't also interviewing a minority candidate, he could have a problem. Earlier this year, NFL owners extended the Rooney Rule to executive-level front-office positions.

"This policy specifically requires clubs to interview at least one minority candidate as part of the hiring process for a club's senior football operations position (http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2009/06/15/nfl-extends-rooney-rule-to-senior-football-operations-jobs/), whether described as general manager, executive vice president of football operations, or otherwise," the league said in a release.

So if Lerner is, as widely reported, looking for a "football czar," he'll apparently need to conduct a search that includes a face-to-face interview with at least one minority candidate.

Then there's the question of whether a Rooney Rule-compliant search must be conducted now for an interim czar-type job and then again after the season ends for the permanent hire. This specific approach applies to hiring coaches; there's no reason to think it doesn't also apply to the senior football operations job.

We assume that Lerner is conscious of these potential glitches in the process, and that he won't put the cart before the horse. You know, like hiring a coach before hiring a G.M.


Seems like lots of teams are getting the jump on some of the big name folks avaliable in the GM/HC department.. I sure hope we don't miss the boat and end up with another Jim Zorn as coach. (My worst fear is Sherm Lewis is gonna be the next HC if we finish strong)

Please santa.. all I want for Christmas is a new GM, HC and QB.

[RabidFan]

Sherm won't be HC as he has shown prowess for playcalling....so if we get a puppet maybe we ensure Sherm as OC.....the saga continues.....But honestly what has Holmgren done as a GM or personnel guy? He was stripped of this....maybe he can be a great GM and team Pres if he hires a personnel guy he knows though...not named Vinny.

[McD5]

This is the one benefit of firing people like Vinny and Zorn quickly.

[cphil006]

Keep Zorn... Campbell.... let Vinny go far far away.

[Jeffro]

Keep Zorn... Campbell.... let Vinny go far far away.

Lord, that is a freaking nightmare scenario.

[TheLongshot]

Not sure why some are so fired up to get Holmgren as a GM. He had that role with the Seahawks and eventually had to give up that power. That doesn't exactly make him a ringing endorsement.

[Warhead36]

Maybe Holmgren could be a good GM if he focused ONLY on being GM, but I don't know, it sounds risky. I'd rather just bring in someone with a personel background, preferably someone who's risen up the ranks in another top organization like the Patriots, Colts, or Steelers.

[HailGreen28]

Lord, that is a freaking nightmare scenario.Yes. And yet it would be an improvement over our current status.

My priority of dismissals BTW, would be Vinny then JC, really not sure about Zorn, in order of importance.

Dunno about Zorn. He's in over his head, but how much of that is having to deal with Vinny and Danny's BS?

[bubba9497]

http://blog.seattlepi.nwsource.com/football/archives/185493.asp


Holmgren rumors heat up in Cleveland

Former NFL great Jim Brown told a luncheon group in Cleveland on Tuesday that Browns owner Randy Lerner was "meeting with one of the great football minds in this country" to discuss a front-office role with the franchise and later intimated that he was speaking about Mike Holmgren.

But a source close to the former Seattle Seahawks coach told the Cleveland Plain Dealer that Holmgren won't make any decisions about his future until after the season ends.

You can read the whole story here in the Plain Dealer. (http://www.cleveland.com/browns/index.ssf/2009/11/jim_brown_says_browns_owner_ra.html)

I'll stick with my previous take on this situation. Holmgren is smart. He'll test the waters and see what might be available. He'll let people know that he's interested in various scenarios and create a competitive situation for his services.

And then he'll pick someplace besides Cleveland, where the 1-8 Browns are going to require a lengthy turnaround and a lot more patience than Holmgren has at this point in his career.

There'll be numerous job openings by the end of this season, both for head coaches and front-office chiefs. Many will be in more attractive destinations and with better franchises than Cleveland.

I still think Holmgren, the old history teacher, would love to work in Washington, D.C., where he could be given the keys to the tradition- and cash-rich Redskins franchise and has the chutzpah to take control away from Daniel Snyder.

But he went on the radio in Chicago recently and criticized Snyder's handling of Jim Zorn, his long-time Seahawks assistant, so who knows where he stands in that scenario.

He might be tempted to see how things play out in Seattle, which he still has a home and a lot of family nearby.

His name will forever be linked to any job possibilities in the Bay Area, where he grew up, or frankly at this point to any opening league-wide with his connections and reputation as a coach who has taken two different franchises to Super Bowls.

He surely can wait and see what all develops in a business where coaching openings can be created in a day (see Buffalo, where Dick Jauron was fired Tuesday after a 3-6 start).

In other words, it's interesting that Holmgren might be talking to the Browns. But talk is cheap. And Holmgren won't be when the dominoes start to fall and bidding wars begin at season's end.

[cappun2007]

(My worst fear is Sherm Lewis is gonna be the next HC if we finish strong)


Why would that be your worse fear if we finish strong and our offense is producing?

[scruffylookin]

Not sure why some are so fired up to get Holmgren as a GM. He had that role with the Seahawks and eventually had to give up that power. That doesn't exactly make him a ringing endorsement.

I'll take it a step further and say I don't know why anyone is fired up over Shanahan, Cowher or Dungy either.

Shanahan was a bad personnel guy in Denver and Cowher and Dungy never had that kind of power so we have no clue how good or awful they would be.

The focus needs to be to hire a real personnel guy first and let him hire the head coach. All these "name" guys are not solutions. They are just another short term bandaid for Danny.

[FrFan]

Until Snyder is gone I don't think any top football coach or GM will come to DC, a leopard can't change its spots. As Bubba pointed out, he made a terrible mistake by stripping Zorn from his play-calling duties. He sent a very clear and bad message to other coaches, a total lack of respect for the HC involving bad meddling decisions.

[thedevilhimself]

Dunno about Zorn. He's in over his head, but how much of that is having to deal with Vinny and Danny's BS?

I actually think Zorn is doing a good job given all the crap in simply holding this team together and motivating the players ... Cerratto has to go . But if I was a young personell guy I would quite relish the chance to come in here and try and clean things up . One I would be a fresh face new realtionships and dynamics .. two I think Danny could be a great owner if the GM listened to him, kept him involved but did what he needed to do ...and three .. if i struggled in my early years then I would be able to point at the previous admin and say it was a bigger mess than anyone imagined ..

[hailskins11]

Lord, that is a freaking nightmare scenario.

+1
As bad as Vinny has been, I think he is a lesser problem than Zorn and Cantball

[Parlett316]

+1
As bad as Vinny has been, I think he is a lesser problem than Zorn and Cantball

I disagree, Vinny should have done his job and restacked the offensive line.

[skinsdude]

Keep Zorn... Campbell.... let Vinny go far far away.


Lord, that is a freaking nightmare scenario.

Quoted for truth. Jason needs to go far away with Vinny.

[MWCREDSKINS]

I never had much interest or hope in Holmgren. I really want Cowher but don't really see him coming here. Shanahan is probably the best bet and I am kind of torn on him. I don't know what to do. Someone is out there, you gotta find him and hope he's the next Joe Gibbs. I just don't want Vinny Cerrato to make that decision.

if we'd just hired Marvin Lewis instead of Spurrier or Singletary instead of Zorn we wouldn't be in this position

[TD_washingtonredskins]

Maybe we can hire Shanny to be our VP and let him find a GM and help hire Jim Harbaugh as head coach...

[chasefan31]

I'd rather see a young, but qualified guy from one of the quality franchises in the NFL. Bottom line is we need to choose a type of offense and stick with it. You can't build up a Gibbs style team then make them run the WCO or vice-versa. You're skill position players need to be chosen based on their potential and ability in YOUR system. Few if any of our skill guys are WCO players.
Also on the Rooney rule...drop it already. You shouldn't get in trouble for hiring the guy you like/want the most just because you didn't bring in X amount of certain people to interview who you knew all along you didn't want to hire. Owners will bring in whoever they think is best for their team. If there is any owner out there that wouldn't hire a guy based on race, that's his own loss. If they want such parity they should make you workout black punters/kickers and white RB/Wrs. See how stupid that sounds? It's outdated. There is not a lack of diversity in management/coaching anymore.

[TD_washingtonredskins]

Also on the Rooney rule...drop it already. You shouldn't get in trouble for hiring the guy you like/want the most just because you didn't bring in X amount of certain people to interview who you knew all along you didn't want to hire. Owners will bring in whoever they think is best for their team. If there is any owner out there that wouldn't hire a guy based on race, that's his own loss. If they want such parity they should make you workout black punters/kickers and white RB/Wrs. See how stupid that sounds? It's outdated. There is not a lack of diversity in management/coaching anymore.

I'm sure there's still a lack of diversity, but I can see your point. My biggest issue with the Rooney Rule is that there is always the potential that black candidates are just being interviewed to "check the box".

The spirit of the rule is great, but you can never police the intentions of owners...if an owner wants to hire Cowher next year, which is worse: 1) a direct hire of Cowher with no other interviews or 2) a sham of an interview with a minority candidate and then a hiring of Cowher?

[Koolblue13]

If we are looking into bringing anybody in, I would venture to guess, we are already talking to them.

And if we actually wanted anybody, do you think the Brown would actually be able to steal them away from the Redskins? Hell No.

[texasthunder]

Maybe we can hire Shanny to be our VP and let him find a GM and help hire Jim Harbaugh as head coach...



How about we just make Shannahan the GM.
And let him hire Mike Mularkey. He has done a real good job with a rookie qb in Atlanta, and knows offenses.
;)

[tex]

Seems like lots of teams are getting the jump on some of the big name folks avaliable in the GM/HC department.. I sure hope we don't miss the boat


even if this redskins front office does not miss the boat they will surly sail into the wrong port. their football compass is all messed up.

[Rodriggo]

(My worst fear is Sherm Lewis is gonna be the next HC if we finish strong)

Why would Sherm Lewis be so bad? If anything giving him, a renowned african american OC who was passed up for HC many times in the pre-Rooney Rule NFL, a chance would make up for the bad karma of having treated Marty Schottenheimer so bad.

[Jeffro]

Why would Sherm Lewis be so bad? If anything giving him, a renowned african american OC who was passed up for HC many times in the pre-Rooney Rule NFL, a chance would make up for the bad karma of having treated Marty Schottenheimer so bad.

Because I'd prefer that we go with a seasoned coach who can manage the team and not have to cut teeth. It's nothing against Sherm Lewis personally, I think he has done a hell of a job on offence and if the new HC wants him as OC I'm all for it. I just don't want to get in a situation where we have another Jim Zorn.

[Rodriggo]

Because I'd prefer that we go with a seasoned coach who can manage the team and not have to cut teeth. It's nothing against Sherm Lewis personally, I think he has done a hell of a job on offence and if the new HC wants him as OC I'm all for it. I just don't want to get in a situation where we have another Jim Zorn.

If anything Sherm Lewis is overseasoned.

I wouldn't be worried about him being another Jim Zorn.

He ran Super Bowl winning professional offenses and he did it for multiple years.

Jim Zorn was essentially Matt Hasselbeck's personal trainer before he came here. Hip hip hooray!

[TD_washingtonredskins]

I don't believe we need to worry about Sherm Lewis...is there any indication that he'd want a full-time gig as an NFL head coach??

[Rodriggo]

I don't believe we need to worry about Sherm Lewis...is there any indication that he'd want a full-time gig as an NFL head coach??

How about leaving BINGO to come back and be OC of one of the worst teams in the league? You got to think part of him realizes it wouldn't hurt to be the best resume in the room when it comes time to get a HC and no established guy will come within 3,000 ft. of Redskin Park.

[TD_washingtonredskins]

How about leaving BINGO to come back and be OC of one of the worst teams in the league? You got to think part of him realizes it wouldn't hurt to be the best resume in the room when it comes time to get a HC and no established guy will come within 3,000 ft. of Redskin Park.

It's one thing to come in as a consultant and accept a 10-game promotion to call plays.

It's quite another thing, especially at his age, to commit to multiple seasons of being the head coach (including off-season planning, mini-camps, training camp, etc.).

Remember, this guy was completely out of the game for 4-5 years!

[Rodriggo]

It's one thing to come in as a consultant and accept a 10-game promotion to call plays.

It's quite another thing, especially at his age, to commit to multiple seasons of being the head coach (including off-season planning, mini-camps, training camp, etc.).

Remember, this guy was completely out of the game for 4-5 years!

Gibbs was out of the game for 14 before he came back.

It wasn't great but we did go to the playoffs twice.

I think Sherm Lewis would be a good choice as long as we bring in a good GM.

That is what we need the most!

BTW how old is Sherm Lewis?

[TD_washingtonredskins]

Gibbs was out of the game for 14 before he came back.

It wasn't great but we did go to the playoffs twice.

I think Sherm Lewis would be a good choice as long as we bring in a good GM.

That is what we need the most!

BTW how old is Sherm Lewis?

Again, I think age and motivation are the keys here...not his ability to do a good job. He'll be 68 before the 2010 season begins. I realize Gibbs was out of the game for 12 or so years...but he came back at the age of 63 and re-retired at 67. Someone coming in at 68 to be a head football coach is quite a stretch (in my opinion).

[Koolblue13]

Gibbs was out of the game for 14 before he came back.

It wasn't great but we did go to the playoffs twice.

I think Sherm Lewis would be a good choice as long as we bring in a good GM.

That is what we need the most!

BTW how old is Sherm Lewis?

Gibbs was building and running a championship pro sports team in another sport.

Sherm was playing bingo at a hall.

Bit of a difference.

[Rodriggo]

None of the established names being thrown around sound good to me.

They've all won their rings and have reached the top of the mountain.

We need somebody who hasn't been there.

Lewis hasn't. He's old but so was Marv Levy in his time.

Give him a year or two until Jeff Fisher is available and let's see what happens.

If he can turn around this offense in two games what could he do with a whole offseason?

Give me a retired yet competent 68 yr. old over an incompetent 40 some odd qb coach any day of the week and twice on Sundays!

[DexterSackMachine]

Maybe Holmgren could be a good GM if he focused ONLY on being GM, but I don't know, it sounds risky. I'd rather just bring in someone with a personel background, preferably someone who's risen up the ranks in another top organization like the Patriots, Colts, or Steelers.
We think alike. The only former coach I'd want as a Team President (not GM) is Bill Parcells. Other than that, give me an up and comer (qualified ) from a quality organization.

One important point is that the new captain needs to be hired before anything else is done, and that includes firing Zorn. The dysfunctional/backwards way they did their last coaching hire (coordinators all in place first) epitomizes this organization's problems.

DO IT RIGHT FOR ONCE!

[ChillSkinzFan84]

Why would anyone want Holmgren as the GM? Shanahan too for that matter. Both have proven that they are not good in the GM role. Yes they are great coaches but if it meant that we would have to turn over all personnel decisions to them in order for them to be our coach...then neither of them are worth it. Come on people just because someone was a good coach doesnt mean they would be a good GM. Thats just like saying that a great GM would be a great coach.

[TD_washingtonredskins]

Rodriggo,

You are certainly entitled to your opinion. To say though, that you'd rather have Lewis over Zorn is irrelevant since Zorn isn't a candidate to be the head coach in 2010.

I'm not saying Lewis couldn't succeed, I just believe there are dozens of more qualified options out there.

[Rodriggo]

Rodriggo,

You are certainly entitled to your opinion. To say though, that you'd rather have Lewis over Zorn is irrelevant since Zorn isn't a candidate to be the head coach in 2010.

I'm not saying Lewis couldn't succeed, I just believe there are dozens of more qualified options out there.

Who do you want as HC?

[ChillSkinzFan84]

If we continue to improve on offense the rest of the year then I would like to see Zorn fired, Jerry Gray as head coach and D coordinator. Blache fired, and Lewis as the OC. Contrary to what many people believe I think we have enough talent on the team to be contenders next year if we just add the right pieces and if we get good coaching and good coaching decisions. We dont need to tear the whole team apart. If we were gettin blown out every week then I would say tear the team apart. But we are in every game we play. That shows you that its not a talent issue. In my opinion bad coaching decisions have been the main problem this year.

[addicted]

We should have fired Zorn and Cerrato a long time ago. To hell with the idea that you don't make changes in the offseason. Other teams are making changes, why not us? The longer Zorn and Vinny are here the more firmly I believe that Snyder hasn't felt the pain as much as he said he did that is necessary to make the changes this ball club needs. Just like the Clippers coach is more interested in making a profit then his ball club winning I believe Snyder feels the same way. Snyder's not going to fire anyone in the offseason just watch

[TD_washingtonredskins]

Who do you want as HC?

I don't really know yet. To be honest, I'd be pretty happy with anyone if we have a GM in charge of hiring the next coach.

My #1 preference would be have a GM come in and run things completely and have him hire a youngish coordinator as head coach. It would immediately carry more weight than Zorn since a football mind is hiring him (not the owner or Vinny). Also, age would be nice because I'm sick of the 2-4 year windows we impose on ourselves.

My #2 preference would be to hire someone like Cowher to run the whole thing since that's better than Vinny and nobody coach. I don't like this as much as fixing the front office first (and individually) because it means that once this coach leaves, we're potentially broken again with no GM. However, for the time this type of person would be here, I think we'd be better off than we are now.

I know that's not what you were looking for, but I don't really have a name in mind that I really want. One guy I'm intrigued by is Jim Harbaugh. But, he'd have to fit under example #1 above where he's hired by a GM in full control, not by the owner.

[addicted]

Who wants a Sig bet against me?

Prize - You can pick my Sig for the 2010 season, I can pick yours

My belief - Vinny Cerratto is still in charge in Washington come 2010.

Your belief - Snyder's had it with Vinny and replaces him before the 1st preseason game next year

Anyone want some action on this? The heats cooled down on Snyder and with that goes our chance to replace his puppet. The more we win, the more my belief becomes a fact. I still believe we have a 50-50 chance of firing Zorn but I bet Vinny's still here next year. The longer it goes the more likely this is true. You know it. I know it.

[Chicken Fried]

Keep Zorn... Campbell.... let Vinny go far far away.
Kill me now.

[Jeffro]

Who wants a Sig bet against me?

Prize - You can pick my Sig for the 2010 season, I can pick yours

My belief - Vinny Cerratto is still in charge in Washington come 2010.

Your belief - Snyder's had it with Vinny and replaces him before the 1st preseason game next year

Anyone want some action on this? The heats cooled down on Snyder and with that goes our chance to replace his puppet. The more we win, the more my belief becomes a fact. I still believe we have a 50-50 chance of firing Zorn but I bet Vinny's still here next year. The longer it goes the more likely this is true. You know it. I know it.

I'll take this bet.. all your sig are belong to me.

[ECU-ALUM]

We should have fired Zorn and Cerrato a long time ago. To hell with the idea that you don't make changes in the offseason. Other teams are making changes, why not us? The longer Zorn and Vinny are here the more firmly I believe that Snyder hasn't felt the pain as much as he said he did that is necessary to make the changes this ball club needs. Just like the Clippers coach is more interested in making a profit then his ball club winning I believe Snyder feels the same way. Snyder's not going to fire anyone in the offseason just watch

A month ago I would've been all over this bet...now...I am more and more convnced that Vinny is back next year...he has done enough sucking up...I mean defending Dan that I have serious doubts about him being out.

[HigSkin]

If Holmgren goes to the Browns, look for Zorn to join him at the end of the season.

[DexterSackMachine]

Who wants a Sig bet against me?

Prize - You can pick my Sig for the 2010 season, I can pick yours

My belief - Vinny Cerratto is still in charge in Washington come 2010.

Your belief - Snyder's had it with Vinny and replaces him before the 1st preseason game next year

Anyone want some action on this? The heats cooled down on Snyder and with that goes our chance to replace his puppet. The more we win, the more my belief becomes a fact. I still believe we have a 50-50 chance of firing Zorn but I bet Vinny's still here next year. The longer it goes the more likely this is true. You know it. I know it.

I'm not interested in betting but I do think Cerratto's ship has finally sailed. I think his hand has been in all of the decisions the last two years and I think he will now answer for it. I also think that Snyder understands that he can win back allot of straying fans simply by firing Vinny. To top it all off, I understand that Vinny's contract is up at the end of the season anyways.

[texasthunder]

I'm not interested in betting but I do think Cerratto's ship has finally sailed. I think his hand has been in all of the decisions the last two years and I think he will now answer for it. I also think that Snyder understands that he can win back allot of straying fans simply by firing Vinny. To top it all off, I understand that Vinny's contract is up at the end of the season anyways.



Exactly !!!

Not to mention there is still alot of football games left this season.
If we should pull a 6-2 finish then I think he might keep Vinny.
But if we end up under .500 in wins/loses then I feel there is change on the horizon.

[Jeffro]

Who wants a Sig bet against me?

Prize - You can pick my Sig for the 2010 season, I can pick yours

My belief - Vinny Cerratto is still in charge in Washington come 2010.

Your belief - Snyder's had it with Vinny and replaces him before the 1st preseason game next year

Anyone want some action on this? The heats cooled down on Snyder and with that goes our chance to replace his puppet. The more we win, the more my belief becomes a fact. I still believe we have a 50-50 chance of firing Zorn but I bet Vinny's still here next year. The longer it goes the more likely this is true. You know it. I know it.


Hi, I just wanted to let you know that your 2010 sig belongs to me.. Please refer to this thread.. kk thx