NYDN: Entire police force in Los Ramones, Mexico quits after gunmen attack headquarters

[China]

Entire police force in Los Ramones, Mexico quits after gunmen attack headquarters (http://www.nydailynews.com/news/world/2010/10/27/2010-10-27_entire_police_force_in_los_ramones_mexico_quits _after_gunmen_attack_headquarters.html)

The entire police force in a small Mexican town abruptly resigned Tuesday after its new headquarters was viciously attacked by suspected drug cartel gunmen.

All 14 police officers in Los Ramones, a rural town in northern Mexico, fled the force in terror after gunmen fired more than 1,000 bullets and flung six grenades at their headquarters on Monday night.

No one was injured in the attack. Mayor Santos Salinas Garza told local media that the officers resigned because of the incident.

The gunmen’s 20-minute shooting spree destroyed six police vehicles and left the white and orange police station pocked with bullet holes, the Financial Times reported.

http://assets.nydailynews.com/img/2010/10/28/alg_resize_los-ramones_bullets.jpg

The station had been inaugurated just three days earlier.

The attack was the second in less than a week against police forces in Nuevo Leon. Last week, thugs threw two grenades at police in Sabinas Hidalgo, according to newspaper Noroeste.

Click on the link for the full article

[Thiebear]

If you don't have Overwhelming force to maintain peace. You have this.
The Gov't of Mexico should have been ALL over this immediately, just based on the peoples security and the COST! of future business

(Imagine how good they would be now if we moved them north and added them to the police force).. motivation...
offer them 33% more security.. still shot at, but less grenades.

[Bang]

They've all but lost this war. Mexico is owned by the cartels.

~Bang

[Dan T.]

What a freaking mess down there. Those cartels have gotten too big and too powerful. It is a war.

[AsburySkinsFan]

Man those cartels are acting with impunity down there. My fear is that it won't be long until it spills over the border, and then we'll be fighting with one hand tied behind our backs as we'll have a major drug war with a border dispute in the middle of it.

[Zguy28]

Sad sad situation, right on the other side of the border. It reminds me of the opening scene from the movie Tombstone.

[twa]

Can't blame them for quitting....problems allowed to fester and flourish rarely end well.

Are we addressing our own?.

[Duckus]

I have said this before, and I will say it again - if this **** was happening in Canada it would be on the news every day in the US. Outrage would grow so high that something would actually be done by countries around the world.

I don't know what the answer or solution is, but it is crazy what is going on just a stones throw away.

[AsburySkinsFan]

I have said this before, and I will say it again - if this **** was happening in Canada it would be on the news every day in the US. Outrage would grow so high that something would actually be done by countries around the world.

I don't know what the answer or solution is, but it is crazy what is going on just a stones throw away.

It's not on the news everyday down there because the cartels are killing the reporters who dare report these stories. "Border Wars" did a piece on this about a reporter who treads this line very carefully, NPR had this as well.

[Duckus]

It's not on the news everyday down there because the cartels are killing the reporters who dare report these stories.

Oh I agree - I would be terrified to report the violence as a reporter in Mexico. I am disappointed that the US news does not cover it more. Its on the local news here in Texas a fair amount. But I have friends up north who have no idea that open warfare is happening in Mexico. They know it dangerous, they know it is drug related but they don't know it is a civil war.

[Destino]

I've said it before and I'll say it again... can't keep pretending this is a job for the police force. Time for a "with us or against us" situation where the "against us" all get shot, not arrested. Anything short of a purging in Mexico and they'll become the next Columbia or worse, where the government exists as one of two entrenched powers and the violence will never end.

[Zguy28]

I've said it before and I'll say it again... can't keep pretending this is a job for the police force. Time for a "with us or against us" situation where the "against us" all get shot, not arrested. Anything short of a purging in Mexico and they'll become the next Columbia or worse, where the government exists as one of two entrenched powers and the violence will never end.

I'm wondering how long before these guys go in?
http://www.imfdb.org/images/thumb/0/07/M40A1_CPD.JPG/600px-M40A1_CPD.JPG

[mcsluggo]

this really raises a big issue in my mind...

a very large portion of stability and peace is inertia. Here in the US, or in Belgium, or in Finland, or wherever.. we really would also have a very hard time safely attacking a situation like that.. once it got to that point. we have stability here because overall we have relatively awesome security forces (police, nat guard, military, etc...) that we all instinctively believe in and mostly trust. The default is to obey most of teh important laws, partially because we think it is best for us--- and this is broken down into several components, we think there is a good chance we would be caught if we didn't, we WANT our neighbors to be caught-and dealt with if THEY don't, and-simply- we always have mostly obeyed the laws. Our law enforcement is very good... but it couldn't deal with a society that didn't believe in it. It would get overwhelmed, also.

this is a huge virtuous cycle... once it starts to break down, and people no longer BELIEVE in the law and order, it is VERY hard to get it back :(


this isn't a credible scenario, and i am in no means suggesting that the US should do this... but take this to the extreme, assume the US massed its huge military might and swept through the area, and attacked all instances they could find of overt lawlessness, and drug cartel activity. stomped it flat, and then slowly withdrew... does ANYBODY doubt that the problem would somewhat pop back up as the forces left? like trick birthday candles

seriously... how do you INSTALL a trust and belief in a the power of law and order, when there is a history of a lack of justice ?
How long does it take for the virtuous cycle to take root? (you have to BOTH clean up the security forces enough that people SHOPULD believe in them, and convince people to behave differently than they alway s had... and ACTUALLY belive in them)


what the eff are we going to do in Afghanistan? how long does this take?

[Beans]

What are the conditions for victory in Afghanistan again? Oh right, it's never been articulated. Time to bring the boys (and girls) home and kick some ass south of the border!

[DjTj]

What are the conditions for victory in Afghanistan again? Oh right, it's never been articulated. Time to bring the boys (and girls) home and kick some ass south of the border!What would be the conditions for victory in Mexico? The "War on Drugs" is an open-ended and un-ending war just like the "War on Terror."

[Beans]

What would be the conditions for victory in Mexico? The "War on Drugs" is an open-ended and un-ending war just like the "War on Terror."

Right. But at least it would have an impact on us. War in Mexico would be very different than war in Afghanistan. War is all Afghanistan has ever known. They will never stop fighting. Do you think that the current war is making Americans safer? Hate to say it, but I don't. Right now, there is no rule of law within a country that shares a border with us. A border that is violated daily to varying degrees of severity. Considering the spectrum ranges from drug runners, to human trafficking, all the way to the other end of the spectrum-the less threatening illegal just vying for a chance at a better life, America's neighbor to south is a serious problem.

[Predicto]

Who would you be warring on? It's not like the drug guys wear uniforms and hang out in barracks.

[twa]

Who would you be warring on? It's not like the drug guys wear uniforms and hang out in barracks.

Indeed, we are already arming and training(as well as intel support) the Mexican federal forces.

Our direct action is not welcome...yet

A lot of the problem is northern Mexico was loosely governed to start with,at our insistence and the result of the cartels actually moving into control of central Mexico precipitated this open clash.

it's gonna get worse before it gets better.

[Ryman of the North]

Several guys I worked with a few years ago are now making huge money as protection specialists in mexico, the rate of kidnappings has increased and places like Ciudad Juarez that are very close to the US have turned into warzones. this is not an exageration, I have friends making upwards or 7-800 american dollars per day looking after wealthy mexican citizens. what the rest of the north america needs to do is send in a large force of peace officers to help the mexicans protect their own people.

the worst part is that they would need to be ruthless, they need proper intelligence and they cannot go in halfass, if they do they will get mired down in an unwinnable low level action, this needs to be something that literally will remove the threat quickly and harshly.

[twa]

Doesn't seem like you would want peace officers then,no offense to my law enforcement kin,but most are not ruthless.

[GoSkins561]

Mexico needs a little love from our Special Forces, Apaches and Warhogs ASAP.

[GritzRgreat]

Its Mexico, F em.

[heyholetsgogrant]

Mexico needs a little love from our Special Forces, Apaches and Warhogs ASAP.

more like predator drone strikes, they wil never see it comming :) If we can send al qaeda running we could send some of the cartels running.

[Vilandil Tasardur]

As a first generation Mexican American, the whole thing makes me really, really sad. There's no easy solution at all.

Just last summer the city of Cuernavaca, a popular "estate" town ala beverly hills, just an hour from Mexico City, had a full out battle. I'm talking two days of sub machine gun weaponry, flash grenades, RPGs, the whole shibang. It was like something out of Black Hawk Down, the kind of thing that you don't expect in countries that aren't Africa or the middle east. And what can be done?

Even if Mexico could afford to fight the war, the Mexican citizens aren't going to be brave enough to fight it because "winning" doesn't even make things better. In America, when our liberties our in jeopardy we will fight like dogs because we love our lives. In Mexico, winning the war on drugs just means a return to "safer, more legal" poverty. Is that worth fighting for? Not to most working Mexicans.

[Madison Redskin]

Its Mexico, F em.

What a mature, insightful comment.

[AsburySkinsFan]

What a mature, insightful comment.

That poster is speaking from a position that doesn't recognize that we all live down stream from one another. That kind of thinking is the type that says, "I'm not gonna call 911 because my neighbor's house is on fire and he's a jerk", but then will turn around screaming when his own house burns to the ground after his neighbor's fire spreads.

[Madison Redskin]

That poster is speaking from a position that doesn't recognize that we all live down stream from one another. That kind of thinking is the type that says, "I'm not gonna call 911 because my neighbor's house is on fire and he's a jerk", but then will turn around screaming when his own house burns to the ground after his neighbor's fire spreads.

There, but for the grace of God, go I.

[Jumbo]

"that poster" (gritz) has been culled, with his posting history being considered in context (as is my M.O.).

if any of you guys think posting whatever pops into your cranium is ok because just you're on the interwebz you may find yourselves mistaken regarding this forum.

the rules and guidelines offer useful direction.

I suggest becoming very familiar with it if you like posting in this forum.

we are not here to accommodate everybody.

[generaltso]

where could their money be coming from to wage these conflicts.

surely not from the sale of illegal narcotics in this very country.

[AsburySkinsFan]

where could their money be coming from to wage these conflicts.

surely not from the sale of illegal narcotics in this very country.

Yep, it's the appetite in the United States for these drugs that is fueling this whole thing. I keep getting closer and closer to legalizing these drugs in the US but with controls and restrictions on their sale, I just know that people are irresponsible and abuse legal substances all the time with devastating effects on others (drunk driving). The prohibition comparisons are getting mroe convincing, but it is a HUGE risk.

[Skin'Em84]

Make Mexico a state. Then we can send in our forces as a police action.

[twa]

Make Mexico a state. Then we can send in our forces as a police action.

Just the Northern ones :evilg:...it's doable

[Thiebear]

Selling them 100 reaper drones couldn't hurt..
wait.. would probably have to manage them from the States due to who knows whose working for the cartel.
Then the first non Cartel casualty would be a pc nightmare.
nevermind.

[thebluefood]

Yup, that war on drugs is going REALLY well, isn't it?

My heart does go out to the people in Mexico that are caught in the middle of this mess.

[Kilmer17]

I think it's cool they named a town after Joey and the boys.

[Mickalino]

Who would you be warring on? It's not like the drug guys wear uniforms and hang out in barracks.

more-so than the "war on terror" enemies do

[Dan T.]

I think it's cool they named a town after Joey and the boys.

:ols:

Let's drop the Blitzkreig Bop on 'em.

[The Brave Little Toaster Oven]

Make Mexico a state. Then we can send in our forces as a police action.

I was considering that as well...we tell them we will take care of it, but they have to give up the land....and we will name that new territory New New Mexico