Time to face the facts, Van Halen WAS better with Sammy Hagar (At least live anyway)

[Painkiller]

As a fan of all incarnations of the band, I have finally come to accept that at least live, "Van Hagar" was much better live then "Van Halen." (With exceptions given to 2004 and 2007 reunion tours. Eddie was a shell of himself in 2004, and Dave could finally remember the words in 2007) You can talk about the Dave era albums being "better," or the Sammy era albums being "better," but that had more to do with Eddie and the direction he chose to take the band. After the "1984" album he wanted a more commercial sound.

As an example I give you a video I recently posted in a greatest "Frontman" of all time thread. David Lee Roth, some say the quintessential hard rock "showman" could never get the words right it seems in any live performance. The guy was either too loaded, or too dumb to remember his own lyrics. (Or he wanted you to think he was) For sheer "entertainment" value, he gets his points.

Not safe for work (Language)


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mcp5TdHyPuk

Now by comparison, I give you a video of Van Hagar. The lead track off of Live Without A Net "There's only one way to Rock" (which isn't even a Van Halen song) If you can't see the difference in the quality of the performance (not just the vid) I don't know what to tell you. Sammy sings better. He adds another guitar to the line up...AND he "remembers all the ****ing words!" :)

Again, not safe for work (Language at end)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZnF0L5eeAJ4

Discuss (For those that give a **** ) :)

**As an aside, I wonder if Sammy had been more willing to sing a larger variety of Dave-era tunes, would he have been more accepted by the Dave loyalists. Look at what groups like Journey and AC/DC have done. They found singers to replace the original guys, who are not only willing to sing the "old" stuff, but embrace the heritage also and aren't threatened by it.



I

[Bang]

I guess that would mean you'd have to agree Van Halen was any good after their fourth album.

So that leaves me out.

~Bang

[Painkiller]

I guess that would mean you'd have to agree Van Halen was any good after their fourth album.

So that leaves me out.

~Bang

"Diver Down" was a majority of covers, with a few decent Van Halen songs, but no love for "1984"? Wow, tough crowd. :) If you don't like that album, I can't imagine what you think of the Sammy stuff. :ols:

[Bang]

"Diver Down" was a majority of covers, with a few decent Van Halen songs, but no love for "1984"? Wow, tough crowd. :) If you don't like that album, I can't imagine what you think of the Sammy stuff. :ols:
Yeah, I didn't really like "Diver Down" too much. Their first three albums are great examples of 70s hard rock.
I'll say this,, i gave them every chance.. saw thm three times, and they progressively got worse.. the third time i actually walked out. Bored out of my skull. The first time (their first headlining tour) blew me away. The second time was .. overly scripted.. (Hey, you did that "joint thrown onstage is a toothpick" joke last tour!) and the third was just trash. (Complete with the same joint thrown onstage routine.)
They became caricatures.. and after the initial rush of creativity, it quickly became apparent to me that Alex Van Halen may be the worst drummer I'd ever heard, and Michael anthony has been stealing money ever since he learned how to pluck two or three notes and call it a song. Bass "player" my foot.

Mostly I just grew away from the formulaic pop rock that they produce.

~Bang

[Rocky21]

I have to hand it to you Painkiller. You are one dedicated VH fan.

I heard the demo version of House Of Pain on the interwebz a week or so ago. What a kick ass tune. '77 VH is some primo stuff.

[Painkiller]

Well, I'll say this,, i gave them every chance.. saw thm three times, and they progressively got worse.. the third time i actually walked out. Bored out of my skull. The first time (their first headlining tour) blew me away. The second time was .. overly scripted.. and the third was just trash.
They became caricatures.. and after the initial rush of creativity, it quickly became apparent to me that Alex Van Halen may be the worst drummer I'd ever heard, and Michael anthony has been stealing money ever since he learned how to pluck two or three notes and call it a song. Bass "player" my foot.

Mostly I just grew away from the formulaic pop rock that they produce.

~Bang

by any chance were you at that Cap Centre show back in the day? :) Mike gets a lot of grief, but if you listen to the Chickenfoot album he can actually play well. His bass was always down in the mix on Van Halen's albums. I would say you may be right, except Eddie did seem to get better as the years went by. Even Van Halen III has some great playing, even though most of the songs are forgettable.

[Riggo-toni]

In fairness the only time I got to see them live was when that flaming queen from extreme was the frontman....what a joke he was live. As far as recordings, they peaked with the first album and the number of worthy songs contained on each LP kept dminishing with each successive release. I like some of Sammy's solo material, but his stuff w/ VH was pretty much worthless.

[Painkiller]

I have to hand it to you Painkiller. You are one dedicated VH fan.

I heard the demo version of House Of Pain on the interwebz a week or so ago. What a kick ass tune. '77 VH is some primo stuff.

I'm a dedicated Rock and Metal fan. :) My favorite topic to discuss other than the Redskins. I am like a poor man's Eddie Trunk. :ols: By the way, K.K. Downing retired from Judas Priest for those that haven't heard. They picked up a replacement for the tour, and are going to continue without him.

[HailGreen28]

Dave and Sammy were awesome. After that.... :doh:

[Painkiller]

In fairness the only time I got to see them live was when that flaming queen from extreme was the frontman....what a joke he was live. As far as recordings, they peaked with the first album and the number of worthy songs contained on each LP kept dminishing with each successive release. I like some of Sammy's solo material, but his stuff w/ VH was pretty much worthless.

ahh, Gary Cherone. I also saw that show at Nissan Pavilion. I will say that it was strange seeing somebody up there that wasn't Sam or Dave, but to his credit he at least sang songs from both eras...and the guy can sing. He just didn't fit for Van Halen. With that said, Van Halen fans will probably never get another show with such a good variety of both eras. "Right Now" and "Romeo Delight" performed in the same set. :)

[USS Redskins]

If you like pukey Poppy synthesized music catering to the MTV crowd, and musicians who seemed to be very interested in hugging each other, then sure, Van Hagar ruled.

If you actually like Hard Rock and guys who were singing about banging chicks, not holding each other, rocking guitar solos and Fun then the real Van Halen ruled.

Did you ever See the original VH in the early 80's? One of the Greatest shows I ever saw was VH at the cap center in 1982.
The 2008 VH show was great simply to see the best hard rock band ever reform, even if it was with a younger mulletted bassist.

I saw Van Hagar in the early 90's and it was all hugging on each other and gay songs.

I actually like Sammy -he is a cool dude and Chickenfoot is great but he ruined a great band.

[Painkiller]

If you like pukey Poppy synthesized music catering to the MTV crowd, and musicians who seemed to be very interested in hugging each other, then sure, Van Hagar ruled.

If you actually like Hard Rock and guys who were singing about banging chicks, not holding each other, rocking guitar solos and Fun then the real Van Halen ruled.

Did you ever See the original VH in the early 80's? One of the Greatest shows I ever saw was VH at the cap center in 1982.
The 2008 VH show was great simply to see the best hard rock band ever reform, even if it was with a younger mulletted bassist.

I saw Van Hagar in the early 90's and it was all hugging on each other and gay songs.

I actually like Sammy -he is a cool dude and Chickenfoot is great but he ruined a great band.

This is the song all the Dave loyalists sing whenever this topic comes up for discussion. :) Your post made me laugh on a couple different levels. Maybe your memory is a little faded, but check out that Video I posted of Dave-era Van Halen. (Just so happens to be from that show your talking about. :) ) As a matter of fact, look up ALL the videos from that show on Youtube. I don't think there is one where Dave doesn't forget 1 or 2 verses, and either get completely off key, or fall behind the tempo.

He is great at drinking tea from a Jack Daniels bottle though. You want to talk about gay, (not that there is anything wrong with that, lol) check out the way Dave prances around the stage. :silly:

[aREDSKIN]

I've seen VH many times. Met them in 1984 at Peaches (record store) when they were on tour with Ted Nugent. One of may favorite bands. Great live band & DLR was always wasted when I saw them. Still put on a great show. Couldn't sing worth a crap. SH is just a different personality. Saw him with Montrose & he was great as a front man.

[Homercles82]

I am not a huge Van Halen fan but what I have heard of them from both singers, I prefer Van Hagar.

[Painkiller]

I've seen VH many times. Met them in 1984 at Peaches (record store) when they were on tour with Ted Nugent. One of may favorite bands. Great live band & DLR was always wasted when I saw them. Still put on a great show. Couldn't sing worth a crap. SH is just a different personality. Saw him with Montrose & he was great as a front man.

Did you see them early on with Dave? Most people say that the first couple tours with him were great, and then it all went downhill from there. Maybe one day we could get an official release from the band with stuff from that era. Maybe somebody out there video-taped Van Halen's first tour with an 8mm camera. :) The remaster guru's could work their magic on it, like they did with the "Led Zeppelin" DVD.

[Madison Redskin]

But was he as good as Bob Seger?

[Buford]

I remember reading how patty smyth was asked to replace Roth originally. That would have been a really interesting change...ballsy to even consider it.

[aREDSKIN]

Did you see them early on with Dave? Most people say that the first couple tours with him were great, and then it all went downhill from there. Maybe one day we could get an official release from the band with stuff from that era. Maybe somebody out there video-taped Van Halen's first tour with an 8mm camera. :) The remaster guru's could work their magic on it, like they did with the "Led Zeppelin" DVD.


The 1984 tour was their first I think. They were a second billing to Ted Nugent and it was their first album. To say the least they blew TN away.

[Painkiller]

Definately not safe for work, but this video will make you laugh your ass off. Nothing comes close to a Mike Anthony shenanigans and a bass solo. :rotflmao: While this debacle was going on Sammy must have been under the stage living out some of his stories he would later write in his book.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5ewsHwVOyyE

[KAOSkins]

They went from "Ain't talkin' 'bout Love" to "Why can't this be Love?". Not acceptable IMO.

Live, I only saw Van Hagar so I can't say from personal experience but I'd rather see a poor performance of great songs than a kick ass performance of weak songs.

[Painkiller]

They went from "Ain't talkin' 'bout Love" to "Why can't this be Love?". Not acceptable IMO.

Live, I only saw Van Hagar so I can't say from personal experience but I'd rather see a poor performance of great songs than a kick ass performance of weak songs.

Yes, but that isn't the whole story of Van Hagar. I give the following as evidence. The "hits" of the Hagar era were catered to Radio, but some of the deeper cuts on those albums kicked ass.

Judgement Day from For Unlawful Carnal Knowledge

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=D5sfJBw-WRE

A.F.U. (Naturally Wired) from OU812

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DlCRgROe2uc

Get Up from 5150

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2_a8jtWVTtU

[Bang]

by any chance were you at that Cap Centre show back in the day? :) Mike gets a lot of grief, but if you listen to the Chickenfoot album he can actually play well. His bass was always down in the mix on Van Halen's albums. I would say you may be right, except Eddie did seem to get better as the years went by. Even Van Halen III has some great playing, even though most of the songs are forgettable.

Yessir.. two Cap Centre shows in fact.

The one thing that really struck me each time i saw them was how AWFUL the opening band always was.
Me and a bunch of Forestville cronies were in the Cap Centre for those shows

~Bang

[Painkiller]

Yessir.. two Cap Centre shows in fact.

The one thing that really struck me each time i saw them was how AWFUL the opening band always was.
Me and a bunch of Forestville cronies were in the Cap Centre for those shows

~Bang

There is talk of them eventually releasing that show officially. I don't know why they would do that...it's not very flattering. They would be better served releasing a video from the 2007 reunion tour. They did sound great on that tour, and for all the flack he is catching Wolfgang can play pretty well. As a back up singer, well he's no Michael Anthony, but he held his own. New album and tour with Dave in the works for this year. Supposed to be in the fall.

---------- Post added May-4th-2011 at 10:56 AM ----------


The only Van Halen Concert I went to included David Lee Roth and it was awesome so I might be biased when I say I disagree.
Those were the days, though in ' 79 I was able to see AC-DC at the Tangerine Bowl with Boston and the Doobie brothers.

Wow, that must have been one hell of a show. AC/DC, Boston, and the Doobies. Now if I could see a great video from the very early Van Halen years, like the 79 tour, (Which was their actual first tour by the way) maybe I would change my mind.

[Busch1724]

The thing about Dave is that "I forgot the f#$#ing words", "look at all the people here tonight", were all partially scripted. You could do that before the days of the internet. He was brilliant. Rock is supposed to be dangerous,a little bit fun, and somewhat unpredictable. They were all of that with Dave. He could command an audience like no other. Sammy was just dry boring, but a really good singer and pulled it off live. I'd rather have Dave. It seems to feel like a backyard BBQ. I wish I could have seen those tours in the 70s and 80s, but thank God for youtube.

---------- Post added May-4th-2011 at 11:13 AM ----------

Here's why I can't stand Sammy and his revisionist history....

This post was done by a VH fan at the VHND and debunked each piece of BS that he found page by page in Sammy's book:

http://www.vhnd.com/2011/04/26/qa-with- ... /#comments

It's been said over and over, but he sums it up very well page by page in Sammy's book with the facts:
# Adam says:
April 26th, 2011 at 2:50 pm

I’m a longtime fan of BOTH VH singers and longtime commenter at VHND. I thought I knew Sammy before this book came out, but I simply can not believe how much he lies in the book! Is he lying about Eddie? I don’t know because I wasn’t there. All the lies that I spotted are lies that any knowledgeable fan could spot. He is shamelessly rewriting history. I have numbered the lies I spotted below:

1) Page 54: “…the first Montrose album has sold more than 4 million records over the years.” According to the RIAA, it’s certified just ONE million. (Worldwide sales are barely more than USA sales for all Hagar’s albums).

2) PAGE 78: “I sold out the Oakland Coliseum that Fourth of July” [1980]. He fails to mention that he was on the bill with 4 other bands, three of which were hugely popular at the time: Blue Oyster Cult, REO Speedwagen, and Triumph, (and also Randy Hanson). Hagar conveniently implies he sold it out by himself.

3) PAGE 80: [In 1982]: “We went out on tour, headlining arenas, double nights in a lot of places.” From my years working in concert promotion at Electric Factory in Philly in the ’80?s (a huge concert promoter back then), I have the list of Sammy’s 1982 tour dates straight from Pollstar. There was only ONE city listed where he played twice: San Francisco. Again, he is lying through his fake teeth.

4-7) Page 90 contains one incredible paragraph that is the biggest pile of bull**** I’ve ever read relating to Van Halen in my life!:

“The tour for VOA was my most successful. I sold out arenas everywhere, two, three, or four nights some places, one of the top grossing tours in 1984–right up there with Van Halen, who broke at the same time with “Jump” and all that. I remember getting an award in Portland, Oregon. I sold out two nights and got the Show of the year. Van Halen was runner-up. We were neck-and-neck on the road. My album was 1.6 million, but they ended up selling 10 million records.”

4) “VAN HALEN “BROKE” WITH JUMP IN 1984?? How he belittles VH’s earlier success! I was under the impression that they broke in 1978, when they exploded with their earth-shattering debut, rewriting the rules for rock music and sold 2 million copies right out of the gate! Ed was winning every guitar player award in site. In only their first year, VH far eclipsed everything that Montrose & Hagar ever did. Everyone was talking about VH in ’78, and NO ONE was talking about Hagar or Montrose.

5) “I SOLD OUT ARENAS EVERYWHERE, TWO, THREE, FOUR NIGHTS IN SOME PLACES, ONE OF THE TOP GROSSING TOURS IN 1984–RIGHT UP THERE WITH VAN HALEN”.

Wow. With this statement, Hagar completely abandons any mindset that the “truth” is sacred. He is SHAMELESSLY rewriting history here. VAN HALEN was the monster that was selling out multiple arenas, not him! Hagar COULDN’T EVEN PLAY most cities on the east coast because he simply wasn’t popular over there. Hagar could sell out arenas in the midwest and in California, and that’s practically it. His VOA tour was his biggest tour ever, yet he played ONE night in each city except for places where he was big, such as St. Louis, Dallas, and San Fran, where he played two nights. He was playing ONE night in virtually every city (not 2-4), and overall, he played smaller venues than where VH was booked, and sold far less tickets in those venues. The VH tour was a 100% sell-out virtually everywhere, and on the other hand, Hagar had plenty of cities where he could only sell 30%-50% of the tickets, even after “I Can’t Drive 55″.

6) “We [VH & his band in 1984] were neck-and-neck on the road.” On what planet? Anyone who was alive during the ’80′s knows that Van Halen was infinitely more popular than Hagar. Perhaps Hagar was the only person on EARTH who didn’t see it that way. In 1984, Van Halen was through the stratosphere – their tour absolutely dwarfed all other rock band’s tours, especially Hagar’s.

7) “I remember getting an award in Portland, Oregon. I sold out two nights and got the Show of the Year.” Again, from my years working in concert promotion, I have here Sammy’s 1982 tour dates. He played ONE night in Portland, Oregon, on 3/19/82, at the Memorial Coliseum. The dates before and after were both in Washington. No other Portland dates.

8 ) Page 113: “Before I joined the band, Van Halen didn’t have a particularly tight show. Roth would talk. They’d do another song. Ed would play a 20 minute guitar solo. They would do another song. Roth would talk some more, another song, Al would do a drum solo for 30 minutes. On the 1984 tour…they were doing 8 songs in a 2 hour show. They ended every song the same way.”

Any fan who reads this who either saw Van Halen before Sammy joined, or owns ANY amount of old Van Halen bootlegs, knows that every single thing Sammy said in that paragraph is complete bull****. EVH’s solo was always around 10 minutes. Alex’s was always 3-4 minutes. They always did 16 songs, not counting solos. VH was a well-oiled machine, a stellar production, and tightly choreographed – the exact opposite of what Sam describes. Again, he is shamelessly rewriting history to try to diminish what Van Halen was before he joined.

9) Page 121: “The record [Sammy's solo album "I Never Said Goodbye"] went platinum immediately.”

As of today, 4/26/11, it has only been certified Gold status w/ the RIAA.

10) Page 122: “We [VH in 1986] were selling out four nights in arenas anywhere.” Although the 5150 tour was a smashing success, and they occasionally would sell 2, 3 or even 4 nights in certain cities, the band played ONE night vast majority of cities. Also, the 5150 tour wasn’t as big as the 1984 tour, which had the band playing one additional night in several cities than they were on the 5150 tour.

11) Page 173: “The fans went against Roth. He died a quick death as a solo artist.” [When he went solo in 1985]

I would say that most current VH fans are under the impression that Hagar’s solo career has been more successful than Roth’s. However, if you want to measure the success with ALBUM SALES, Roth’s solo career has actually been more successful than Hagar’s! Roth’s first 3 albums went Platinum (Crazy From The Heat in ’85, Eat ‘EM And Smile in ’86, and Skyscraper in ’87). Hagar, however, never had could match that success – he never had 3 consecutive Platinum solo albums… just 3 consecutive GOLD albums, and then later in 1987 released another one that only went gold, with the help of Eddie playing bass. Hagar’s solo career simply was never as big as Roth’s was in the ’80′s. Roth was consistently platinum, while Hagar was consistently gold.

12) Page 222: When Irving Azoff told Hagar that the Rock And Roll Hall Of Fame wanted to induct Van Halen, but only the Roth-version of the band, Hagar says, “I went nuts on Irving. I was in the band longer than Roth. He was in Van Halen seven years. I was with them eleven years. I sold more records than he did. How could they do that to me?”

He is wrong on both counts. Roth was in VH for 12 years (’74-’85) and VH sold twice as many albums with Roth than with Hagar. (See RIAA.com).

13) Page 234: Sammy says that, before he joined VH, “I was selling out multiple arenas, had five platinum albums in a row on Geffen, and I was ripe to join Van Halen when they asked…”

I already went over the “multiple arenas” bull. As for “5 platinum albums in a row on Geffen”? He had only 3 Geffen albums, and none were platinum:

1981 Standing Hampton – Gold as of 1985.

1982 Three Lock Box – Gold to this day.

1984 V.O.A. – Gold as of mid-1985.

Those are all the major lies that I can detect, just as a fan. I can’t even imagine how many more lies are in the book that the fans would have no way of detecting.

Hagar wants all the fans to think that he was hugely successful BEFORE he joined VH, as if joining them wasn’t necessarily the thing that catapulted his career. In countless interviews, he states that his solo albums were going platinum before VH.

This is all a lie. In reality, NONE of his solo albums went platinum by the time he joined VH in mid 1985. Sure, as of 2011, 3 of his albums have gone platinum (Montrose, Standing Hampton, and V.O.A.). But Hampton didn’t go platinum ’till 1992, V.O.A. didn’t go platinum until Nov. ’85, and Montrose didn’t until many years later, either.

YES, Hagar was (moderately) successful before VH, and good for him!! Why can’t he just be satisfied with the success that he truly DID have and just be HONEST about everything in his book? It’s because his ego and his insecurity can’t handle the truth.

Sammy’s all about HIMSELF. He belittles Roth and Eddie to try to seem better than them. He belittles the legacy that Roth, Ed, Al, & Mike created together, just to make HIS years in VH seem better. I find his behavior disgusting and immoral. Nothing outside of HIMSELF is sacred to him, and certainly not Van Halen! Ironically, his very own autobiography shattered my respect of him.

[USS Redskins]

This is the song all the Dave loyalists sing whenever this topic comes up for discussion. :) Your post made me laugh on a couple different levels. Maybe your memory is a little faded, but check out that Video I posted of Dave-era Van Halen. (Just so happens to be from that show your talking about. :) ) As a matter of fact, look up ALL the videos from that show on Youtube. I don't think there is one where Dave doesn't forget 1 or 2 verses, and either get completely off key, or fall behind the tempo.

He is great at drinking tea from a Jack Daniels bottle though. You want to talk about gay, (not that there is anything wrong with that, lol) check out the way Dave prances around the stage. :silly:

I AM an un-apologetic Dave loyalist... I understand that you like weak pop music, no problem, that is your choice and I commend you for being so honest about it. Most people would run and hide from those un-natural feelings of liking such lame tripe... ;)

But, come on - you are cherry picking YOU TUBE videos... I saw them live 4 times, with Dave in 1982, with Sammy in 2001, Gary Cheronne (OMG that sucked) and Dave again with the 2008 reunion tour... Dave kicked Sammy's ass.

And Dave Gay? I wont even address that. Blasphemy.

Sammy was just a big bore. But again, I do like the guy.
Just my opinion.

[SkinsCrank]

Van Halen with Roth>>Van Halen with Hagar
FACT

[Painkiller]

I remember reading how patty smyth was asked to replace Roth originally. That would have been a really interesting change...ballsy to even consider it.

Patty was hot back in the day, but I couldn't even imagine this gal fronting Van Halen. How bizarre that would have been. Enjoy cheesy 80's videos. :) (Great songs though)


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_50-gOeBilc

I like this one better :) Cheese factor ramped up.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dIDaBF8LILk

---------- Post added May-4th-2011 at 11:31 AM ----------


On it, I will make it a single click download after I snag it and PM you.

Fresh out of bootcamp in Orlando attending basic electricity/electronics school a couple of farmboys from Nebraska and a redhead babe from Illinois were shocked that a brutha snagged tickets while they were in class for all of us to go to the show. I missed out on the Blue Oyster Cult show though.

Dude that rocks, thanks. :)

---------- Post added May-4th-2011 at 11:43 AM ----------

Busch1724, I saw that post on Van Halen news desk. It might come as a surprise to some people, but I probably check that site at least once a week :silly:

For the most part, no argument from me on the debunking of parts of Sammy's book. I don't know if his intent was to flat out lie in some of those quotes, or if he is deliberately stretching the truth. Maybe he's just trying to get a reaction from Eddie. Somebody on that website also pointed out, that when Sammy talks about "out selling" Roth, he is talking about what the albums did at the time. Not the fact that, for instance a few years ago, 1984 hit something like 15 million copies sold. It is true that all Sammy's albums with the band went #1, something they never did with Dave (Although it did take Thriller to hold 1984 out of #1)

[mboyd784]

Using Painkiller's logic, it has also been determined that Scott Stapp is superior to Jim Morrison.

[Painkiller]

Using Painkiller's logic, it has also been determined that Scott Stapp is superior to Jim Morrison.

You know, that's really not that outlandish. I've always though The Doors were about the most overrated band I ever heard. I mean really, what was so great about them? about Morrison? I never got that one, and I'm being dead serious here.

[Busch1724]

...or if he is deliberately stretching the truth.

That's what he's done his whole career though. I read his book and two things come across to me throughout his whole life: it's always about the money and nothing is ever Sam's fault. In my mind he's a bigger egomaniac than Roth just due to the shear fact that Roth will admit he's got an ego and Sammy doesn't. With that said, live Sammy is a better singer but Roth is a better entertainer. Whatever your cup of tea is, is who one thinks is the better guy. I'm not a Rothtard or support Hagar blindly, but I do prefer the Dave years. It just seemed more fun.

[Painkiller]

and by the way

It's funny you should bring up Stapp, because I think Alter Bridge is vastly superior to Creed, and there is a similar situation to Van Halen, but they did change the name of the band. Which was a smart move, because one is pop rock, (Creed) the other is Hard Rock/Metal (Alter Bridge). They took a huge leap forward with Kennedy.

[mboyd784]

You know, that's really not that outlandish. I've always though The Doors were about the most overrated band I ever heard. I mean really, what was so great about them? about Morrison? I never got that one, and I'm being dead serious here.

That's some good trollin!

Let me see if I can top it......Painkiller is, by far, the most overrated Judas Priest album...really only has 2 good songs on it. The main reason people hold it in high esteem is because it's the last album before the "douchebag new singer" came in and ruined the band. In that regard, it has a lot in common with VH 1984.

[Painkiller]

That's what he's done his whole career though. I read his book and two things come across to me throughout his whole life: it's always about the money and nothing is ever Sam's fault. In my mind he's a bigger egomaniac than Roth just due to the shear fact that Roth will admit he's got an ego and Sammy doesn't. With that said, live Sammy is a better singer but Roth is a better entertainer. Whatever your cup of tea is, is who one thinks is the better guy. I'm not a Rothtard or support Hagar blindly, but I do prefer the Dave years. It just seemed more fun.

I won't argue that the Dave years don't at least appear to have been a blast. I really don't know. I did grow up more in the Sammy Hagar era of Van Halen, and that probably makes a difference. The first Van Halen album I owned was 1984, the first I heard was Women and Children First. Not long after getting 1984, 5150 came out and I bought that one . (Remember when you used to be able to get the 12 cassettes deal for the price of 1 from Columbia house? :) ) I thought 5150 just kicked ass, without much experience with the Roth years at the time to compare the two. I discovered the rest of Van Halen's Dave albums later. My love of classic rock comes from my uncles. They were all 10 to 15 years older than me, and I was introduced to the music through them as I was growing up.

---------- Post added May-4th-2011 at 12:59 PM ----------


That's some good trollin!

Let me see if I can top it......Painkiller is, by far, the most overrated Judas Priest album...really only has 2 good songs on it. The main reason people hold it in high esteem is because it's the last album before the "douchebag new singer" came in and ruined the band. In that regard, it has a lot in common with VH 1984.

I don't know about that one, but fair enough. :) I think if you did a poll on a rock website, Painkiller would at least be in the top 3. Painkiller is kind of a stand alone album by them. They went full on speed metal for that album. Most of what they had done before (aside from the Turbo experiment) was more laid back. (Laid back compared to Painkiller) I mean, you can't even compare "You've got another thing coming" or "Breaking the Law" to "Metal Meltdown" or "All Guns Blazing"

You still didn't answer my question though. What's so good about the Doors and Jim Morrison? :)

[Kosher Ham]

Dave was better. He is a rock artist.

Sammy was a pop artist that landed a good gig.

Although I do agree that Morrison and the Doors are completely overrated.

[Sticksboi05]

VH VH II 1984

The rest is not necessary.

[Painkiller]

Bump

Recent pic of Eddie and Mike McCready from Pearl Jam. Eddie still looking sober.

www.vhnd.com

http://26.media.tumblr.com/tumblr_ll45guRJSD1qieyqyo1_500.jpg

[Busch1724]

Also festival dates in Australia come August or September. I'm sure that means new music soon!!!

[Kosher Ham]

You sure that isn't Mick in that picture with Eddie ?

[Painkiller]

Also festival dates in Australia come August or September. I'm sure that means new music soon!!!

the latest word is that the album is in the mixing stage. Probably set for a fall release.

At least we hope :)