a minor league for football

[Reaper 21]

http://espn.go.com/blog/afceast/post/_/id/30131/commish-for-a-day-create-minor-league

interesting article what do you guys think i personally would be down to see minor league games for our team. guys like capers get to see what they got. hell beck last year would have been nice.

[Gibbs Hog Heaven]

I'll never understand why NFL Europe was done away with.

That was a pretty good standard competitive breading ground that spawned quite a few notable NFL careers,

Hail.

[scruffylookin]

I'd love to see it. I never thought of it being played during the NFL season before though. It's an interesting idea to be able to send people up or down during the course of the season. I agree with the writer, if these clubs are run by the big clubs, then there would be an audience for this league on television.

[benskins26]

The ufl woulda/coulda/shoulda been this vehicle, if they hadn't put all their eggs into the basket of playing in the fall during a lost NFL season. It coulda worked out great. If players from the XFL could find their way to the NFL, I'm sure the ufl could have created a full on farm system eventually.

[Sawyer5500]

I think it would be a great idea. I'd love to watch our minor league play on friday night or saturdays then watch the skins on sunday.

[HTTR F Dallas]

I think it would be a great idea. I'd love to watch our minor league play on friday night or saturdays then watch the skins on sunday.

Agree, A minor league would be brilliant... Being able to move players up and down would only enhance the NFL

With 90 able to come to training camp, you've got your second team right there.. Great way for injured players to rehab as well.. much better to try them out in the minors before coming back to a game that actually matters...

[onedrop]

everyone would like to see it. they tried it, it failed. not going to happen.

[HTTR F Dallas]

everyone would like to see it. they tried it, it failed. not going to happen.

When did they try it?

[TD_washingtonredskins]

In theory, a true minor league would be really cool. You could have a "B team" that is governed by the organization so that philosophies and continuity can take hold...just like in baseball. That way, if you needed to call up a WR or ILB on game day from your minor league team, he would know the system and be prepared. In that past, it seems that teams loosely owned the rights to players, but they would play on an independent team which, to me, limits many of the advantages. Sure, each NFL team still has a pool of players it can choose from, but it's not the same.

Now, I realize that for my idea to take hold you would essentially need to double the current NFL so that each team's affiliate could run practices, play games, etc. I guess the rosters could be a little smaller, but you'd still need at least 25 players per team. They could play their games in current NFL stadiums, so that shouldn't cause too much of an issue from a scheduling perspective. Still, I'm sure there are plenty of reasons this hasn't been done, but I do believe that's the only way a minor league would work long-term. Otherwise, with teams sharing players who belong to other teams, you can never really control the playing time or experience your players are getting. You also can't allow the minor league players to learn the system you're implementing at the "big league" level.

[onedrop]

When did they try it?

nfl europe

[RFKFedEx]

I'll never understand why NFL Europe was done away with.

secret: it wasn't making money.

[HTTR F Dallas]

nfl europe

so in NFL Europe, each team had a minor league program that was run by that team? and had players to swap back and forth as needed?

[Gibbs Hog Heaven]

secret: it wasn't making money.

Ask a stupid question. The all mighty dollar. Silly not thinking me. Thanks man.

Hail.

[JMURedskins]

While it would be nice to have, it would take a whole lot to set it up. The player movement would be a lot more tricky than just bouncing players between leagues. Baseball has a lot of rules when it comes to moves and Football would probably be no different. Also, do you want your future franchise QB working in the minors or do you want him working with the big club? Also, there is a lot of value in having a practice squad. Also, there would have to be new ways to deal with contracts(minor league vs NFL).

[Rdskns2000]

I proposed one before and will do it again later on.

[onedrop]

so in NFL Europe, each team had a minor league program that was run by that team? and had players to swap back and forth as needed?

no, youre thinking of the nhl and i think they call it "hockey".

[HTTR F Dallas]

no, youre thinking of the nhl and i think they call it "hockey".

So what you are saying is that the NFL has not tried a minor league system that mirrors MLB or NHL... they tried NFL Europe, which had what.. 6 teams? so don't tell me they tried it and failed.. maybe the way they set it up was the failure... the idea is great and if put together correctly would flourish...

[onedrop]

So what you are saying is that the NFL has not tried a minor league system that mirrors MLB or NHL... they tried NFL Europe, which had what.. 6 teams? so don't tell me they tried it and failed.. maybe the way they set it up was the failure... the idea is great and if put together correctly would flourish...

what i said was the nfl had their minor league and it failed. probably because it was in europe. the nfl would not make a dime off of a 32 team farm club system so it isnt going to happen.

[DButz65]

so in NFL Europe, each team had a minor league program that was run by that team? and had players to swap back and forth as needed?

No, each team had players they had rights to, but none of the NFL Franchises ran a whole team in that league. If you try and find some pictures, you will see different teams emblems on the jerseys of different players, even on the same team

Like this one, one player has the Jags emblem, the other has the Texans
http://a.espncdn.com/media/nfl/2005/0609/photo/g_ragone_195.jpg

[kiingspadee]

I was always in favor for this - I mean look at NHL. farm teams help teams to grow and helps to find gems

[RFKFedEx]

As much as we clamor for pro football in this country, the market has proven time and again that we don't want more of it.

There have been several attempts at minor league football over the decades, and it just doesn't work. See the XFL in the 2000s, the USFL in the 80s, and WFL in the 70s, meanwhile the arena league has been on life support in recent years.

The NFL has seen all of these failed attempts and decided that they don't need to go there. Less is more.

Football costs a lot more to run than baseball, there are a lot more people to pay.

[HTTR F Dallas]

No, each team had players they had rights to, but none of the NFL Franchises ran a whole team in that league. If you try and find some pictures, you will see different teams emblems on the jerseys of different players, even on the same team

I guess that was my point in the beginning. NFL Europe wasn't a true minor league system like what MLB/NHL have. It may have had some of the same principles, but the way it was set up and where it was being played almost certainly set it up for failure. The NFL would be enhanced if it were to bring a minor league system here and keep it in the U.S. If each team was owned and managed by their parent organization, I could see that succeeding and help grow the NFL. I don't know if the NFL would make money on it or not, but I doubt they'd lose anything. At the very least, it supplies new jobs and creates deeper organizations that can provide better football. My opinion anyway..

[RFKFedEx]

They already have a minor league system, its called the NCAA.

Where would these minor league teams play? College and NFL teams don't want to share their stadiums.

[HTTR F Dallas]

As much as we clamor for pro football in this country, the market has proven time and again that we don't want more of it.

There have been several attempts at minor league football over the decades, and it just doesn't work. See the XFL in the 2000s, the USFL in the 80s, and WFL in the 70s, meanwhile the arena league has been on life support in recent years.

The NFL has seen all of these failed attempts and decided that they don't need to go there. Less is more.

Football costs a lot more to run than baseball, there are a lot more people to pay.

I don't know much about those other leagues (XFL, USFL or WFL), but were they set up in any way like a farm system? I could understand why "other" football leagues would fail going up against the NFL, but I don't see a true minor league system failing, not when they're working together. You don't have to pay minor league players much... I'm sure many UDFA coming out of college would take the opportunity to play on a minor league NFL team with an opportunity to show their talent and make it to the big stage even if they were only getting paid $25k/year...
Baseballs minor league farm systems probably have close to 30 players per team... with probably 5 teams... pretty sure baseball has many more people to pay.

[wilco_holland]

As a persone who went to the NFL Europe games I can say that it was impossible to earn any money with that. No fans.

The only reason why the games in London are sold out is because all European fans then buy a ticket and take a trip to London. That works for one game but not for a hole season spread over different city´s.

I like the idea but the UFL isn´t making any money or popular...and they use the players that probally would play for a minor team. How does that work in MLB and NBA? Are there fans or is it just a investment by the teams so they can develop talent. You are talking about two stadiums/playing fields and over 100 players who would have a contract, can they pay that?

[TD_washingtonredskins]

RFK, I don't think the idea is to air more games (though I'm sure the NFL Network would do so), but to give each team the opportunity to cultivate young talent all on the same team in order to promote its organizational philosophies, teach its systems, and keep close tabs on its talent.

[HTTR F Dallas]

They already have a minor league system, its called the NCAA.

Where would these minor league teams play? College and NFL teams don't want to share their stadiums.

Obviously setting up a minor league system would probably take a few years, but the minor league would be "part of" the NFL, so maybe they do play on the same field, but maybe they only play games every other weekend with a 8 game schedule and they play at home on Saturdays when the Redskins are away... allows the field to not be totally screwed up... if that's not an option, then build a small stadium or lease one from a university... i don't have it all figured out or anything, but i'm sure they could figure out place to play.

[RFKFedEx]

99% of the NFL talent comes from college. If a healthy player isn't producing by the age of 22 in the NCAA, it's highly unlikely he'll grow into a quality player by the age of 25 at the next level. That's how baseball differs from football. Guys have more time and longer careers to reach potential.

[HTTR F Dallas]

They already have a minor league system, its called the NCAA.

Where would these minor league teams play? College and NFL teams don't want to share their stadiums.

play the minor league redskin games at RFK... gaurantee that game sells out

[JMURedskins]

I like the idea but the UFL isn´t making any money or popular...and they use the players that probally would play for a minor team. How does that work in MLB and NBA? Are there fans or is it just a investment by the teams so they can develop talent. You are talking about two stadiums/playing fields and over 100 players who would have a contract, can they pay that?

Minor league baseball has a decent number of fans who live in the area and want to go to a game cheap. They do a lot more promotional type things and it is more of a family atmosphere. A lot of people go to game who are a fan of the major league team so that they can watch the prospects that could make it to the majors. The stadiums aren't near the quality of pro stadiums. It takes longer to develop in baseball but there are also 6 levels that some players have to go through if they start in the rookie league.

[HTTR F Dallas]

99% of the NFL talent comes from college. If a healthy player isn't producing by the age of 22 in the NCAA, it's highly unlikely he'll grow into a quality player by the age of 25 at the next level. That's how baseball differs from football. Guys have more time and longer careers to reach potential.

No doubt that an NFL minor league system wouldn't have more turn over than MLB, becuase you are right, baseball players do have longer careers. The NFL minor league roster would turnover 10x faster than baseball minor leagues, but if you can give an NFL team an extra 30 players to teach and try to develop, even if it's for 2 or 3 years per player, I gaurantee you'll develop and find more talent. If an NFL team doesn't see what they want out of a 25 year old minor leaguer after 3 years than they'll cut them and bring in some young 21/22 year olds out of college.. it would be a constant carousel, but it would still work and dot he job that it is designed for, which is finding and developing talent and teaching the philosphies of their organization.

[RFKFedEx]

but if you can give an NFL team an extra 30 players to teach and try to develop.

We already have the top 224 college players drafted into the NFL each year. Less than 200 of those guys will make NFL rosters in their first year. Maybe a half dozen of those August cuts each year will fight their way back into the league at a later time.


In theory, an additional 1600+ players would be needed for every NFL franchise to field a minor league team. Realistically, you need 52 men to make a team. I wouldn't want my linemen and D backs, receivers, linebackers, playing on both sides of the ball the way a team does in high school.

Of those 1600 men in the developmentel who weren't drafted, maybe a dozen a year will make it up to the NFL eventually, and that's being generous.

Not nearly worth the co$t IMO.

[HTTR F Dallas]

We already have the top 224 college players drafted into the NFL each year. Less than 200 of those guys will make NFL rosters in their first year. Maybe a half dozen of those August cuts each year will fight their way back into the league at a later time.


In theory, an additional 1600+ players would be needed for every NFL franchise to field a minor league team. Realistically, you need 52 men to make a team. I wouldn't want my linemen and D backs, receivers, linebackers, playing on both sides of the ball the way a team does in high school.

Of those 1600 men in the developmentel who weren't drafted, maybe a dozen a year will make it up to the NFL eventually, and that's being generous.

Not nearly worth the co$t IMO.

Not sure you'd need such a full roster... I'd say at the most you need a starter and a back up at each position, so that gives you about 44... That would be plenty. You already have about 8 on your practice squad, so now you're looking for 36 more players per team... I'd even go as far as reducing an NFL roster size, now that you've got an entire minor league team to use as replacement... No NFL team needs 3 QB's anymore... Take 2 to each game and have the 3rd string as your starter in the minors... Imagine if we had actually seen Beck play a full season in the minors last year... same could go with other positions...

Anyway, I really don't think we'd have trouble finding the talent to fill these teams... yes, not all would make the NFL team, but that's how it goes in any sport. We're going to be taking 90 players to training camp, presumably... that's 90 players that coaches feel might have a shot at making the roster... If coaches/teams are willing to take them to training camp, they'd be willing to put most of them on their minor league roster.

Also, imagine if we had a back up kicker that was nuttin them all day in the minors... do you think we would have hesitated to replace Gano last year or for the upcoming year? The minors would just be a good place to be able to keep viewing talent that might help your ball club. Bottom line.

[Darth Tater]

Given the fact that at best you would improve the NFL on a very small margin (and even that is debatable) and the bottom line would almost certainly be negatively effected, you have multiple development leagues (albeit limited because you don't assign players to them that you can then move up or down as needed) and the small window that most potential players have to be effective, why would the NFL do such a thing?

[Reaper 21]

let me tell you who would rock the minor league.

Mike Shannahan he would have gems all over the place because thats the way he works. I would have loved to go watch John Beck Throw to terrence Austin all last year and see if Capers could actually block other than the 30 second highlite on youtube.

I would pay 25 bucks to go watch a game at RFK or even Fedex to see our B team play others much more than the NBA D league or MLB because the talent level is so signifigant, where in the NFL alot of players get missed due to system.

Also would have love to see a young coach down there make a name for himself, for example what if Kyle won 3 championships (extreme homersim I know) at the minor league before he was promoted to the Big leagues, wouldnt we all trust him more.

[MarkB452]

nfl europe

Also, check out the Atlantic Coast Football League...they were done in by the WFL rather than any financial problems of their own.

The Redskins had a team in Roanoke called the Buckskins. The Saints had a team in Richmond called the Richmond Saints. Their coach was JD Roberts. I went to elementary school with his son and JD Roberts was later hired to coach the New Orleans Saints (even though the Richmond team was really bad). Probably the most famous team was the Pottstown Firebirds who were affiliated with the Eagles. NFL Films made a documentary on the Firebirds called the "Forgetables". It is a part of the Lost Treasures of NFL Films. I saw it and they showed some of a game they played against the BuckSkins. The uniforms looked very similar to their NFL counterparts. If you did not know what you were watching, you would have thought it was the Skins vs. the Eagles.


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Atlantic_Coast_Football_League

I know Ted Vactor played for the VA Sailors (it is mentioned on the back of one of his football cards). I met him at the AAA TGC and asked him where the Sailors had played and he said he thought it was Herndon.

http://web.archive.org/web/20081206051635/http://www.pottstownfirebirds.com/ACFL%20football/Atlantic%20Coast%20Football/Franchises.htm

[Rdskns2000]

I think it could work if done right.


You have 8 divisions in the NFL, so you would set up a MINOR LEAGUE of 8 teams with one team assigned to each division.

National Football Minor Leauge East

Orlando- NFC South
Milwaukee - NFC North
Hartford- AFC East
Toronto- NFC East

National Football Minor Leauge West

Portland- NFC West
San Antonio- AFC West
Columbus- AFC North
Memphis- AFC South

You would play a 10 game season. 6 Division games and 4 games against the other division. Top 4 make playoffs.

You would start the season at the end of September with the season going until the beginning of December and then 2 weeks of playoffs.

Training camp would start at the end of August and rosters will be made of free agents, castoffs and players each nfl team designates to this fall league.
Think of instead of having playings put on a practice squad, they would instead play in this league. Once each team season is over, those players will
be available to be called up for the remaining games in the NFL season.

Games would be broadcoast on the NFL network.

Games would be played on Tuesday nights.

[sundancer91]

I think it would be a great idea. I'd love to watch our minor league play on friday night or saturdays then watch the skins on sunday.
http://www.chambersburgcardinals.com/history.html
actually there is a minor league for football .I just came home from watching our local team play (Chambersburg Cardinals) they played the DC Explosion tonight

[RedskinWarship]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/World_League_of_American_Football



this was cool back then. all 2 seasons of it

[RichmondRedskin88]

Put one in Richmond. It makes sense. Lots of Redskin fans and close to DC.