PFT: John Beck Makes it Easy on the Shanahans

[Chiefinonhaze]

http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2011/08/19/john-beck-makes-it-easy-on-the-shanahans/

Washington’s Week One quarterback spot was always John Beck’s job to lose.

Beck didn’t leave anything to chance Friday night, all but guaranteeing he will get the call for the Redskins against the Giants on September 11. The BYU product completed 14-of-17 passes for 140 yards against the Colts.

Buoyed by a dominant running game, Beck led the Redskins to 16 points in the first half against Indy. (3 field goals and a touchdown.) Washington kept bogging down in the red zone, but Beck didn’t make any bad decisions.

After a slow start to camp because of a groin injury, Beck is healthy again. Most impressive was Beck’s pocket presence. He evaded the rush and moved well. It should be noted that the Colts never show up in the preseason, and they have been absolutely steamrolled two straight weeks.

That’s not Beck’s concern. The Shanahans were looking for any reason to make Beck the starter, and he made the decision easy Friday.

UPDATE: Rex Grossman didn’t lead the Redskins to any points. He threw for 88 yards on 12 attempts with an interception. Ballgame.

[G.A.C.O.L.B.]

Crazy how one person can write an op-ed column (J Reid) and then it becomes a universal fact.

[Chiefinonhaze]

The real question is, who gets the start against the Ravens? And how long will he play

[Boston Skins]

The real question is, who gets the start against the Ravens? And how long will he play

Put Beck in. I'm not convinced that the Colts have their act together on defense. Beck's gotta be consistent against the Ravens D to earn that starting job.

[Fred Jones]

The Beck haters should show themselves.

[grhqofb5]

Good performance. But enormous dork. Did anyone see that post game interview? Sound like a JV freshman after his first scrimmage.

(that being said, I fully support him and there's nothing wrong with dorks. I discourage bullying in all contexts. If Beck wants to dance instead of play football that is fine).

[Chiefinonhaze]

I hope Beck starts next week. I basically know what to expect from Grossman

[DeaconTheVillain]

Good performance. But enormous dork. Did anyone see that post game interview? Sound like a JV freshman after his first scrimmage.

(that being said, I fully support him and there's nothing wrong with dorks. I discourage bullying in all contexts. If Beck wants to dance instead of play football that is fine).
This post made me laugh.

He played well. But watta nerd. Did anyone see him in the interview?

(Its ok he can be who he is and I don't judge)

[skinner6775]

you just did judge...i like him and both qb's we are gonna surprise some folks

[grhqofb5]

This post made me laugh.

He played well. But watta nerd. Did anyone see him in the interview?

(Its ok he can be who he is and I don't judge)

I feel like I should mail him a chemistry book and a pokemon DVD set so he can sign it for my wall.

(not to say there's anything wrong with science. Our country needs good scientific minds. Education should be encouraged. And liking Pokemon at the age of 31 is normal. To each his own).

[Hitman21ST]

Those red zone points will come once we get HankTime running routes in the end zone.

[authentic]

This post made me laugh.

He played well. But watta nerd. Did anyone see him in the interview?

(Its ok he can be who he is and I don't judge)

Yeah, i felt the same way. The guy is quite irritating to hear talk.... But he looked good tonight. IMO he should start next week.

[Destino]

The Beck haters should show themselves.

You should stop spamming the same post in every thread.

[wdcredskins]

grossman or beck... it doesnt matter if we cant score TDs.

last week, i think we were in the red zone 5 times and scored only 1 TD. not sure how many times in the red zone tonight 6 times? but again., scored only 1 TD

i recall jason campbell being able to move the ball but failed miserably in the red zone always settling for FGs and fans gettting pissed. not sure why we arent pissed now. oh cause defense is actually playing well and keep opponents way below the league avg.

[WhoRUSupposed2Be]

He does sound irritating to listen to but who gives a damn.

Just play the game the way you know how to Beck and people will love you, including I ;)

[OuterBanksTarHeel]

The Beck haters should show themselves.

We're happy you're so easily impressed with a QB who padded his stats off checkdown throws.

Good luck w/ that approach when the Giants are stacking the box.

[SoulSkin]

Beck does have some canned answers for the questions he's being asked, but I don't think he's a dork. He's just answering like a pro, a'la Shanahan. That being said, I don't believe the decision at QB is made. I don't think he seperated himself that dramatically, but I could see how Shanahan would prefer his game management skills (take what's there, don't take unecessary risks). I think we'll know a hell of a lot more about what Beck can do next week.

[grhqofb5]

Beck does have some canned answers for the questions he's being asked, but I don't think he's a dork. He's just answering like a pro, a'la Shanahan. That being said, I don't believe the decision at QB is made. I don't think he seperated himself that dramatically, but I could see how Shanahan would prefer his game management skills (take what's there, don't take unecessary risks). I think we'll know a hell of a lot more about what Beck can do next week.

I agree with everything you just said, except the part about him not being a huge dork.

(I'd be pleased to have him as our QB, as long as he wins).

[darrelgreenie]

Crazy how one person can write an op-ed column (J Reid) and then it becomes a universal fact.That's modern sports media/football coverage.
A lot of these guys don't know enough football to write about Xs and Os or give interviews about the great game of football.

So they create stories.
Sadly writers are often part of the story these days.

[THEREALTOR1]

I would imagine Beck would love to start against baltimore. He may not feel the same by halftime, but i'd at least think he'd be up for the challenge to start

[I_Bleed_B&G]

John Beck made me LOL on his post game interview. They way he talks is hilarious

[Boss_Hogg]

How does John Beck talk?

[SoulSkin]

I agree with everything you just said, except the part about him not being a huge dork.

(I'd be pleased to have him as our QB, as long as he wins).

Fair enough, he has dorkish tendancies, but that doesn't worry me a bit. I always thought Rypien was a dork, but damned if I didn't grow to love that dork. IMO, Doug Williams is also a little socially awkward, not Charles Mann sideline-reporting awkward, but awkward. Love em all.

[grhqofb5]

Fair enough, he has dorkish tendancies, but that doesn't worry me a bit. I always thought Rypien was a dork, but damned if I didn't grow to love that dork. IMO, Doug Williams is also a little socially awkward, not Charles Mann sideline-reporting awkward, but awkward. Love em all.

Rypien was more a gentle giant than a dork. Williams was antisocial. So was Schroeder. Brunell was a turd. Campbell was pretty cool. Beck is a dork.

[Drkstar]

John Beck made me LOL on his post game interview. They way he talks is hilarious

crazy mormon speak

[Hitman21ST]

We're happy you're so easily impressed with a QB who padded his stats off checkdown throws.

Good luck w/ that approach when the Giants are stacking the box.

So then we throw to the receivers against their weak secondary. What, can you not give Beck any credit?

[War Paint]

Rypien was more a gentle giant than a dork. Williams was antisocial. So was Schroeder. Brunell was a turd. Campbell was pretty cool. Beck is a dork.

Campbell sounded like he was stoned all the time.

[DeaconTheVillain]

John Beck made me LOL on his post game interview. They way he talks is hilarious

I haven't seen anything of him or heard him, but I take it that its worth a listen if so many are mentioning it.

[21cents]

Campbell sounded like he was stoned all the time.

campbell sounds like the local guy at 7-11

[Hitman21ST]

Rypien was more a gentle giant than a dork. Williams was antisocial. So was Schroeder. Brunell was a turd. Campbell was pretty cool. Beck is a dork.

Brunell sounded like he learned to interview from genericpostgamepressergenerator.com

[ConnSKINS26]

Not sure what he's making easy. I'm not impressed with Beck yet.

I take that back. I am actually impressed with his velocity on short throws over the middle and that one out to Armstrong.

[Warhead36]

I was impressed with his overall polish and crispness in play. No he may not be Manning or Brady but those type of QBs don't exactly grow on trees. He looks like a good fit for our system. People can hate all they want on the short to medium passing game but how many times did McNabb short hop those to screw up drives?

[Hitman21ST]

Not sure what he's making easy. I'm not impressed with Beck yet.

I take that back. I am actually impressed with his velocity on short throws over the middle and that one out to Armstrong.

Would have liked to see Armstrong run the route two yards deeper though :hammer:

[thesubmittedone]

Beck was solid today, and one thing he did do was shut every idiot who said he's got a weak arm up. Where that even came from is unknown, but the dude was throwing missiles the entire game. I was actually longing for one deep ball, or heck, even one touch pass from him and all he did was bullet everything into the receivers chests. Gotta love how both Beck and Grossman are doing a great job leading the backs out of the flats on their throws as well, making them catch it in stride.

It seems like thus far this preseason we've only run two fundamental plays, the stretch run and the bootleg pass. We've focused on the short throws mainly and some intermediate as well. I think Grossman throws an easier ball to catch, but Beck was impressive with his accuracy considering the velocity he had on those balls. I also like Beck more as a mobile QB than Grossman, but I still think Grossman runs this offense a little better right now.

This is a really, really good QB competition we have here. Both guys can succeed.

[ConnSKINS26]

Would have liked to see Armstrong run the route two yards deeper though :hammer:

Wait--you might be thinking of that throw to Austin to the left where he had to dive for it and didn't get the first. I hated that throw/route. I'm talking about earlier in the game, a nice little hook or out to the right (can't remember), where Armstrong did get the first.

[Hitman21ST]

Wait--you might be thinking of that throw to Austin to the left where he had to dive for it and didn't get the first. I hated that throw/route. I'm talking about earlier in the game, a nice little hook or out to the right (can't remember), where Armstrong did get the first.

Ah, you're right. Good catch. I do remember the Armstrong curl route though, and agree with you.

[thesubmittedone]

By the way, this article is absolutely ridiculous. Why do they keep trying to stir up a controversy by acting like the Shanahan's want Grossman to fail so Beck can be the guy or something? If anyone doubts that Shanny will play the best guy for this team they're only fooling themselves. So far, I think Grossman is winning the battle, but not by much at all. Beck will probably play better against pressure, but Grossman can run the offense better as long as he's protected well.

[Chiefinonhaze]

The title of this article is terrible. If anything, John Beck made the decision harder. Before this game, Grossman was considered the starter based on his play last week. Now, its about 50-50

[G.A.C.O.L.B.]

That's modern sports media/football coverage.
A lot of these guys don't know enough football to write about Xs and Os or give interviews about the great game of football.

So they create stories.
Sadly writers are often part of the story these days.

The crazy thing is this though: I listen to 106.7 everyday (again, car radio antennae broke, no choice), and every guest they bring on there--Peter King, Grant Paulson, Rick Maese, Rick Snider, etc--they ask about Jason Reid's BS that Beck is already locked in. NOT A SINGLE ONE has backed it up or agreed that it's the case, yet it keeps getting pushed endlessly by them, PFT, and others. Hell even 980. And if Grossman starts Week 1, and Reid is obviously full of ****, next time he comes out with something controversial, they'll act like his word is golden and whatever he has to say is another universally-accepted fact.

And you're dead on, not a single one of them talks X's and O's either. It's all background, soap opera, behind the scenes bull****. How anyone listens/reads/watches that crap and takes it seriously for even a minute is beyond me.

[WyomingRedskin]

The title of this article is terrible. If anything, John Beck made the decision harder. Before this game, Grossman was considered the starter based on his play last week. Now, its about 50-50

Depends who you believe. With Rex's performance last weekend, I assumed he was likely to get the starting nod. But there have been reports all week that the coaches still favor Beck.

[Hitman21ST]

The title of this article is terrible. If anything, John Beck made the decision harder. Before this game, Grossman was considered the starter based on his play last week. Now, its about 50-50

I think the article was assuming Beck was the starter before the first game, then Grossman's play made it about even, then Beck regained his lead based on his play tonight.

[monkeezgob]

Beck's dink and dunk approach worked fine tonight, he looked ok, one or two passes tailed off though. He looked mobile, perhaps overly cautious. Start him against the Ravens, let's see if they can take away the dink and dunk and get him to air it out a bit more.

[Warhead36]

One thing to point out: after the first drive, we were using our backup WRs. A lot more Austin and Stallworth and I don't think I saw Moss or Gaffney after that first TD drive.

[Chiefinonhaze]

I think the article was assuming Beck was the starter before the first game, then Grossman's play made it about even, then Beck regained his lead based on his play tonight.

Based on the stats, Beck did not outperform Grossman. Honestly, I would not be able to choose one right now with full confidence. It seems to be dead even right now. It's certainly not an easy decision, the author of the article must be under the influence

---------- Post added August-19th-2011 at 11:43 PM ----------

Also, I think Beck will be on a mission next week. He will be playing a Ravens team that he is familiar with, and a team that cut him.

[Hitman21ST]

Based on the stats, Beck did not outperform Grossman. Honestly, I would not be able to choose one right now with full confidence. It seems to be dead even right now. It's certainly not an easy decision, the author of the article must be under the influence

Higher completion percentage, fewer yards, 1 less TD (which is more on Gaffney than Beck, but that's for a different thread), and 1 fewer INT. They're comparable.

[wishful]

beck is mcnab all over again no fire in the belly no eye of the tiger.the team responds to grossman better

[Hitman21ST]

beck is mcnab all over again no fire in the belly no eye of the tiger.the team responds to grossman better

You came to this conclusion how?

[monkeezgob]

Wait--you might be thinking of that throw to Austin to the left where he had to dive for it and didn't get the first. I hated that throw/route. I'm talking about earlier in the game, a nice little hook or out to the right (can't remember), where Armstrong did get the first.

Yep, the throw to Austin was a poor throw, the ball was tailing away, hence the reason Austin came up short, he had to lay out to catch it.

[Brianbien83]

I was only watching with half an eye tonight, but it didn't really seem like Beck threw the ball more than 10 yards in the air. Seemed like he had some zip on the throws he did make, but I want to see what he has on the intermediate/deep routes before I declare myself at all comfortable.

[atlSkinfan]

[/COLOR]Also, I think Beck will be on a mission next week. He will be playing a Ravens team that he is familiar with, and a team that cut him.[/QUOTE]

When I was reading this I first said ,"WHAT? Beck is going to go on another Morman mission before the season?" lol

[darrelgreenie]

Wait--you might be thinking of that throw to Austin to the left where he had to dive for it and didn't get the first. I hated that throw/route.I didn't mind the route concept its a common one.
But, I thought that was Beck's worst throw of the night.
The design of that route combo is to hit Austin in stride in the flat for a catch and run.
But, Beck didn't lead Austin enough into the flat towards the sideline; instead Beck put the ball right on him instead of out in front of him causing Austin to slowdown and adjust to the ball and fall.

---------- Post added August-20th-2011 at 12:10 AM ----------

I charted Beck's passes on this game and from an efficiency standpoint he was lights out.
IIRC he only threw 2 bad balls.

[Tom10Y]

For me, it's still a toss up. Grossman throws with confidence and when he is on, it's a beauty to watch. Beck throws with, I would not say hesitation, but less confident. Now, is confidence and risk-taking what we need to win the big games and make big plays? Or would Beck's cautious demeanor lead to missed chances and dinks and dunk plays ala Brunnell? I guess we just have to wait and see who wins or losses more games.

[hfmonk]

I guess it was the interception against 3rd stringers along with the lack of accuracy, and the inability to score that really won over the Grossman lovers tonight and make them so sure he is the one to lead this team.....the 14-17 passing on dink and dunk stuff and 16 points scored against a 1st string Colts defense means nothing because Manning wasnt playing..... LOL...

Believe me, I thought Beck and Grossman were bad choices to run the team this year and have been hoping for Luck.... But tonight, I think Shanny is proving why he is a great QB talent evaluator and not me or alot of y'all. Shanny did coach up Young into a HOF QB after he was a nothing QB on a nothing team. Beck may not be HOF talent but I think he can get us where we want to go with Shanny's coaching. To paraphrase a song....All I am saying is give Beck a chance!

p.s. one other thing: McNabb's ability to score in the red zone was far more pronounced.....we could go 6 series without a score....Heck! We could go games! Beck scored 4of 6 times in the redzone....How many did Grossman against 3rd stringers?

[No_Pressure]

Good performance. But enormous dork. Did anyone see that post game interview? Sound like a JV freshman after his first scrimmage.

(that being said, I fully support him and there's nothing wrong with dorks. I discourage bullying in all contexts. If Beck wants to dance instead of play football that is fine).

Ever see Mark Rypien's sweaters from 1991?

[OuterBanksTarHeel]

I guess Grossman didn't light up the first-team Steelers last week all of the sudden.

I don't understand why it's so difficult for people to analyze the vast differences in the types of completions Beck made this week, vs. the kind Grossman made last week, or the fact that Grossman was facing third stringers behind a third string offensive line.

[mjpanzer]

o
grossman or beck... it doesnt matter if we cant score TDs.

last week, i think we were in the red zone 5 times and scored only 1 TD. not sure how many times in the red zone tonight 6 times? but again., scored only 1 TD

i recall jason campbell being able to move the ball but failed miserably in the red zone always settling for FGs and fans gettting pissed. not sure why we arent pissed now. oh cause defense is actually playing well and keep opponents way below the league avg.

or maybe we aren't pissed because it's *gasp* preseason. I am with you though, if we continue to not get 6 on our redzone trips (in the regular season) I will be very pissed at Shanny and son.

[Hitman21ST]

I guess Grossman didn't light up the first-team Steelers last week all of the sudden.

I don't understand why it's so difficult for people to analyze the vast differences in the types of completions Beck made this week, vs. the kind Grossman made last week, or the fact that Grossman was facing third stringers behind a third string offensive line.

...and threw a bad interception to a third-string linebacker while Beck drove against the starters....

[OuterBanksTarHeel]

...and threw a bad interception to a third-string linebacker while Beck drove against the starters....

You're right--he's not perfect.

Beck would've driven us up and down the field against the Steelers, too, on a bunch of screens and slants.

John Beck=the new Jason Campbell. He's just going to fool's gold some of you all season, and all we'll have to hear about is how we should be "patient." Note to self: don't bother reading threads related to John Beck for the next two years.

[sundancer91]

grossman or beck... it doesnt matter if we cant score TDs.

last week, i think we were in the red zone 5 times and scored only 1 TD. not sure how many times in the red zone tonight 6 times? but again., scored only 1 TD

i recall jason campbell being able to move the ball but failed miserably in the red zone always settling for FGs and fans gettting pissed. not sure why we arent pissed now. oh cause defense is actually playing well and keep opponents way below the league avg.

[Hitman21ST]

You're right--he's not perfect.

Beck would've driven us up and down the field against the Steelers, too, on a bunch of screens and slants.

John Beck=the new Jason Campbell. He's just going to fool's gold some of you all season, and all we'll have to hear about is how we should be "patient." Note to self: don't bother reading threads related to John Beck for the next two years.

I trust Shanahan's eval of him. From his play tonight, it appears that he was right on. He's smarter with the ball than Campbell, has a better release, and makes better throws. Drop the haterade.

[HateNMyEyez]

...and threw a bad interception to a third-string linebacker while Beck drove against the starters....

who cares if he threw an interception dude? that dink and dunk crap isnt gonna cut it period. We cant have a qb like jason campbell whos gonna take the easy route and check down all the time and hit the easy completions, you will never win doing that. Grossman takes chances and you have to be that way to win games. To me this isnt a competition. The way i see it is if Beck starts then we are playing for luck and if grossman starts then we are actually trying to win this yr. Pitts first string D is way better then Indys D bar none. Its not even comparable to me why so many feel beck looked better 2nite, cuz i beg to differ, but opinions vary, but i will say that grossman looked good 2nite, most of his incompletions were on the money, but were dropped and he wasnt even playing behind the starting offensive line

[War Paint]

I thought Beck did a very good job tonight. I would've liked to see him go deep some, but he was on point with what he did. I just got done seeing NFL Live and they were giving Beck a lot of props. Also, after seeing highlights of Kolb and various other QBs, Beck looked superb in comparison. Now if we can just find a way to convert those FGs into TDs. That is the only area where I see work to be done. We are dominating teams in yards, but we still keep them in games by settling on FGs.

[sundancer91]

you are right we out gained Indy at 1 point 400 yrds to 100 and were up 13-0 Scoring TDS is the difference !

[mjpanzer]

I am sorry, but this needs to be said.

IT IS COMPLETELY UNFAIR to suddenly call Beck a "Dink and Dunker" or "The new Jason Campbell" based off one game. For all we know the coaches said, "Hey John, the running game is working, so let's keep spreading the ball shallow and let these guys make them keep missing."

The only 3 or 4 times Beck actually attempted to throw it past 10 yards he did an awesome job.

Next week will show us. If it is clear that Beck keeps throwing it to the out, we may have a theory, but to blame Beck for throwing so many screens when those were the plays being called is absolutely ridiculous.

/Rant

[OuterBanksTarHeel]

I trust Shanahan's eval of him. From his play tonight, it appears that he was right on. He's smarter with the ball than Campbell, has a better release, and makes better throws. Drop the haterade.

I trust that coaches only share the good parts of their evaluations with the public, and that Shanahan's options in the offseason at QB were extremely limited.

A better release? Maybe quicker--but he sidearms the thing. The Giants will get at least 10 batted balls in week 1.

I like his mobility and tempo, but I don't see anything in him that shows me he'll be able to make plays downfield.

[Hitman21ST]

who cares if he threw an interception dude? that dink and dunk crap isnt gonna cut it period. We cant have a qb like jason campbell whos gonna take the easy route and check down all the time and hit the easy completions, you will never win doing that.

That's what you do against the Colts defense. They play a deep Cover 2, to specifically stop the deep balls. You beat them by throwing underneath. Beck averaged over 8 yards per attempt. That's an awesome average for a QB. Meanwhile, against the same defense, Grossman averaged 7.3 yards per attempt. Against the Steelers, he averaged just under 8 yards per attempt. Beck's doing just fine thank you very much.

[ConnSKINS26]

I thought Beck did a very good job tonight. I would've liked to see him go deep some, but he was on point with what he did. I just got done seeing NFL Live and they were giving Beck a lot of props. Also, after seeing highlights of Kolb and various other QBs, Beck looked superb in comparison. Now if we can just find a way to convert those FGs into TDs. That is the only area where I see work to be done. We are dominating teams in yards, but we still keep them in games by settling on FGs.

They smell a Cinderella story (Beck). National media loves a good underdog story. It will be interesting to see how they cover it.

Slice it any way you like (and I've already criticized Beck in this very thread), but Beck had an 82% completion percentage vs. a (mostly) starting defense. That's a very interesting stat, even just on the surface, even just in preseason. Wouldn't be surprised to see NFL Network and ESPN latch onto that stat, either. Because it makes for a good story.

And I'm not saying that it shouldn't make a good story. I'm just saying that it doesn't matter to them right now.

[bigtymeskin2126]

Beck deserves the shot other recent 2nd rounders have gotten. Either he will turn into Kevin Kolb and start for us, or at least net us a good trade, and if not we can cut our losses on the 2nd coming of Trent edwards and start Grossman. Just stick the guy in there against a good D and find out if he's really legit.

[21cents]

who cares if he threw an interception dude? that dink and dunk crap isnt gonna cut it period. We cant have a qb like jason campbell whos gonna take the easy route and check down all the time and hit the easy completions, you will never win doing that. Grossman takes chances and you have to be that way to win games. To me this isnt a competition. The way i see it is if Beck starts then we are playing for luck and if grossman starts then we are actually trying to win this yr. Pitts first string D is way better then Indys D bar none. Its not even comparable to me why so many feel beck looked better 2nite, cuz i beg to differ, but opinions vary, but i will say that grossman looked good 2nite, most of his incompletions were on the money, but were dropped and he wasnt even playing behind the starting offensive line

you dont know much about football do you?
colts run a deep cover 2 defense. They are the best team in league in terms of deep coverage. The longest pass sam bradford had last week was 18 yards. Today beck had a laser to graffney. Hes just fine. Qbs average 5-7 long passes a season. I would much rather have a qb who has laser accuracy because most of the passes are inside 20 yards.

[ConnSKINS26]

I trust that coaches only share the good parts of their evaluations with the public, and that Shanahan's options in the offseason at QB were extremely limited.

A better release? Maybe quicker--but he sidearms the thing. The Giants will get at least 10 batted balls in week 1.

I like his mobility and tempo, but I don't see anything in him that shows me he'll be able to make plays downfield.

At least ten batted balls? Could you be more hyperbolic?

[Hitman21ST]

Beck deserves the shot other recent 2nd rounders have gotten. Either he will turn into Kevin Kolb and start for us, or at least net us a good trade, and if not we can cut our losses on the 2nd coming of Trent edwards and start Grossman. Just stick the guy in there against a good D and find out if he's really legit.

He's already on Kolb's level.

[HateNMyEyez]

colts defense is hot garbage, if all you can do is dink and dunk against them you have issues. Grossman was goin over the middle quite a bit when he came in with the 2nd stringers lol to me your just validating my point. I promise you that if beck starts against the ravens he throws a couple ints. When they load that box up and or blitz you will see.

[OuterBanksTarHeel]

At least ten batted balls? Could you be more hyperbolic?

Isn't that sort of the point when using hyperbole intentionally?

[ConnSKINS26]

He's already on Kolb's level.

To some, this would be a bold statement.

I approve of it. :)

Fitzgerald is going to literally save Kolb's ass all season. Public opinion of Kolb will be drastically different because Fitz is there to bail him out.

[HateNMyEyez]

honestly i just think some of you are just reaching for straws really lol since when do u start a rookie qb at the age of 29 over a guy whos been in the system 3 yrs? grossman lookd great last wk, so beck comes in and throws for 140 yrds and everyone ditches grossman. Beck isnt the answer

[ConnSKINS26]

Isn't that sort of the point when using hyperbole intentionally?

Were you? Good to know. You never can know, with the types we get around here...;)

[War Paint]

Beck deserves the shot other recent 2nd rounders have gotten. Either he will turn into Kevin Kolb and start for us, or at least net us a good trade, and if not we can cut our losses on the 2nd coming of Trent edwards and start Grossman. Just stick the guy in there against a good D and find out if he's really legit.

By looking at tonight's games, Beck looks a lot better than Kolb, but it's still very, very early.

[Hitman21ST]

colts defense is hot garbage, if all you can do is dink and dunk against them you have issues. Grossman was goin over the middle quite a bit when he came in the the 2nd stringers lol to me your just validating my point. I promise you that if beck starts against the ravens he throws a couple ints. When they load that box up and or blitz you will see.

Sam Bradford's long was 18 yards, I guess he's got issues.

:secret: Grossman averaged 7.3 against the second and third stringers, with a long of 25. Beck averaged 8.2 against the starters, with a long of 23. Hardly a validation of your point.

[War Paint]

honestly i just think some of you are just reaching for straws really lol since when do u start a rookie qb at the age of 29 over a guy whos been in the system 3 yrs? grossman lookd great last wk, so beck comes in and throws for 140 yrds and everyone ditches grossman. Beck isnt the answer


You obviously have "Hate in your eyes" in regards to Beck.

[HateNMyEyez]

grossman made the tougher throws against the tougher legitimate defense. keep drinking the kool aid homie. beck had an average start 2nite thats about it

[bigtymeskin2126]

By looking at tonight's games, Beck looks a lot better than Kolb, but it's still very, very early.

Very very early indeed. But I can't wait to see how it all unfolds :)

[HateNMyEyez]

You obviously have "Hate in your eyes" in regards to Beck.

absolutely do. there are reasons why this guy hardly started for an nfl team. Grossman or Beck isnt the answer, but id definately take grossman and the better chance to win then Beck. People jumpin on becks bandwagon simply cuz he had an average game against a lousy defense, in fact i hope beck starts next wknd. all of you will be changing your minds

[HateNMyEyez]

You obviously have "Hate in your eyes" in regards to Beck.

absolutely do. there are reasons why this guy hardly started for an nfl team. Grossman or Beck isnt the answer, but id definately take grossman and the better chance to win then Beck. People jumpin on becks bandwagon simply cuz he had an average game against a lousy defense, in fact i hope beck starts next wknd. all of you will be changing your minds

[Hitman21ST]

grossman made the tougher throws against the tougher legitimate defense. keep drinking the kool aid homie. beck had an average start 2nite thats about it

He averaged a whole yard less than Beck against a weaker defense tonight. Explain that away.

[Reaper 21]

The colts defense vs the pass is strong usually good pass rush and small Plays. They have a bend but don't break defense hints the tough redzone. However they do have a horrible run defense notice the huge runs. Beck did what he was asked.

[HateNMyEyez]

He averaged a whole yard less than Beck against a weaker defense tonight. Explain that away.

thats easy bro, outside of the one bad play he made on the Int, the wrs(hankerson) was droppin passes. otherwise it woulda been higher. I have the game on dvr, i just got finished watchn grossmans drives. Btw he was also playing with 2nd stringers haha

[Hitman21ST]

thats easy bro, outside of the one bad play he made on the Int, the wrs(hankerson) was droppin passes. otherwise it woulda been higher. I have the game on dvr, i just got finished watchn grossmans drives. Btw he was also playing with 2nd stringers haha

Hankerson had one drop. It's not like 85 dropped every pass thrown his way.

[HateNMyEyez]

Hankerson had one drop.

stallworth dropped the first pass grossman threw

[SirClintonPortis]

Beck's dink and dunk approach worked fine tonight, he looked ok, one or two passes tailed off though. He looked mobile, perhaps overly cautious. Start him against the Ravens, let's see if they can take away the dink and dunk and get him to air it out a bit more.

That's what Indy does with their Tampa 2. They snuff out the deep balls and are willing to risk getting burnt underneath because all they have to do is to make sure they cough up less than what their QB can fetch for them.

[Sekhmet187]

absolutely do. there are reasons why this guy hardly started for an nfl team. Grossman or Beck isnt the answer, but id definately take grossman and the better chance to win then Beck. People jumpin on becks bandwagon simply cuz he had an average game against a lousy defense, in fact i hope beck starts next wknd. all of you will be changing your minds

Yeah, I love how you know all the answers simply because you saw Rex get a lucky TD because Moss spun away from a defender against a Steelers team that got chewed out for mailing it in. Regardless of how much more the Colts defense played or didn't play, its just as dumb to claim you think Grossman is so much better for what he did in the first game of preseason as people who are saying Beck is a lot better because of his game against the Colts. They both played well, but I don't see how you can claim Beck is destined to suck just because he couldn't succeed on a Miami team with no oline, no WRs and no coach for a majority of time he was even on the team.

[HateNMyEyez]

guys just stop already about the ignorant tampa 2 crap already, just because thats what defense they run doesnt mean you cant hit intermediate to deep routes. Basically the play calling was so rediculously easy 2nite, most of the qbs in the league woulda had those numbers with the starters

[justice98]

Coming up short in the redzone isnt' always the QB's fault. Whatever happened to running the ball effectively in the redzone?

[HateNMyEyez]

Yeah, I love how you know all the answers simply because you saw Rex get a lucky TD because Moss spun away from a defender against a Steelers team that got chewed out for mailing it in. Regardless of how much more the Colts defense played or didn't play, its just as dumb to claim you think Grossman is so much better for what he did in the first game of preseason as people who are saying Beck is a lot better because of his game against the Colts. They both played well, but I don't see how you can claim Beck is destined to suck just because he couldn't succeed on a Miami team with no oline, no WRs and no coach for a majority of time he was even on the team.
btw i never chose grossman on wat he did in game 1, i chose grossman based on his play last yr as well. He isnt the answer and neither is Beck, but grossman is the better of the 2. but wat grossman did in week 1 is a higher feat then wat beck did against a lousy defense who doesnt have bob sanders anymore. Ill gladly eat crow if beck starts against the ravens and doesnt get raped a new 1

[Hitman21ST]

guys just stop already about the ignorant tampa 2 crap already, just because thats what defense they run doesnt mean you cant hit intermediate to deep routes. Basically the play calling was so rediculously easy 2nite, most of the qbs in the league woulda had those numbers with the starters

Sure, you can hit intermediate to deep routes on it, just like you can hit the hail mary pass at the end of the game against a prevent. Doesn't mean it's the norm. The way you beat the Tampa 2 is by exploiting underneath. Every team does it, yet Beck is horrible because he does it to. You use what the defense gives you, and in this case, the defense gives the underneath.

[iMeast]

We'll see. I thought he was slow to make decisions and didn't get rid of the ball when the pressure was on. Just look at the play where he got horsecollared. A true veteran QB would've gotten rid of that ball and not have taken the sack.

HTTR

[SirClintonPortis]

guys just stop already about the ignorant tampa 2 crap already, just because thats what defense they run doesnt mean you cant hit intermediate to deep routes. Basically the play calling was so rediculously easy 2nite, most of the qbs in the league woulda had those numbers with the starters

Um yeah, except that anyone who watches Colts' regular season games know that teams have an easy time hitting checkdown after checkdown against them. And it's obvious that to you attack the Tampa 2 deep in the area between the safety and cornerback.

[DC_BearsFan]

As a bears fan, yes the tampa 2 is basically DESIGNED to cut off the big plays, keep things in front of you, make the offense sustain long drives. It works because most QBs, rbs, etc cannot do this and the mistakes (fumbles, ints, penalties) eventually bail the defense out. It works but it is an awful system to watch, and i think it is the worst matchup for a player like grossman who is always looking to make big 20+ yard passing plays.

[Sekhmet187]

btw i never chose grossman on wat he did in game 1, i chose grossman based on his play last yr as well. He isnt the answer and neither is Beck, but grossman is the better of the 2. but wat grossman did in week 1 is a higher feat then wat beck did against a lousy defense who doesnt have bob sanders anymore. Ill gladly eat crow if beck starts against the ravens and doesnt get raped a new 1

The Colts have had a decent passing D without Bob Sanders for 3-4 seasons now since he never is on the field anyway. The Steelers didn't have Ike Taylor nor did Troy really play all that long, so its not like their passing D was going to be top notch either.

Regardless, the point is that Grossman has been so far just a plain average QB that tends to make a lot of turnovers. No one here really knows much about Beck or what he can do, but we do know he ran what they asked him to do tonight well enough to think hes capable of something more than just being some god awful turnover machine.

[PortisBetts]

That's what you do against the Colts defense. They play a deep Cover 2, to specifically stop the deep balls. You beat them by throwing underneath. Beck averaged over 8 yards per attempt. That's an awesome average for a QB. Meanwhile, against the same defense, Grossman averaged 7.3 yards per attempt. Against the Steelers, he averaged just under 8 yards per attempt. Beck's doing just fine thank you very much.

this...Beck threw for over 8.2 ypa on 17 attempts. That is explosive. 7.5-8.5 yards per throw is an explosive offense. You cant deny that...Beck was effieicent, accurate, and EXPLOSIVE. San Diego had the highest YPA last season at 7.76http://www.coldhardfootballfacts.com/Articles/2_992_Passing_YPA.html

sorry, but the proof is in the pudding....the question now is this. CAN HE DO THIS CONSISTENTLY We have a top 10 offense if the answer to that question is yes. Evalutation isnt over yet, so lets see what he does next week If this continues, you cant deny the starting job to Beck. 16 first downs in the first half and 16 points as well. He showed well. The competition is in full swing but i do believe that Beck has the edge.

[HateNMyEyez]

We'll see. I thought he was slow to make decisions and didn't get rid of the ball when the pressure was on. Just look at the play where he got horsecollared. A true veteran QB would've gotten rid of that ball and not have taken the sack.

HTTR
i agree with you, and i hope he starts against the ravens defense, they will find some other excuse as well, but when he actually has to face some real pressure hes gonna fold like a lawn chair. Thats always been the knock on him and always will

---------- Post added August-20th-2011 at 01:35 AM ----------

and honestly none of this really matters, Next yr in the draft were gonna take a Qb anyways lol

[Hitman21ST]

i agree with you, and i hope he starts against the ravens defense, they will find some other excuse as well, but when he actually has to face some real pressure hes gonna fold like a lawn chair. Thats always been the knock on him and always will

:wtf:

Since when has that been a knock on him?

[HateNMyEyez]

:wtf:

Since when has that been a knock on him?
that came from nfl analysts, you needa do some research man

---------- Post added August-20th-2011 at 01:38 AM ----------

anyways goodnite all, thanx for the debate lol remember opinions vary, i dont think ill eat crow but maybe i will, but im far from sold

[SpacePenguin]

and honestly none of this really matters, Next yr in the draft were gonna take a Qb anyways lol

You should start another Suck for Luck thread. There's just not enough defeatism on this board.

[Sekhmet187]

i agree with you, and i hope he starts against the ravens defense, they will find some other excuse as well, but when he actually has to face some real pressure hes gonna fold like a lawn chair. Thats always been the knock on him and always will

---------- Post added August-20th-2011 at 01:35 AM ----------

and honestly none of this really matters, Next yr in the draft were gonna take a Qb anyways lol

You don't know how well he'll do anymore than any other person in this thread. Beck could play terrible or he could play just as well and torch their D. The reason people may prefer Beck is so far theres nothing in his resume that says one day he might have a 9-24, 150 yard 4 INT game like Grossman can, and while we don't know if Beck is going to be great, we already know Grossman has games where hes terrible. Looking for a more consistent QB isn't a bad thing considering theres no guarantee about next year either.

Hell if Beck turns out to be a good answer at QB, they wouldn't even need to draft a QB and would save a high round pick next year. We don't know yet and the Redskins have a full season to evaluate the new pieces they have had in their system a year now.

---------- Post added August-20th-2011 at 01:42 AM ----------


that came from nfl analysts, you needa do some research man

---------- Post added August-20th-2011 at 01:38 AM ----------

anyways goodnite all, thanx for the debate lol remember opinions vary, i dont think ill eat crow but maybe i will, but im far from sold

Theres never been a knock on Beck that he chokes. Never. He hasn't even played enough to be CALLED a choker. I think you're getting him mixed up with Grossman, who is know across the league as a guy who chokes in the 4th and when the game is on the line. Which is precisely the reason the Redskins are hoping Beck steps up and takes the job from Grossman in case Grossman hasn't grown as a QB.

[PortisBetts]

As a bears fan, yes the tampa 2 is basically DESIGNED to cut off the big plays, keep things in front of you, make the offense sustain long drives. It works because most QBs, rbs, etc cannot do this and the mistakes (fumbles, ints, penalties) eventually bail the defense out. It works but it is an awful system to watch, and i think it is the worst matchup for a player like grossman who is always looking to make big 20+ yard passing plays.

i agree with you assessment of grossman here, but here in lies a problem. If the cover 2 is dictating you to throw short and drive long, you take it. You dont force plays. This is where i feel there is failure in grossman in that he cant adopt his game. If the deeper throws arent there, he has a hard time checking down. I would rather have the 15 play 7:30 minute field goal drive then a 3 and out with nothin because he tried to go deep. He fails to adopt his game. Beck picks his shots better i feel like. He put up 16 in a half, and although it was against the colts who never play preseason, he still put up more then grossman against a first team d. Again, it is preseason and the competition isnt over, but i feel Beck showed tonight why he should be considered above grossman. I feel he showed his ceiling is much higher in our offense.

[SirClintonPortis]

that came from nfl analysts, you needa do some research man

---------- Post added August-20th-2011 at 01:38 AM ----------

anyways goodnite all, thanx for the debate lol remember opinions vary, i dont think ill eat crow but maybe i will, but im far from sold

If you mean the same analysts who say he had a weak arm but actually clocked 61.1 mph at the combine....

[SpacePenguin]

The funny thing is, if Beck would have forced something downfield to satisfy these clowns, and thrown an int, they'd be flying off the handle, crowning the sex machine as the winner of the QB comp after 2 preseason games..

For the record I think Rex is winning at this point, but not by much.

[Hitman21ST]

that came from nfl analysts, you needa do some research man

http://www.thephinsider.com/2007/5/2/0358/03650


Very intelligent player who has no problem executing a complicated game plan ... Student of the game who breaks down opposing film and does a good job of making adjustments on the field ... Plays through pain and shows very good poise in the pocket and confidence in his protection, as it is rare to see him bolt too early, as he will stand tall and take some shots under pressure ... Has good throwing mechanics and sets his feet with agility and solid base ... Even with just average timed speed, his feet appear light when forced to move out of the pocket ... In 2006, he received much better pocket protection, allowing him to take his time making reads to locate secondary targets ... Displays awareness to anticipate when the receiver is coming out of the breaks ... With his three-quarters delivery and natural hands, Beck is very effective at getting the ball out quickly ... Shows very good arm whip to get the ball out in time to hit the receivers coming out of their breaks ... In the short-to-intermediate area, Beck's tosses show good zip and velocity.

http://www.fftoolbox.com/nfl_draft/profile_display.cfm?prospect_id=1146


John Beck looks to be a top 10 QB, perhaps going as early as the third round, but more realistically probably fourth or even fifth round. His age (at 25) is a concern, as well as being a product of the BYU system that typically plays weaker teams. His arm strength is average, but his strengths include his accuracy and great decision-making ability, thus avoiding turnovers. He also has a pretty quick release and a good presence in the pocket. His height is average for a QB, but is shorter than the premier QBs in this year's draft (Quinn is 6'4 and Russell is 6'6).

http://walkingdeadmanblog.blogspot.com/2011/08/so-you-want-to-know-more-about-that.html


Negatives: ..he is no threat running with the ball … Has good arm strength for the short-to-intermediate area, but realizes that he lacks the raw power to air the ball out consistently, keeping the game plan within his athletic talents … Lacks ideal height and valid speed, but makes up for it with good short-area avoid skills and a quick release to unleash the ball on time … Will sometimes revert to locking on to his primary target, resulting in him throwing into double coverage... will show a bit of a wind-up when he releases the ball over the top rather than his normal, three-quarters delivery … When he attempts to air it out, the ball tends to float and fall off, causing the receivers to break off their routes … Needs to do a better job of dropping the deep ball in over the outside shoulder of the receiver, as the ball floats too much on fade and long throws (deep passes will come off his hands too high, as it floats and lofts) …

http://insider.espn.go.com/nfl/player/scouting/_/id/10484/john-beck



Comment: Beck has adequate size and athleticism with solid arm strength. He has good release quickness and shows effective accuracy when he has time to set his feet. Beck isn't great to create out of the pocket, but can elude and deliver the ball to make plays downfield. He is a smart player who shows good vision downfield to take what the defense gives him. He doesn't have the power to fit the ball into tight windows but has enough arm strength to make all the throws with effective weight transfer and timing. Beck is a high-character person with great work ethic, toughness and intelligence


Where's the part about him folding under pressure?

[SirClintonPortis]

The funny thing is, if Beck would have forced something downfield to satisfy these clowns, and thrown an int, they'd be flying off the handle, crowning the sex machine as the winner.

For the record I think Rex is winning, but not by much.

Indeed, it's funny that he's being criticized for simply finding and getting the ball to an open man.

[isaacis881]

The Beck haters should show themselves.

Right here. If he does get the start it won't be for more than a few weeks. The guy isn't a pro football QB. Don't get me wrong I want the Redskins to win so bad I wouldn't care if Pee Wee Herman lead us to a SB.... And maybe he will, Pee Wee that is. Beck won't and couldn't.

[Sekhmet187]

Right here. If he does get the start it won't be for more than a few weeks. The guy isn't a pro football QB. Don't get me wrong I want the Redskins to win so bad I wouldn't care if Pee Wee Herman lead us to a SB.... And maybe he will, Pee Wee that is. Beck won't and couldn't.

Why do you assume this? I mean the likelihood hes another Kurt Warner, Tom Brady, Aaron Rodgers etc. is rather slim, but its possible, just like it was possible that a 6th round pick replaced a pro-bowler and went on to completely erase that pro-bowlers name and instead go on to a HoF career himself. Just because something is unlikely doesn't mean you should be positive it can't happen.

[isaacis881]

Why do you assume this? I mean the likelihood hes another Kurt Warner, Tom Brady, Aaron Rodgers etc. is rather slim, but its possible, just like it was possible that a 6th round pick replaced a pro-bowler and went on to completely erase that pro-bowlers name and instead go on to a HoF career himself. Just because something is unlikely doesn't mean you should be positive it can't happen.

Well I guess I could ask you the same question regarding Rex Grossman. Who by the way has actually played in a Superbowl. John Beck hasn't done a single thing in the NFL and he's 30yrs old. I honestly and I hate saying it, think we would have a better shot with Mark Brunell than John Beck. -The right now Mark Brunell, back up for the jets... You hopes are too high and math by your own accord doesn't make sense. Shot in the dark. HTTR

[Sekhmet187]

Well I guess I could ask you the same question regarding Rex Grossman. Who by the way has actually played in a Superbowl. John Beck hasn't done a single thing in the NFL and he's 30yrs old. I honestly and I hate saying it, think we would have a better shot with Mark Brunell than John Beck. -The right now Mark Brunell, back up for the jets... You hopes are too high and math by your own accord doesn't make sense. Shot in the dark. HTTR

Because Rex Grossman has cost his team games time after time and failed after having several long chances at being starting QB. John Beck has only had 4 games on a dysfunctional Miami team. Not saying it means much, but you have to give the guy a shot before you denounce the guy. Saying he could be good is no less crazy than saying Beck will suck hard just because he hasn't played a lot yet. Besides, we don't know if Beck is even the same QB he was when he was drafted. He may have used his failure as fuel to get better. It irritates me to know end to hear sports fans always talk as if they can see the future.

[thesubmittedone]

I would just like to be the higher than though smart ass here and add that there's no need to put one QB down if you'd rather the other lead this team. :)

Seriously, guys, I never understand why we get into this awful habit of having to put down the other QB in an attempt to justify going with the one we like. Both guys have looked good thus far, it's that simple. Both have been accurate. Beck has better mobility moving in the pocket and on bootlegs, as well as better velocity on his throws. Grossman has better timing, probably due to a better grasp of this offense, and throws a more catchable ball. Thus far, we've seen Grossman throw a fairly accurate deep ball and he has some nice touch on everything he throws, whereas Beck threw almost strictly fast balls, though that could've simply been the game plan there. Either that or he took what the Defense gave him, which isn't a bad thing because it worked and worked well.

I think being excessively negative or pointing out Grossman's INT as an indictment of everything else he's done is really narrow-minded. They've both done well overall... putting it any other way is disrespectful. Why anyone would want a guy donning the burgundy and gold to fail is beyond me. Root for both guys, fellas. :)

The basic fact everyone needs to remind themselves about over and over is that both guys moved the offense well. There is no way around that. The only question is who will be more consistent doing it?

[SpacePenguin]

This thread should be renamed, "John Beck makes it hard on trolls".

Baseless comparisons to Peewee Herman, then current day Mark Brunell? Are you even trying?

Maybe he'll throw an int next week and you anti Beck posters can have something remotely worth complaining about.

[Newera]

I actually watched the game again, and Beck actually played pretty well all things considered. Definitely exceeded expectations.

[Rypien1191]

I don't have a horse in the beck rex race, but I honestly do not believe a decision will be made until after the 4th preseason game.

[Bibby]

Missed the game, but hyped to hear that Beck was looking good.

[MartinC]

Rypien was more a gentle giant than a dork. Williams was antisocial. So was Schroeder. Brunell was a turd. Campbell was pretty cool. Beck is a dork.

Mark Brunell was a turd? I thought he was a class act personally.

On the game impressed by Becks accuracy and decision making. He showed some zip on his balland also a nice pocket awareness. He is going to have to show he can stretch the field but against a Colts Cover 2 he took what was there and did spread the ball to receivers and Fred Davis - it was not just check downs.

I think Beck starts next week and will get a tougher test.

I hope we spend a lot of time this week working on the redzone offense, we are kicking too many field goals.

---------- Post added August-20th-2011 at 03:39 AM ----------


guys just stop already about the ignorant tampa 2 crap already, just because thats what defense they run doesnt mean you cant hit intermediate to deep routes. Basically the play calling was so rediculously easy 2nite, most of the qbs in the league woulda had those numbers with the starters

He DID hit intermediate throws last night. I recall a deep cross to Moss and seam route to Davis off a roll out and a really nice throw on a slant I think to Gaffney. There will be tougher tests ahead but to carp about how he played last night is silly.

[Califan007]

this...Beck threw for over 8.2 ypa on 17 attempts. That is explosive. 7.5-8.5 yards per throw is an explosive offense. You cant deny that...Beck was effieicent, accurate, and EXPLOSIVE.

8.2 ypa is NOT "explosive" when your QB his completing 82% of his passes. If your QB is hitting that high a percentage of passes, his ypa should be above 10 ypa. 8.2 yards per attempt is good when your QB his completing 62% of his throws...not 82%.

And it's hard to call an offense "explosive" when the QB isn't throwing any TDs anyway.

---------- Post added August-20th-2011 at 05:44 AM ----------


guys just stop already about the ignorant tampa 2 crap already, just because thats what defense they run doesnt mean you cant hit intermediate to deep routes. Basically the play calling was so rediculously easy 2nite, most of the qbs in the league woulda had those numbers with the starters

You apparently have zero ability to analyze football. Making the claim that throws were "easy" and that anyone could complete them is the first sign of someone who puts little more than a thimble's worth of analysis into their thoughts and conclusions.

Re-watch McNabb from last year and see how many of those "easy" throws he misfired on.

[Rdskn4Lyf21]

It's so nice to have two QBs that I'm excited about.

[TheRookie]

and honestly none of this really matters, Next yr in the draft were gonna take a Qb anyways lol

It does matter if:..
1. you would like a little relief from the constant to pressure and media harping over our lack of a "franchise QB"
2. you would like a little time to develop that QB and not be forced to throw them out there year one
3. you realize that drafting a QB doesn't automatically mean he is the answer either -- sometimes they just don't pan out
4. you want us to have the best chance to win -- short term and long term

[ouvan59]

stallworth dropped the first pass grossman threw

Mrs. Grossman, you really need to stop. That pass to Stallworth barely hit his finger tips. You are doing the worst impression of a borderline retard I've ever seen.

[HateNMyEyez]

lol you guys should just get over yourself, its funny you claim i made the decision on rex in 2 preseason games which i did not ,but you guys are ready to make a decision on beck after 1 half of a game against a cruddy defense. You all can call me out all you guys want, but if he starts against the ravens you will see exactly wat im talking about. Beck has to throw somethin more then rb screens and quick slants. He needs to try more intermediate passes and deep passes to see where this kid really is with his progression. Im not a beck fan period, but as i said people have there own opinions. Beck will get knocked around and make bad decisions once teams like the ravens stack the box and force him to throw somethin deeper.

[illone]

Without knowing what exactly the coaches are looking at to make their final decision, wouldn't that make it tough to say Beck is making it easy on the Shanahans?

Let's see the entire of pre-season before we annoint this guy. The Colts run D is horrid, I mean the Skins ran all over them in the regular season last year too so I don't gleen much from this game other than Beck did what he was supposed to do. In the regular season against a DCoordinator who is game planning I think Beck will struggle a la Pennington and other guys like him who can't throw it down the field.

Grossman's edge is that he is able to spread the defense out a little bit more and create passing lanes where Beck has only showed he can throw swing passes and roll outs. Makes Beck a little easier to defend I'd think. Stack the run and shorter routes, done. If he continues to play this way and the Shannys DO start him, it's going to be a long year with Andrew Luck at the end of the rainbow.

[jsbaugh]

lol you guys should just get over yourself, its funny you claim i made the decision on rex in 2 preseason games which i did not ,but you guys are ready to make a decision on beck after 1 half of a game against a cruddy defense. You all can call me out all you guys want, but if he starts against the ravens you will see exactly wat im talking about. Beck has to throw somethin more then rb screens and quick slants. He needs to try more intermediate passes and deep passes to see where this kid really is with his progression. Im not a beck fan period, but as i said people have there own opinions. Beck will get knocked around and make bad decisions once teams like the ravens stack the box and force him to throw somethin deeper.

Go look at the stats from last night. Stallworth for 23yarder, Gaffney for a 19. These arent dink and dunk. The one to Gaffney at the 1 should have been a TD if Gaffney would have stretched a foot. He had a few nice 3rd down conversions to keep drives alive. Whats not to like? Just because he didnt try to force a bomb down the field, he cant play?
Saw far the Ravens have looked like Sh*t so not sure they are a great measuring stick.

[monkeezgob]

It's only one game, but the way he way used last night, it looks like Beck will deployed more as a game management style QB.

Looks like we have a strong ground attack, he just has to play smart, make the dinks and dunks and not turn the ball over.

Based on the evidence of last night, it looks like that's a role he can perform. His mobility is v good and the system is designed to make the most of that.

Difficult to read too much into two pre-season games, but it seems like the defense is really going to have to make a step up this year in performance if our offensive strategy is run, dink and dunk and put up 13-16 points a game.

[illone]

Saw far the Ravens have looked like Sh*t so not sure they are a great measuring stick.

Their defense is a much better measuring stick than the Colts porous D, no?

[Lavarleap56]

Beck was ok last night but Grossman is still the lead dog in the race.

[Blue Collar Skins]

This post made me laugh.

He played well. But watta nerd. Did anyone see him in the interview?

(Its ok he can be who he is and I don't judge) Maybe I am too big of a nerd to see his nerdiness but I just don't see that. I see a man who's excited to be playing. Then again, maybe I am just not digging deep enough. :)

---------- Post added August-20th-2011 at 09:41 AM ----------


Beck was ok last night but Grossman is still the lead dog in the race. And LL56 weighed in! Thanks LL56! Always appreciate you giving insight.

[MartinC]

Beck was ok last night but Grossman is still the lead dog in the race.

Is the thinking then that Grossman gets the start against the Ravens?

[Thirtyfive2seven]

typically the 3rd pre season game is where the starters play a full half and they some what game plan. It's the most important game in pre season so I think it should be a decent test all around.

[Wyvern]

I'm quite pleased for the performance of both of our quarterbacks. Beck executed well on what he was asked to do tonight. It had to be a pressure-packed moment for him., and he did fairly well to keep things close in the QB competition. I also think he's performed well enough to make his teammates and coaches feel that he can run the offense well enough to justify more opportunities.

Grossman set a high benchmark last week against the Steelers -- and with 2nd teamers vs. a lot of Indy's first team D, Rex still showed me a lot. He's an emotional leader, and very confident in his arm -- that's going to bring you good moments and bad ones. I think he's still a strong contender for starting QB, simply because he's got a better deep pass than what Beck has shown, so far. On the other hand, Beck is showing that he's willing to play within the system, to be extremely patient, and delivery all the quick dinks and dunks that Kyle dialed up; he's a coaches QB. It's a good competition.

I also suspect Beck was asked not to try throwing deep, mainly from considerations of his recent groin injury. Beck probably uses his lower body to generate power on his long throws, and maybe the groin strain is still a factor. But by doing what he was asked and dialing his passes down to short/intermediate range, Beck really did help the team continue to evaluate, to run more routes, and show how well they can catch the easy ones and run after the catch. By effectively attacking the inside short/medium zones of the defense, It opened lanes for the running game on the outside. That allowed the coaches more opportunities to see how well Helu and others might handle their duties. What's not to like from our two preseason sessions of vanilla offense?

Bottom line is that BOTH QBs are showing good accuracy and timing -- getting the ball out quickly, decent ball-handling, executing the planned rollouts well, and finding the open receiver in a crowd. Turnovers have been minimized. The team is converting third downs, and sustaining long drives -- giving Redskins offensive players more gametime practice, and allowing the coaches to more opportunity to evaluate the team. The team moves crisply, and overall is playing like a solid unit -- and seems to be 'gelling' effectively and early in this preseason.

That's a lot of positives for me - I'm not going to let some smarmy columnist put his own negative spin on what was an enjoyable night of preseason football. It's still early, but so far the Skins are having a decent and effective preseason.

[BuryYourDuke]

I thought Beck looked good, but it seems that Grossman is more willing to attack down field. Beck froze a few times and just checked down. Typical Grossman risk/reward factor I suppose.

[SkinsCrushCowboys]

I was impressed with Beck. His ball had some zip on it (the pass ti Gaffney on the.goal line)and, yes, he checked down several times, but when he did he made the pass for nice yardage. (as opposed to one hopping the ball or forcing an int).

I did not know he was as mobile as he showed last night.

Both QBs struggled in the red zone. Overall, I though he did a nice job managing the game.

[ouvan59]

lol you guys should just get over yourself, its funny you claim i made the decision on rex in 2 preseason games which i did not ,but you guys are ready to make a decision on beck after 1 half of a game against a cruddy defense. You all can call me out all you guys want, but if he starts against the ravens you will see exactly wat im talking about. Beck has to throw somethin more then rb screens and quick slants. He needs to try more intermediate passes and deep passes to see where this kid really is with his progression. Im not a beck fan period, but as i said people have there own opinions. Beck will get knocked around and make bad decisions once teams like the ravens stack the box and force him to throw somethin deeper.

I haven't made any decisions. As for throwing deeper passes, yes he'll need to do that if the defense takes away the shorter routes. But let's go over the results last night. No punts. No turnovers. Points on every drive. Three incompletions, the first of which should have been a touchdown if Mike Sellers isn't tripped. the second deflected at the line and the third an intentional throwaway at the fullback's feet. So essentially that's one pass that didn't find it's target. You can downplay the results all you want but the defense gave the Skins the underneath routes and Beck took advantage of it. And chew on this, his 8.2 ypa would have tied him for 2nd in the entire NFL last year. Other positives, he's got a really quick release. He's got very quick feet. He's got good straight line speed. He appears to be accurate on the move. That latter comment may have been just a factor that it was a good night for him since we just haven't seen enough of him however.

A long way to go before we anoint Beck as anything but last night was encouraging. You have to be completely blind or in denial to not find the outing encouraging. And what happens if he does well against the Big Bad Ravens D? We already know the answer. It doesn't matter because it's preseason.

[DieselPwr44]

http://ravensblackout.files.wordpress.com/2011/08/0_21_parcells_bill1.jpg

"I think you guys need to put away the annointing oil on Beck for right now..."

[tml6157]

:wtf:

Since when has that been a knock on him?

Dude don't even try. He keeps making crap up and ignoring actual facts and game plans. I'm neither a Beck supporter or hater I want whomever Mike says is going to start.

[truskinsfan18]

This is one of the tightest QB competitions I've seen in a long time.

[Newera]

lol you guys should just get over yourself, its funny you claim i made the decision on rex in 2 preseason games which i did not ,but you guys are ready to make a decision on beck after 1 half of a game against a cruddy defense. You all can call me out all you guys want, but if he starts against the ravens you will see exactly wat im talking about. Beck has to throw somethin more then rb screens and quick slants. He needs to try more intermediate passes and deep passes to see where this kid really is with his progression. Im not a beck fan period, but as i said people have there own opinions. Beck will get knocked around and make bad decisions once teams like the ravens stack the box and force him to throw somethin deeper.

The offense is really predicated on the short passing game. Always has been. Once teams realize we are adept at it . . . which won't take long. He will be able to exploit with YAC type of plays. Our running game is going to keep teams honest. We now have guys that can hit it and go. It will be dangerous for teams to play us nine in the box.

Plus, Beck will get better and better at running this offense. He will become a student of the offense. He just seems to be that type of guy. You also can't discount his mobility. I predict in two years, both Beck and McCoy will be star West Coast Offense quarterbacks.

[darrelgreenie]

I would just like to be the higher than though smart ass here and add that there's no need to put one QB down if you'd rather the other lead this team.
NO WAY.
We like who we like for whatever our reason and everyone else sucks!

;)

[Lavarleap56]

The offense is really predicated on the short passing game. Always has been. Once teams realize we are adept at it . . . which won't take long. He will be able to exploit with YAC type of plays. Our running game is going to keep teams honest. We now have guys that can hit it and go. It will be dangerous for teams to play us nine in the box.

Plus, Beck will get better and better at running this offense. He will become a student of the offense. He just seems to be that type of guy. You also can't discount his mobility. I predict in two years, both Beck and McCoy will be star West Coast Offense quarterbacks.

In two years a qb will be starting that is not on the current roster.

[ashlynskins]

I don't see it being an open and shut case that Beck is the starter just yet imho......I like both of them equally and think that both could be a decent starter for us......still 2 weeks to go.....time will tell though.

[colkilla]

did parcells draft beck? i though he was there when beck got drafted but i am not sure? he fits the parcells mold for drafting a qb i believe but who knows...

[Pedro]

In two years a qb will be starting that is not on the current roster.

We look like we are in the right position roster wise (depth and youth, who'd have thought it lol) to be able to move up, if required. I'm assuming we want a QB that can consistently win us big games against talented teams? I'm also assuming we'll be drafting rather than trading for that QB?

[War Paint]

did parcells draft beck? i though he was there when beck got drafted but i am not sure? he fits the parcells mold for drafting a qb i believe but who knows...

I don't think so. I think Parcells is the one who came in a shipped him off.

[Sekhmet187]

did parcells draft beck? i though he was there when beck got drafted but i am not sure? he fits the parcells mold for drafting a qb i believe but who knows...

Parcells drafted Henne in the 2nd round, which eventually pushed out Beck.

[Skinsinparadise]

Just found this blog from Chris Russell, 980's Beat Reporter who actually used to think until recently that it would be Grossman's job

http://redskins.espn980.com/bloggers/chris-russell/item/125-becks-closing-in

John Beck should win the starting job for the Washington Redskins at Quarterback, and be under center on September 11. He might not be the 'chosen one,' but by sheer determination, and because of his outstanding mobility -- he might just be the 'preferred one.'
Publicly, the Redskins quarterback competition is a true battle. Inside, it is obvious that the preference of Mike Shanahan and probably Kyle Shanahan is John Beck.

Two games in to the 2011 pre-season, and nothing has been decided purely by on-field performance. That's a problem for Grossman however. Rex needed to make it clear that he was the better of the two, and so far he hasn't. I believed that Rex would win the job based on his extra experience in the scheme, and his game action at the end of last year. I still think he has a shot, but with each passing day; it's apparent that as long as Beck doesn't look woeful on Thursday night in Baltimore, it is his job to start and perhaps lose. That's not to say Grossman has been bad, or done anything terribly wrong. It's just that he hasn't done enough (in the right category) to edge out the 'preferred one.'

Grossman played much more in the 2nd half on Friday night in Indianapolis, then we were led to believe. In talking to sources, and based on what Mike Shanahan said last week -- the plan was to play Grossman in a very limited role, if at all. So what changed? Did Beck's good 1st half performance; change the game plan? Did the Shanahan's feel they needed to see what Rex could do working with the 2nd team offensive line? Grossman was (7-12) for 88 yards, he was sacked once and intercepted once. Before Grossman was sacked on 3rd down for a five-yard loss on his 2nd series of work, Leonard Hankerson dropped a beautiful pass that would have gone for at least a 20-yard gain and perhaps more. If Hankerson catches the pass, perhaps the Redskins score on that drive, instead of coming away empty and Grossman could at least say -- he led a scoring drive with backups and rookies.

Instead, Grossman came away with basically nothing, except for a bad interception and as Mike Shanahan said on Friday night; "He'd like to have that pick back." Again, Rex did not separate himself. Nor has he in practice. Neither has Beck for that matter, but of course he basically gave away the week advantage he had over Rex, because of the untimely groin injury. During practices that the media was allowed to see, we have seen 'good Rex' and 'bad Rex,' and a healthy dose of both. Starting today, we are no longer allowed to see anything meaningful in team situations, so the evaluation process from our perspective; can only come from the games.

I expect, and I think most people expect -- Beck to start against a defense that he is more familiar with then Grossman, because of Beck's time with the Ravens. As long as Beck does a serviceable to good job in what likely would be a two-and-a-half or three quarter final audition -- that should lock up the week 1 start.

His mobility advantage over Rex, is a clear separating element and Grossman might just have to tip his cap to him, and swallow his pride. Rex has experience in the system and in games, that Beck does not. However, Beck has more athleticism and that might count more then any other factor. I still think that the Redskins would be better off with Grossman to start the year against the Giants, with a short leash. However, my opinion doesn't really matter, and with the competition on the field as of this point, being virtually even -- you would probably be safe to say that if all things remain equal, Beck will get the nod. That's fine, I believe both will play a significant role at some point or another over 16 games -- but it seems like the 'preferred one' is getting closer and closer to fulfilling his destiny.

[Thiebear]

Doesn't seem like anyone's mind is made up after 2 preseason games.
I liked both games first team on first team, thats all i go by, either is fine for now, the mechanics are good for when we actually play all 60.

[illone]

One thing that is awesome about this competition: its a REAL competition.

When is the last time we had a real one in Washington? Brunell/Ramsey was fake, Gibbs was starting brunell the whole way. Campbell/Brunell? Campbell was handed the job due to draft status... Campbell/Collins? Had Gibbs returned it may have been one.

To me this is the first real competition in the past decade.

[haider61]

I believe both Shanahans believe that Grossman gives the team the best shot to win for the first few games by a very slight edge due to the experience he has in the system. However, I also believe they see something in Beck that others cannot see in from the plain eye. Most naysayers will say that Beck was Mr. Checkdown, and throw out all the stats that will preclude people to conclude Grossman was better than Beck. Yet people did not realize that the Colts ran a strict tampa 2 cover scheme. This was predicated on ONLY 4 rushing linemen and everyone else dropping back into coverage. Beck dictated the offense through what the defense gave him.

With Grossman you know what you will get, however Beck has plenty of potential to be BETTER

[HailGreen28]

I believe both Shanahans believe that Grossman gives the team the best shot to win for the first few games by a very slight edge due to the experience he has in the system. However, I also believe they see something in Beck that others cannot see in from the plain eye. Most naysayers will say that Beck was Mr. Checkdown, and throw out all the stats that will preclude people to conclude Grossman was better than Beck. Yet people did not realize that the Colts ran a strict tampa 2 cover scheme. This was predicated on ONLY 4 rushing linemen and everyone else dropping back into coverage. Beck dictated the offense through what the defense gave him.

With Grossman you know what you will get, however Beck has plenty of potential to be BETTERHow can you say that, when Beck's 30+ years old?

[War Paint]

How can you say that, when Beck's 30+ years old?

Beck just turned 30 today. He's not over 30.

[Sekhmet187]

How can you say that, when Beck's 30+ years old?

Why add the plus when he just turned 30 today?

[War Paint]

Another reason I think Beck might get the nod is Rex signed a one year contract with us. Let's say if Rex does start and has a good season with us, he will probably want to paid like a probowl QB. He was already holding out for starter money a few weeks ago. Do we trust Rex to be a long term solution if he has a decent year and sign him to a big contract? With Beck, although he is only one year younger than Rex, may fit more of a long term solution, kind of like Romo with Dallas.

[Sekhmet187]

Well, they may also want a guy to play reliably who can eventually be a solid backup if they plan on trying to groom a guy in the draft (if you buy the idea that the future starter isn't on the roster yet). Either way, I think people need to wait and see how the guys do in the season first before they think that one or the other will suck or succeed.

[Hail26]

Those red zone points will come once we get HankTime running routes in the end zone.

AGREED....if Hank and the coaches can get him comfortable down there.....BOOM!

[ConnSKINS26]

AGREED....if Hank and the coaches can get him comfortable down there.....BOOM!

You'll also notice that we aren't targeting Fred Davis in the Redzone much at all. I think we're saving that bad boy for the season and working on less reliable things right now.

[terrifNick21]

Why add the plus when he just turned 30 today?

Because he's 30 years + 16 hours old. :silly:

[HailGreen28]

Beck just turned 30 today. He's not over 30.

Why add the plus when he just turned 30 today?Saw another poster claim he was 31. Checked now and he indeed just turned 30. This still does not speak well for any "upside".

Why claim Beck somehow has tremendous upside, when he's 30 and in his 5th year in the league?

edit:

Because he's 30 years + 16 hours old. :silly:Ummm, yeah! That's the ticket! :silly:

[War Paint]

Saw another poster claim he was 31. Checked now and he indeed just turned 30. This still does not speak well for any "upside".

Why claim Beck somehow has tremendous upside, when he's 30 and in his 5th year in the league?

edit:
Ummm, yeah! That's the ticket! :silly:

Well, there is some upside if Beck turns out to be a good QB. If that is the case, he can be our guy for the next 5-6 years. That's a good chunk of time.

[HailGreen28]

Well, there is some upside if Beck turns out to be a good QB. If that is the case, he can be our guy for the next 5-6 years. That's a good chunk of time.You could say the same about Grossman, though. Only about 1 year's difference. With Grossman having the better arm.

[War Paint]

You could say the same about Grossman, though. Only about 1 year's difference. With Grossman having the better arm.

True, however, I think the jury is still out on who has the better arm. I think I read somewhere here that Beck had a strong arm at the combine, throwing with great velocity. I would like to see Beck go deep during the game, but re-watching the game, it doesn't look like going deep was part of the play calling. I would've liked it though, even if it was a deep ball that sailed out of bounds, just to get an idea of whats up.

[HailGreen28]

True, however, I think the jury is still out on who has the better arm. I think I read somewhere here that Beck had a strong arm at the combine, throwing with great velocity. I would like to see Beck go deep during the game, but re-watching the game, it doesn't look like going deep was part of the play calling. I would've liked it though, even if it was a deep ball that sailed out of bounds, just to get an idea of whats up.Yeah, I think like another poster said, the Colt's 1st D simply wasn't giving up anything but short. I really think Beck just hasn't shown if he has one or not, we'll see.

[MONTEY]

grossman or beck... it doesnt matter if we cant score TDs.

last week, i think we were in the red zone 5 times and scored only 1 TD. not sure how many times in the red zone tonight 6 times? but again., scored only 1 TD

i recall jason campbell being able to move the ball but failed miserably in the red zone always settling for FGs and fans gettting pissed. not sure why we arent pissed now. oh cause defense is actually playing well and keep opponents way below the league avg.

Im not pissed. Be pissed if we settle for field goals again this season like last. Defense will tire itself out as usual if nothing changes in offensive inconsistencies. Skins average 24 points a game we'll win them all. This team will not win with the 3 point mentality. And why not work this crap out come Thursday against the Ravens who's goal is to take absolute delight in beating the fart out of our Skins?

[paloosa]

Stop labeling Beck as the starter. He played well but he did not seperate himself as being better than Grossman. At least I know what Grossman can do and I rather go with him unless Beck plays lights out in the next two preseason games. If Beck is the starter in week 1 then so be it. He just needs to play well enough to give us a chance to win without making mistakes.