Is this defense still lacking a true NT?

[SkinsHokieFan]

One of the dissapointments from Monday night was the Cowboys ability to run the ball. 4.8 YPC (yes they were skewed by big runs, but those count) along with only 1 tackle for loss by our defense.

Arizona was also able to run the ball well in the 2nd half with Beanie Wells.

Is Coefield the right clog in the middle? Or should there be consideration this offseason to make a move at NT, and have Cofield and Bowen play end?

[TD_washingtonredskins]

I'm not sure to be honest. I would guess that our DL isn't the issue though. On 2 runs that added up to 65 yards, we had linebackers with clean shots at the running back and just miss. Rocky missed Jones on the 25+ yard run up the middle. It would have been about a 3 yard gain. Jackson missed Jones on the run to the left right at the line of scrimmage. To me, that doesn't seem to be a problem with the DL. As for Arizona, I remember them having the most success when they spread us out and ran out of the shotgun. Again, not really indicative of bad OL play unless I'm missing something.

Having said all of that, I don't know if Coefield is the right man for the job or not. Overall, we seem to have a good mix of talent and can expect a slight improvement next year when Jenkins is healthy enough to start again.

[skinsdomination09]

Jarvis Jenkins was expected to play a large part but with him out we are left a little shorthanded.

I think Cofield will need time to adjust. He is solid.

We will continue to build defensive depth but to imagine us going from last years run defense to VERY solid is nearly impossible lol

[Brotherz]

Honestly, I have to say yes. It is common knowledge that you CANNOT build a trulyy effective 3-4 without the nose tackle. The prototypical nose tackle is Vince Wilfork and/or Casey Hampton. (I know, I know - Ratliff is a nose tackle in a relatively effective 3-4 but in my opinion, that isn't typical).

I love the Cofield signing. I think he is great. Great attitude, great leader, great motor. During the monday night telecast Gruden pointed out how we are building a Pittsburgh 3-4 defense and compared Rak and Kerrigan to Woodley and Harrison (a bit of a stretch at this point but maybe someday), Landy and Polamalu (fair) and then they compared Cofield to Hampton. Wrong. He's not that guy. I know he is on the wrong side of his 20's but I think signing Abreyo Franklin in addition to Cofield would have been great. I think on third downs etc, Cofield has the speed and quickness to penetrate and add pressure but as a protypical 3-4 he just isn't enough of a fire hydrant. He doesn't eat enough space. He doesn't really demand double teams consistently either. I love the guy but I agree with your premise here. I think we are still in need of a prototypical 3-4 nose.

[Bigmuss1]

Running game problem wasn't with D-Line, our LB's and safeties missed tackles.

[TerpSkin]

I know he is on the wrong side of his 20's but I think signing Abreyo Franklin in addition to Cofield would have been great.

Whoa... how young do you want us to get? j/k

[HailToTheRedskins14]

I'd take Phil Taylor in a heartbeat.

Like Cofield but unless he improves he isn't the guy. Should be a solid/good depth guy for the longterm though, nothing wrong with that.

I can see us looking strongly at NT in the first round.

[HailGreen28]

What if we could start Jarvis Jenkins (let's get him to a faith healer lol) or some other big boy at NT? Could Cofield play well at DE?

[SkinsHokieFan]

What if we could start Jarvis Jenkins (let's get him to a faith healer lol) or some other big boy at NT? Could Cofield play well at DE?

I think Barry can play end. I am not sure if Jenkins is a NT though

[MLSKINS]

I am willing to give Coefield some time. He has only played three games at NT in the NFL and I think he has looked okay.

[tdigle]

In my opinion, we're three players away (an MLB, a CB, and a dominant end) from being an elite (top 3) defense. It's unfortunate that we won't be able to use this upcoming draft to get some of the better ILB prospects to come out in a long time (Vontaze Burfict, Luke Kuechly, or Manti Te'O).

[-JB-]

Chris Neild has played hard & made some good plays subbing for Cofield vs Dallas... Jenkins coming back next year healthy will be like having an extra draft pick & adds depth.. It would be great to have a Raji or Ngata ... Just have to wait & see if Jenkins can be that guy next year with Neild, Cofield.. Plus Bowen, Carriker(how long is he signed?)... That's better depth up from than then Skins have had in years..

[KAZEstrong]

Did we forget about neild already? give the rook some time!

[S.T.real,lights,out]

I really feel like we are i just didn't want to bring it up.

I like Coefield a lot but i think he would be better at DE and not NT. I think he's too small to play NT. In a 3-4 your NT needs to take up two blockers, so far just about every game he has been blocked with just one. Especially in the Giants game. Bass (spelling??) imo totally controlled him. Yes, Coefield is def making plays for us but i think in order to really stop the run we need to get a bigger guy in there.

But i think we have bigger needs still over NT. But maybe a 2nd round pick next season would be nice. Thats if someone is worth it obviously.

[Champskins]

I'd take Phil Taylor in a heartbeat.

Like Cofield but unless he improves he isn't the guy. Should be a solid/good depth guy for the longterm though, nothing wrong with that.

I can see us looking strongly at NT in the first round.

You don't typically draft NT's in the first round... Great NT's can be found around the 3rd

---------- Post added September-29th-2011 at 02:54 PM ----------

There are quite a few big bodies coming out next year with some potential.. If we trade back and acquire another 2nd... expect us to be looking at guys like Alameda Ta'amu out of Washington, or pairing J. Jenkins with his old partner in crime Brandon Thompson from Clemson

[NLC1054]

We were missing tackles. I don't think the D-line has a lot to do with it. Barry does what Barry is supposed to do in a 3-4; he absorbs blocks and frees up the linebackers to blitz and make the tackles. I think our d-line is doing a lot better job of collapsing the pocket and absorbing blocks. I think Jarvis was going to be more of our run stuffer. But that leaves the onus on our linebackers and our safeties to make tackles. With Landry back, I expect the run D to improve, but I saw a couple times where Rocky missed a tackle that sprung Felix. OJ and Landry and Reed have whiffed on a couple tackles too.

Hell, I was shocked when I saw that LONDON didn't tackle someone well.

I guess you could say that our d-line needs to do a better job getting off their blocks to make tackles, but I think that'll improve more as the season goes on. They are not getting blown back off the ball like they would last season; if they're not collapsing the pocket or stopping the run, they're at least holding their ground and not letting teams push them around.

[HailGreen28]

We were missing tackles. I don't think the D-line has a lot to do with it. Barry does what Barry is supposed to do in a 3-4; he absorbs blocks and frees up the linebackers to blitz and make the tackles. I think our d-line is doing a lot better job of collapsing the pocket and absorbing blocks. I think Jarvis was going to be more of our run stuffer. But that leaves the onus on our linebackers and our safeties to make tackles. With Landry back, I expect the run D to improve, but I saw a couple times where Rocky missed a tackle that sprung Felix. OJ and Landry and Reed have whiffed on a couple tackles too.

Hell, I was shocked when I saw that LONDON didn't tackle someone well.

I guess you could say that our d-line needs to do a better job getting off their blocks to make tackles, but I think that'll improve more as the season goes on. They are not getting blown back off the ball like they would last season; if they're not collapsing the pocket or stopping the run, they're at least holding their ground and not letting teams push them around.I think the slick field had a lot to do with the missed tackles. Our guys just couldn't move like they were used to.

[Bobbyst21]

Give Neild some more playing time please. You dont find that many gems in the 7th round. The kid was a monster against the Giants and proved his worth against a very good offensive line. When he subs in,he makes good plays. So our true NT might be spending more time riding the bench.
Other teams get instant success from their rookies. Why cant we? Ever???

[Gibbs Hog Heaven]

I honestly don't see the D-line as an immediate need going forward. We've addressed it real well this past off season.

With a combination of Cofield and Nield at NT; and Bowen, Carriker, and Jenkins at end, all who'll be 28 and under at the start of next year; with hopefully Doug Worthington, who I thought was unlucky not to make the 53 when Jarvis went down, and the big ass NT Chris Baker as youth pushing on the practice squad; we're lucking pretty darn healthy for once on the defensive line going forward. (I excluded Golsten and Scott as I don't foresee either here in 2012.).

Hail.

[KCasady]

I couldve sworn Haslett said earlier that Jarvis was going to play end and not NT like some of you have mentioned.

[PlayAction]

Other teams get instant success from their rookies. Why cant we? Ever???

Kerrigan is developing into a real monster.
Jenkins was on the same trajectory until he tore his ACL
Helu looks like he was a great pickup.
When he gets his opportunities, Nield has performed well.

DeJon Gomes, Niles Paul and Hankerson are still developing. Certainly no one on the team has expressed any reservations about whether these rookies are ever going to "get it". Overall, this draft was like night and day compared to the Vinny years.

[Rudechain]

In my opinion, we're three players away (an MLB, a CB, and a dominant end) from being an elite (top 3) defense. It's unfortunate that we won't be able to use this upcoming draft to get some of the better ILB prospects to come out in a long time (Vontaze Burfict, Luke Kuechly, or Manti Te'O).


Did I miss something and the Redskins have no draft picks?

[PlayAction]

I couldve sworn Haslett said earlier that Jarvis was going to play end and not NT like some of you have mentioned.

Yes, he played DE in the preseason before his injury. Cofield is a huge improvement at NT. If the Skins can get an even better NT then I'm sure they'll move Cofield to DE with perhaps spot duty at NT. I'm happy with the DL and it's only going to get better.

[SkinsHokieFan]

My primary concern was our lack of penetration and pocket collapsing from the middle against Dallas.

That interior o-line was terrible. But we weren't getting the interior penetration I expected

[Champskins]

My primary concern was our lack of penetration and pocket collapsing from the middle against Dallas.

That interior o-line was terrible. But we weren't getting the interior penetration I expected

To be fair, Romo was dumping the ball pretty quick which is exciting to know that teams are now becoming fearful of our D. If we played the screen better, we'd be all set.

[Bobbyst21]

Kerrigan is developing into a real monster.
Jenkins was on the same trajectory until he tore his ACL
Helu looks like he was a great pickup.
When he gets his opportunities, Nield has performed well.

DeJon Gomes, Niles Paul and Hankerson are still developing. Certainly no one on the team has expressed any reservations about whether these rookies are ever going to "get it". Overall, this draft was like night and day compared to the Vinny years.

I completely agree about the draft and should have mentioned Kerrigan and Orakpo when talking about rookies. Just seems to me that our rookies take longer to impact the team as a whole then most other teams.
Maklin,Jackson,Bryant,Newton,Ingram,Dalton,Taylor etc.
Davis is just now becoming a force.3 years in i think.By the time most of our draft signings take the field,they're no longer rookies. Jenkins could of been different but we got bit.

[Loyal2Washington]

Problem is, speaking purely from an elite defense stand point, our front seven is filled with a bunch of good solid players. Which there is nothing wrong that, a good disciplined front seven will keep you in every game and against lesser talented O's will be capable of winning the game. There is no one on the front seven that teams have to account for on every play, we lack that defensive presence that can will the team to a big stop or make a play that can swing the game.

[Rudechain]

Problem is, speaking purely from an elite defense stand point, our front seven is filled with a bunch of good solid players. Which there is nothing wrong that, a good disciplined front seven will keep you in every game and against lesser talented O's will be capable of winning the game. There is no one on the front seven that teams have to account for on every play, we lack that defensive presence that can will the team to a big stop or make a play that can swing the game.

Wait, they don't have to account for Orakpo?

While I don't see anyone that could be considered the best at their respective positions, I do think it's a solid front seven. And if they play their assignments the defense can be pretty stout.

It's eleven guys working together to form a cohesive unit.

I expect more DL and LB to come in next off-season. I expect they will be able to settle into a DL rotation that keeps the guys fresher through the game. This defense is not completely built yet but it's much improved over last season. And next season, I expect it to be better than this seasons.

[tdigle]

Did I miss something and the Redskins have no draft picks?

All signs point to them going QB in the 1st. All of those LBs more than likely won't last past the first.

[Loyal2Washington]

Wait, they don't have to account for Orakpo?

No, teams don't have to account for Orakpo every play. Is he a good player, absolutely no doubt about it. Is he a player that can dominate a game and change the out come? After 34 career games I would have to say no at this point.

[SAP_Pete]

I too like what I've seen from Neild. Kid's got potential, give him something to do.

[SkinsHokieFan]

Wait, they don't have to account for Orakpo?

While I don't see anyone that could be considered the best at their respective positions, I do think it's a solid front seven. And if they play their assignments the defense can be pretty stout.

It's eleven guys working together to form a cohesive unit.

I expect more DL and LB to come in next off-season. I expect they will be able to settle into a DL rotation that keeps the guys fresher through the game. This defense is not completely built yet but it's much improved over last season. And next season, I expect it to be better than this seasons.

This is essentially it.

If you think about a future "core" going forward, you have Jenkins, Orakpo, Kerrigan, Landry.

I would like to see another big time playmaker in the front 7

[Gibbs Hog Heaven]

This is essentially it.

If you think about a future "core" going forward, you have Jenkins, Orakpo, Kerrigan, Landry.

I would like to see another big time playmaker in the front 7

When you say 'core' SHF, I presume you mean starters?

Hail.

[RANSKINS98]

The problems on this team do not begin with the defense, Our defense is fine. Lets fix our Redzone Offense then our special teams, then we are crimson and clovers

[bird_1972]

SHF,

I'm really glad you posted this. I wasn't so sure, though, that it was our DL that was to blame for our continued poor performance vs. the pass. Instead, I think our ILBs (really McIntosh) haven't been doing their job.

Perhaps a more prototypical NT would help as well.

Do we know how many snaps per game Neild is getting at NT in place of Cofield?

---------- Post added September-29th-2011 at 11:13 PM ----------


but I saw a couple times where Rocky missed a tackle that sprung Felix.

That was straight-up awful.

He took a terrible angle on him that even a novice Xs and Os guy like myself could clearly see on the replay.

I really feel like ILB is becoming a 1st day (and maybe even 2nd round at the latest) need for us in the 2012 draft.

[bird_1972]

Good post. I say yes, Cofield has a great attitude but he's not a guy that is going to occupy double teams and it shows. He's always been a 4-3 DT and admitted when he was signed that he never took on double teams. Like the guy, didn't like the signing. He is an upgrade at NT over last year but that’s is not much of a compliment.

I don't think it's a bad signing. He could still be very effective at 3-4 DE.

We just need a starting-caliber NT to rotate in with Neild.

Perhaps we could get that NT in rounds 4 or 5 in next year's draft?

[SirClintonPortis]

The Cowboys sprung a bunch of big plays due to missed tackles or getting the wrong guy, but we stuffed them otherwise. It's much better than last year when just about every play was a 4 yard run or more.(It got better when Kemo was healthier, but when Fatal Bert took the field, the rush D sucked again).

[bird_1972]

I agree. I thought when we signed him that he was more of a 3-4 DE than a NT. I like him and his attitude but he's not the answer at NT.

Yeah ... I hear you.

I'd like another NT to start with Neild coming in for relief.

What ever happened to the guy last year? He was looking ok by the end of the season ... Anthony Davis, I think? He got cut in the offseason.

[NLC1054]

Barry's about the same size and weight as Jay Ratliff, and not being the prototypical nose tackle guy hasn't hurt Ratliff any.

Barry's learning a new position, and he's a significant upgrade over anything we had last year. Let's give him more than three games before we start talking about how we need to draft a new guy to replace the guy that we just signed, especially when we already drafted a guy we like, and already have another guy on our practice squad.

[Dirt]

I'd say Cofield is just fine. Remember how hard it seemed to find a NT when Albert refused to play one? As if it was the hardest position to acquire. Remember the agreement was to have him play NT before he just completely backed out of the deal. Had Al just said "no I'm not playing NT" from day one, I'm sure Shanny would have found other guys and we wouldn't be so worried about the NT position. Again, Albert is to blame.

Cofield seems to me like one of those guys you don't have to worry about, and that's the best kinda guy. With Jenkins on deck, i'm not really worried about the NT position whatsoever.

[jazzy1]

whats up fellas

I woulda prefered we kept bryant he is a run stuffer at least , Cofield seems to swim quite a bit trying to get upfield and occasionally leaves the middle vulnerable plus he gets washed out of the play alot of the time just because he lacks the full size.

[JesseNeckred]

I think Cofield is too good and too willing to be a team player to dump ever, if Nield comes along, could be an extremely effective combo to switch up on the other team's O now and then

I'd really like to see a Dime package in there with Cofield and Nield at DT, Rak and Kerrigan at DE, that would be excellent I think, I really can't wait till next season when Jenkins gets his chance

[MusicCitySkin]

I figured Cofield wasn't a prototypical NT when Ricky Williams straight knocked him on his ass in preseason. With that said, I feel he is an upgrade over Kemoeatu and Bryant as someone that can do the job that needs to be done. Despite some big gains versus the run D, for the most part they've been solid.

[Burgold]

I don't think it was NT. It was linebacker. After Orakpo went out, Jackson couldn't hold contain and they just burned us going wide. The middle was still dead.

[tr1]

The D-Line is fine against the run.

Poor LB tackling is an issue.

[MartinC]

Perhaps a more prototypical NT would help as well.

Do we know how many snaps per game Neild is getting at NT in place of Cofield?

Neild had 18 snaps against Dallas and is playing very well. He is a true NT but is also getting push up the middle against the pass and is holding his own (and ground) against the run. He is ahead of schedule and getting better.

The front seven on defense is night and day better than last year - add a healthy Jenkins and the form he showed before he was hurt and we are in good shape up front on defense. ILB is a place we may spend a high poick next year though - London can't play forever and while Rocky is doing better than last year he is not making many impact plays.

[justice98]

Colfield, Carriker, Bowen, with Neild and Jenkins (when he comes back) are probably gonna be our DL for the next several years, so if we can't stop the run with that group, I don't know what we're gonna do. I don't envision much if any turnover in the foreseeable future.

[paloosa]

The thing that I learned from being on here is that this is just another thread by a fan trying to fix a problem that isn't a problem. The reason why the Cowboys ran the ball well wasn't due to them dominating the middle but from running off tackle or wide. The poor tackling or angles from McIntosh and other players made those runs effective. Cofield and Neild are doing excellent at the position but can't make every play. What do you expect them to do? Manhandle 2 or 3 blockers? No NT in the NFL can do that. At least they are making plays that Haynesworth or any other DT we had was able to make. Go back to the last 2 or 3 years and look at how our DT and DE's were and look at these first 3 games are. You will see the difference in the NT play.

[Boss_Hogg]

in the 3-4 defense, the LBs are responsible for the stretch runs or cut backs.

This is the fault of the LBs and defensive play calling, not the NT.

[DC9]

Running game problem wasn't with D-Line, our LB's and safeties missed tackles.

Brian Orakpo was out, and on the run to the left Rob Jackson and LaRon Landry both crashed on Fiametta (the fullback) and neither went to the tackle. This stuff gets worked out in time with practice and reps. The other one (up the middle) was a missed tackle by Rocky McIntosh.

[TD_washingtonredskins]

This is essentially it.

If you think about a future "core" going forward, you have Jenkins, Orakpo, Kerrigan, Landry.

I would like to see another big time playmaker in the front 7

I think you would want to add a NT and ILB to that front seven and you'd be set for a long time. I think you can get away with having one guy at each level who is just average. If we have Jenkins and a future NT on the line, the other end can be just a guy. Same goes for the LBs...with our bookend OLBs already in place, we'll need to replace London in the next year or two with a stud ILB. If we do, the fourth guy is pretty irrelevant (and can potentially be someone already here). In the secondary, you can probably move forward with Landry, Barnes, and a couple additions.

Again, this is long-term. I think players like Cofield, Bowen, Fletcher, Atogwe, and Hall are fine for the next couple years. If we add a core defensive player or two in each off-season, we'll be very tough on that side of the ball very quickly. You have to imagine with players like Nield, Jackson, and some other younger front-seven players, we have a decent set of rotational guys already.

[terryb101]

One of the dissapointments from Monday night was the Cowboys ability to run the ball. 4.8 YPC (yes they were skewed by big runs, but those count) along with only 1 tackle for loss by our defense.

Arizona was also able to run the ball well in the 2nd half with Beanie Wells.

Is Coefield the right clog in the middle? Or should there be consideration this offseason to make a move at NT, and have Cofield and Bowen play end?

we are lacking alot more than a nose tackle

[Houston2Taylor2Landry]

we are lacking alot more than a nose tackle

Yeah, an ILB. Our D is is quickly becoming very good.

[DC9]

I think Barry can play end. I am not sure if Jenkins is a NT though

Chris Neild gets a lot of push at the NT spot. I don't think Barry gets enough. I am confident we could get Barry to perform well at end. Maybe draft another NT in the top 4 rounds next year, move Cofield over to End and get rid of Gholston. Gholston has been horrible.

That being said, he (Cofield) is doing well holding the center at the point of attack, but he gets little to no push in the backfield, especially on passing downs.

[bird_1972]

Anthony Bryant. He was a journeymen and was an upgrade over Kemo but that doesn't say much. Neild actually plays on special team which is something that Bryant could never do.

I hear you.

I guess we do need to draft someone.

Dammit ... was really hoping this upcoming draft would be all QB/OL/ILB.

---------- Post added September-30th-2011 at 11:07 AM ----------


Neild had 18 snaps against Dallas and is playing very well. He is a true NT but is also getting push up the middle against the pass and is holding his own (and ground) against the run. He is ahead of schedule and getting better.

The front seven on defense is night and day better than last year - add a healthy Jenkins and the form he showed before he was hurt and we are in good shape up front on defense. ILB is a place we may spend a high poick next year though - London can't play forever and while Rocky is doing better than last year he is not making many impact plays.I wouldn't argue that the DL is much, much better than last year. I agree.

The OLB situation is also better. However, we are still weak in the middle of the LB corps which is important in a 3-4 scheme. I hope we get one stud and another young development guy (unless Riley is progressing).

As for Neild, any thoughts around the likelihood he could become our starting NT by end of season? We could slide Cofield into the DE rotation next season and pick up a young NT in the later rounds of the 2012 draft to rotate in with Neild.

[Diesel Hog]

Off topic (kinda) but I'm STILL not over Jarvis Jenkins getting injured. He was looking like he had so much potential, and bam, out for the season. The D definitely looks better now, but I'm wondering if they'd be even better with him in the rotation.

[bird_1972]

Chris Neild gets a lot of push at the NT spot. I don't think Barry gets enough. I am confident we could get Barry to perform well at end. Maybe draft another NT in the top 4 rounds next year, move Cofield over to End and get rid of Gholston. Gholston has been horrible.

That being said, he (Cofield) is doing well holding the center at the point of attack, but he gets little to no push in the backfield, especially on passing downs.I don't think we have the luxury of spending a 1st thru 4th round pick on a NT. We need QB/OL/ILB.

As for Gholston, I think he was just a depth guy. If we can upgrade him with a younger DL later in the draft (rounds 6, 7) that would be good for us.