Kellen Moore on display right now in MAACO Bowl vs ASU

[luke1867]

Looks Great!!!

---------- Post added December-22nd-2011 at 08:59 PM ----------

Kellen Moore looking like Drew Brees out there. I think Redskins have their man!

On ESPN. http://espn.go.com/watchespn/player?id=320440

[BigRedskinDaddy]

He DOES, but it's only ASU he's playing against. Not the toughest defense out there.

[luke1867]

He DOES, but it's only ASU he's playing against. Not the toughest defense out there.

Dont think that matters. He played Georgia (top ranked SEC team) and tore apart their defense. I think he will be a quality QB in the NFL.

[wysknz1]

You're going to get blasted for that comment. I like Kellen myself. Yes he lacks arm strength, but he is a winner (losses have been few and by missed FGs) He's very accurate and takes care of the ball His stats are like 120 TD to 20 INTs. He has a Peyton mind but a Drew Brees body.

Also the reffing in this game ROYALLY sucks. a drive or two ago there was a hold against the Boise D right in front of the AS QB not called. If the same would've happened against the Skins there woulda been at least 5 threads on it.

[wysknz1]

Boise does have some nice receivers though. Not 1 rounders but some worth a shot

[BigRedskinDaddy]

Dont think he matters. He played Georgia (top ranked SEC team) and tore apart their defense. I think he will be a quality QB in the NFL.

The honest truth is, I think he could be a good QB at the next level myself. I'm one of the minority here with that opinion. Of course, it's equally possible that he is a bust. But as wysknz said, he's a winner, pure and simple. Hard to discount a guy like that. He tends to succeed against tall odds.

[Newera]

I love the dude as well. There's a handful of us on the board. He would excel in Kyle's system.

[wysknz1]

I have watched him play live twice. In Laramie and Ft Collins. Well worth the price of admission just to watch him dismantle a defense

Note though that I do admit neither UW or CSU has a great defense

[Newera]

He's going to turn out to be a really good pro in the right system. He already plays like one. People over emphasize the physical. When he plays, his arm never looks weak to me. He actually has more arm then people realize. He probably will develop more arm strength in the NFL. He's a surgeon. That won't change at the next level. I think he should be the guy. But that's me. He's as good as Barkley.

It's a joke they're playing Arizona. That's the BCS.

[wysknz1]

I think he should be the guy. But that's me.

I'd definetly rather give him a shot rather than Manning or Flynn who are propossed by some around here

[Newera]

The BCS should be ashamed of not putting Boise in a BCS game.

[Newera]

I'd definetly rather give him a shot rather than Manning or Flynn who are propossed by some around here

The guy is really good. Like I've said . . . Brees with Montana style.

[Newera]

Serious question, maybe a dumb one. Do we need to draft or acquire an elite RT if we draft him? Do these exist? Aren't the best ones usually playing the left side?

I was thinking with Moore, your right tackle is your blind side. Interesting thought.

[Stophovr6]

Serious question, maybe a dumb one. Do we need to draft or acquire an elite RT if we draft him? Do these exist? Aren't the best ones usually playing the left side?

[indatrenches]

I too have been on the Kellen Moore bandwagon after i watched him tear apart VT last year in the opener, then Georgia in the opener this year.

Those two teams thrive on having strong defenses.

With Barkley and possibly RG III gone i hope we go Blackmon in the first round then trade down in the second round (mid to late 2nd ) pick Kellen Moore and pick up an additional 3rd round pick.

That would allow us to have some firepower on offense and two 3rds and two 4ths (Jason C. trade) which would allow us to pick up some nice interior linemen (preferably a LG, C, and a RT) and some depth in the secondary.

[Newera]

I might resign Rex and draft Moore. Or, go after Flynn in free agency and still draft Moore. Rex would probably be the cheaper alternative. We're going to be out of the RG3 sweepstake. Unless we give up the house to move to St. Louis spot. But, the Browns can always offer more because they have two first round picks. However, I still contend, five years from now, Moore is going to be one of the best out of this draft.

[Stophovr6]

Not looking great, can't take a snap from under center.

[pez]

Yeah, huly can tell you I have been on the moore bandwagon for the past several years... his only disadvantage is his size (height and weight).

He is deadly accurate with the ball however, and is really one of the greatest qb's out there at reading defenses and quickly deciding the play.

[Bostic Hog]

Yeah, huly can tell you I have been on the moore bandwagon for the past several years... his only disadvantage is his size (height and weight).

He is deadly accurate with the ball however, and is really one of the greatest qb's out there at reading defenses and quickly deciding the play.

As a college QB, in a rather low-level conference. I'll pass (no pun intended :))

[mistertim]

With Barkley and possibly RG III gone i hope we go Blackmon in the first round then trade down in the second round (mid to late 2nd ) pick Kellen Moore and pick up an additional 3rd round pick.

Kellen would be a HUGE reach in the 2nd round. IMO he is a mid rounder at best. Yes he has won a ton, is smart, and doesn't turn the ball over. But he is small; he is listed as 6'0 190 but I think that is being pretty generous because whenever I have watched him play he just looks tiny to me. I wouldn't be surprised if he came in at 5'11 180. Obviously size and arm strength, etc aren't everything. But his size is really going to put a lot of teams off. That and the conference he is in and the fact that most of the defenses he has faced have been pretty mediocre at best.

[deejaydana]

I don't think using ASU's defense is a good barometer of how he'll play at the next level (though I do want to thank him for winning me money tonight). :)
Based on arm strength alone Landry Jones is a much better prospect.

[jflow78]

Kellen would be a HUGE reach in the 2nd round.....

I'd be really happy with him, as long as he's not less than 6'0" and 220. I think currently he's supposed to be a 5th rounder. If his size doesn't add up (if he's 5'11" as some on the board believe), he might not be drafted at all.

Personally, I think he's either 6 or 6'1", and just really skinny. If that's the case, he should be able to pack on some weight predraft and make it to an exceptable weight. The guy has a ton of potential, it's really all about size for him, at least from most of the draft "experts" on ESPN and NFL network.

---------- Post added December-23rd-2011 at 02:09 AM ----------


I don't think using ASU's defense is a good barometer of how he'll play at the next level (though I do want to thank him for winning me money tonight). :)
Based on arm strength alone Landry Jones is a much better prospect.

Landry Jones is the worst prospect in college currently. He's done nothing but lose stock all year. His #1 receiver goes down, he can't get the job done. He's got the best OL in college football, yet he's not even as good as top 3 in college. He has the tools, but there's something missing for him. The guy has been sacked less than all the major QB prospects, yet he's underwhelming at best.

I would take nearly anyone coming out over Jones at this moment.

[Newera]

I don't think using ASU's defense is a good barometer of how he'll play at the next level (though I do want to thank him for winning me money tonight). :)
Based on arm strength alone Landry Jones is a much better prospect.

I would take average arm strength and smarts over strong arm strength and an average mind every time. What that kid has done in four years is remarkable. Never to be matched. He will get better at the next level. He's special. Watch. People miss on quarterbacks all the time, because they think it's all about arm strength and height. There's more to it. Russell. Drukenmiller. Shuler. Leaf. You could go on and on. What Moore did in college ain't a fluke. They said Brees was to small and Montana did not have the arm strength. Well, keep thinking that about Moore. When he turns out to be really good, remember I said so. He's a steal and plays more like Montana then Brees.

I think one of the best coaches in the league at evaluating quarterback talent is Sean Payton. His three projects. Brees (anyone could of signed Drew, he did and now a Hall of Famer), Daniels (Drew's back up the last three years and cut by Zorn, and Romo (who was his recruit -- he out bid Shanahan for him) when he the offensive coordinator in Dallas.

Whereas Mike is looking a little sketchy with McNabb and Beck right now.l

[CrabR]

he does not have a deep ball, I see him as a more accurate grossman

Landry will never be an NFL QB same problem as Gabbart, afraid to getting hit in the pocket. I do not know how either where ever considered 1st rd material

[CrabR]

he does not have a deep ball, I see him as a more accurate grossman

Landry will never be an NFL QB same problem as Gabbart, afraid to getting hit in the pocket. I do not know how either where ever considered 1st rd material

[MusicCitySkin]

Colt McCoy 2.0.

No, I don't mean that in a good way.

[Vooskin]

Just watched the kiper and mcshay debate and mcshay was saying because of his size which in reality is smaller then the listed, it's possible he won't be draft at all. If he is it probably won't be till the later rounds.

[KingGibbs]

Sorry guys, but with his lack of arm strength NFL corners would have a field day with Moore. They would constantly bait him knowing he doesn't have the arm strength to get it in tight spaces affording them to give the receiver some space and then breaking on the ball.

[KDawg]

Has anyone read "Moneyball"? Basically, it talks about how the old baseball scouts always used to judge a guy based on their tools and their bodies. They use the phrase, "we're not trying to sell jeans, we're trying to build a baseball team". Now, baseball scouting and football scouting are fundamentally different. But they look at production. Specifically, they look to see how many walks the prospects get and how well they hit. And not necessarily for power, as they believe power hitting can be taught, but you can't just learn how to hit.

Obviously, we know from the Timmy Chang's, Colt Brennan's and all the other high number quarterbacks that didn't pan out in the NFL that production isn't the end all be all of NFL quarterback prospects. But, just take a look at Moore's collegiate numbers for a second:

69.6% completion percentage - People are saying that Moore has a weak arm, and his completion percentage is probably more about the lack of star power on opposing teams than it is about how good he is. I disagree. When you complete 70% of your passes for your career, it's not just because of a lack of opposing talent. Moore reads defenses extremely well. He's a very heady, smart quarterback. His arm strength isn't ideal, but he makes up for it with his ability to anticipate and read a defense.

8.85 Yards Per Attempt, 271 Yards Per Game - Boise is not a pass heavy team. They've had a solid running game and solid line. This in part makes Moore look good, I understand that. But Moore also helps the running game out. Moore is someone that opposing defenses needed to gameplan for. And he still managed to have solid games.

5.38:1 TD:INT Ratio - That number speaks for itself.

Now, in fairness, Colt Brennan had EXTREMELY similar collegiate numbers, in one less season to boot. However, he also threw the ball 500 times a season in an extremely heavy pass first offense. His TD:INT ratio was a paultry 3.11:1 (131 TD/42 INT). He had 1584 attempts in three seasons for 14193 yards, 131 TD and 42 INT. Moore had 1624 pass attempts in four seasons, threw for 14374 yards, had 16 less INTs and 9 more TDs.

Again, the numbers are close. And that doesn't bode well for Moore. But I see Moore doing more reading than I ever saw Brennan. I don't know if that's fact by any means, but it seems to me like the guy doesn't simply rely on arm strength (because he certainly does lack it). He relies on what he sees and feels.

So I'm not sure I'm on the "he's sure to succeed" bandwagon. But I'm certainly not on the "no way" bandwagon, either. If he can be had later in the draft and we have a pick to spare, I'd be extremely happy with giving him a shot.

I wasn't a Brennan fan, personally. I didn't see him make a ton of great reads at Hawaii. His offense had guys running open all the time. I've seen more of that diagnosis stuff from Kellen.

What I can't understand is why there are so many that were high on Colt that are down on Kellen. Even though they have similar numbers, they played in two completely different offenses, and Kellen's numbers still compare with Colt's.

Again, I'm not saying he's sure to be a savior. He has some severe weaknesses. His arm strength isn't top notch. His size is less than ideal. But he's a leader, not quite in the Tebow mold, but a leader nonetheless. And I'd say he's more of a leader than Brennan was at Hawaii. And he's smart.

Chad Pennington was a pretty okay quarterback and the guy had a noodle arm.

Again. I'm not saying to draft this guy in the first round. But I am saying that if we get a chance at him in the later rounds, I want him. Worst that can happen is he flames out. But I see something in the kid. He has "it". But I do agree, his physical traits aren't all that amazing.

---------- Post added December-23rd-2011 at 08:20 AM ----------

By the way, the other QB to keep an eye on, who likely isn't coming out this year, was the other one in this game. Brock Osweiler. Though, he may with Erickson going away. Haven't heard much. The guy is huge. 6'8" 240 lbs. More mistake prone, but more of the NFL physical traits that teams so desperately crave.

He had his way with USC and Mizzou. The problem is his production is just okay, and he's a guy that operates on potential. Which I believe he has. He's improved his delivery and moves decently. He's getting better at presnap reads. Issue with him is I haven't seen him work a whole lot under center, and his size may work against him there.

[Skinsinparadise]

Haven't studied Moore so don't have an opinion. I just watched Kiper and McShay talk about Moore, they think he's a 6th-7th rounder. McShay says he's going to have to work hard to become a third stringer in the NFL. both though are complementary of him as a college player. McShay refers to Chase Daniels when talking about him, if curious here it is: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2q15SEySftQ

[paloosa]

I think Kellen Moore can be that guy also because he has proven he can win games. Heck he has the record of 50 wins by a QB in the history of the NCAA. That tells you alot about the guy and the program he has come from. Plus he has played top teir teams such as Oklahoma, Georgia and Virginia Tech and won those games. These are teams that are winning programs every year. It is too bad he was unable to play against teams like LSU, Alabama, Florida, Ohio State, Michigan and USC. Teams that are suppose to be the "cream of the crop" but are afraid to play Boise State because the money would go somewhere other than to the BCS Conferences and not because of ratings. So Kellen Moore will be a very good QB and if the Redskins draft him I think they will do well with him.

Another thing that you want to look at is his completion percentage for his career is in the 70's and has a very good TD to INT ratio that is the combination you only see from Drew Brees in the NFL.

[The X-Factor]

Kellen would be a HUGE reach in the 2nd round. IMO he is a mid rounder at best. Yes he has won a ton, is smart, and doesn't turn the ball over. But he is small; he is listed as 6'0 190 but I think that is being pretty generous because whenever I have watched him play he just looks tiny to me. I wouldn't be surprised if he came in at 5'11 180. Obviously size and arm strength, etc aren't everything. But his size is really going to put a lot of teams off. That and the conference he is in and the fact that most of the defenses he has faced have been pretty mediocre at best.

This was the exact same things they were saying about Andy Dalton last year and he's having a pretty good rookie season. The thing that both Moore and Dalton had in common was that they were winners. You can't teach that. I would much rather use a middle round pick on Moore than a first round pick on a guy like Landry Jones who has had a great supporting cast but still puts up middling numbers.

[KingGibbs]

Here is the list of winningest college QB's. Bump everyone down one and put Moore number one. Not exactly a who's who list Manning being the lone exception of course. A lot more failures in terms of NFL success with this list. A lot more.



1. Colt McCoy, 45-8, 2006-2009, Texas
2. Andy Dalton, 42-7, 2007-2010, TCU
3. David Green, 42-10, 2001-2004, Georgia
4. Peyton Manning, 39-6, 1994-1997, Tennessee
5. Ken Dorsey, 38-2, 2000-2002, Miami
6. Rick Leach, 38-8, 1975-1978, Notre Dame
7. Matt Leinart, 37-2, 2003-2005, USC
8. John Rauch, 36-8, 1945-1948, Georgia
9. Dan Lefevour, 36-15, 2006-2009, Central Michigan
10. Chuck Ealey, 35-0, 1969-1971, Toledo
11. Chad Pennington, 35-4, 1997-1999, Marshall
12. Jay Barker, 35-5, 1991-1994, Alabama
13. Tim Tebow, 35-6, 2006-2009, Florida
14. Eric Crouch, 35-7, 1998-2001, Nebraska
15. Chuck Long, 35-13, 1982-1985, Iowa

[ashlynskins]

I love the dude as well. There's a handful of us on the board. He would excel in Kyle's system.


bingo.....in total agreement but I wonder will anyone take him in the 1st.......imho he will be and is better then Andy Dalton...

[hawgboy]

Howdy gang, Hawgboy from Idaho here. It goes without saying that I love me some Kellen Moore, and I think he's one of the smartest guys out there, but he's not a big guy and usually only has 2-3 long bombs in him per game. He's also had pretty consistent line protection in Boise and has never been beat up....and that's EXACTLY what will happen to him if puts on a Skins uniform.

If Mike and Kurt want to go there, fine but wait till round 4 at the VERY least...I'm pretty sure he'll still be there. Truth be told, I see Kellen Moore excelling in the NFL...on a coaching staff.

[BigRedskinDaddy]

...What I can't understand is why there are so many that were high on Colt that are down on Kellen. Even though they have similar numbers, they played in two completely different offenses, and Kellen's numbers still compare with Colt's...

Nice analysis, brother. Spot on as always. I think part of the reason very few are high on KM is he's kinda vanilla, gets the job done but isn't flashy, yadda yadda yadda. Colt, OTOH, was the sexy SoCal kid with the gunslinger name and mentality, who was gonna shock the world.

Right.

[ACW]

Moore didn't play OU.

[mi6]

He won't go in the first. Especially when he measures at the combine at 5'11" and 182. I'd be surprised if he went higher than mid third.

Agreed. I like the spunk Kellen has. It's unfortunate that he is somewhat physically challenged to play at the next level. In the NFL there are very few QB, if any at all, that measure 5'10". Had Kellen been just 4 or 5 inches taller, he would be considered a 1st rounder. And, that's reality. The QB has to be able to see over his line, and in the NFL most linemen are around 6'3" and up. Arm strength also matters. You have to be able to go deep. Kellen is accurate in short and medium passes. But, due to lack of arm strength can't push the ball vertically.

[KDawg]

Moore didn't play OU.

2006. Fiesta Bowl.

EDIT: I said he sure did. I meant he did not. :ols:

He enrolled in 2007.

[mistertim]

He won't go in the first. Especially when he measures at the combine at 5'11" and 182. I'd be surprised if he went higher than mid third.

If he comes in at that height/weight (I wouldn't necessarily be shocked if he did), he might not even be drafted and I'd say late rounder at best. If he does come in at 6'0 and 190 lbs (listed numbers) then he could be a 3rd-5th rounder. If he somehow manages to grow a few inches taller, put on 30 lbs of muscle, and considerably improve his arm strength by the combine and pro day then he would have a legit shot at going in the 1st.

[MartinC]

If he somehow manages to grow a few inches taller, put on 30 lbs of muscle, and considerably improve his arm strength by the combine and pro day then he would have a legit shot at going in the 1st.

So your saying there's a chance?

[Newera]

It just takes one GM and coach to like him. Well, he was a franchise quarterback for Boise. To me it's how he plays. He reminds me of Montana. Perfectly suited for a west coast offense. Surgical short to intermediate passing game. With an ability to go long, which he can do. There are countless times where he's thrown the ball 60 yards. He plays quick and fast and anticipates routes and pressure so well. Every year in the top three in limited sacks allowed. He doesn't take sacks. You can't teach that, it's a gift. He would take what Grossman is doing to a higher and more efficient level. When everything is said and done, he will go in the second or third and will be the sleeper quarterback in this draft, as Tebow and Dalton have been for the last draft.

It will be fun with Moore, he's always proved the naysayers wrong. He will do it at the next level as well.

[urblessed00]

I like Moore myself as well. I like his intangibles..and has already been stated..he's a winner. I don't know...personally...I'd like to see him go to the Saints. They took a flier on Chas Daniel. He's a nice back-up there. I think Moore could really excel in that offense. Also, sitting behind Brees...I think it would be a great learning experience for him. You put him in a dome.........eight games out of the year......plus they play the Falcons every year..that's nine......take the bad weather elements of rain and wind out of it...and I think he would have a chance to succeed. Just my opinion.

[Slacky McSlackAss]

You would be a winner too if you were playing pop warner teams pretty much every week.

[PlayAction]

There's no concensus yet on where Moore should be drafted. Like many who watched Audibles and the game yesterday we've heard anywhere from low round 3 to undrafted free agent. No one expects him to become a starter at first and some think he'll top out as a dependable backup. That is, a guy who will make the throws within the Xs and Os but nothing more. Of course, I'm listening to this thinking that that's the kind of QB that the Shanahan's want! He's a project for sure since he hasn't had much experience under center. But the accuracy and the high football IQ are really desirable in the WCO. Love to see the Skins pick him up in the later rounds to replace the smart but unproductive Beck. Some of these types of players wind up proving the critics wrong.

[Enter Apotheosis]

he will go in the second and will be the sleeper quarterback in this draft, as Tebow* and Dalton have been for the last draft..

* citation needed

[Boss_Hogg]

No thanks, I'll pass.

6'0 191, week arm.

[Newera]

Interesting article on Kellen . . .

http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2011/writers/austin_murphy/11/11/kellen-moore-boise-state/index.html

[Newera]

If he was as legit as some posters say on here I think we'd see him on at least some Mocks. I haven't found a single one where he's even in the 2nd round. And you're right, he's undersized and has a very weak arm. He also plays a watered down schedule.

Of course, because weigh physical skills over the mental skills of quarterback. It's also why so many teams miss on quarterbacks.

[deejaydana]

No thanks, I'll pass.

6'0 191, week arm.

If he was as legit as some posters say on here I think we'd see him on at least some Mocks. I haven't found a single one where he's even in the 2nd round. And you're right, he's undersized and has a very weak arm. He also plays a watered down schedule.

[Newera]

If he was as legit as some posters say on here I think we'd see him on at least some Mocks. I haven't found a single one where he's even in the 2nd round. And you're right, he's undersized and has a very weak arm. He also plays a watered down schedule.

Of course, because people weigh physical skills over the mental skills of quarterbacking. Which in many ways is more important. It's also why so many teams miss on quarterbacks. Moore brings stuff to the table you can't teach. Smarts, anticipation, accuracy and instinct. Things Brees is good at as well. It's the same people that had Jamarcus Russell ranked so high. Todd McShay said Russell's work out was the best he had ever seen. Just sayin. I want the Redskins to finally get a really good quarterback, and think Moore could be the guy with a year of seasoning and weight training. He and Kyle would be mad scientist! Plus, I think his game will transfer faster to the west coast offense based on the Boise scheme. But then, I'm probably his biggest supporter on this board.

[RVAbrendan]

Moore can make deep throws when needed. He's a smart QB - reads defenses well. People overrate arm strength --> Patrick Ramsey, Kyle Boller, etc all had cannons. Not as important as accuracy, imo.

[ArmchairRedskin]

No way Shanahan goes for a weak armed tiny QB. Forget about it. Can you imagine the field day the NFCE defenses would have teeing off on him? You bring pressure up the gut and the dude is toast. Plus, you won't have to defend anything outside the numbers past ten yards. Eff all that noise. Drafting Moore to be your franchise guy is the equivalent of a hail mary pass from your own 20.

[deejaydana]

Why were the announcers saying they thought he would was out at the next level during the game last night? Mike Mayock knows his stuff btw. You have to take any "Mock Draft" with a grain of salt but honestly I haven't seen a single one mention him very much if at all even 3 rounds deep.

[Newera]

No way Shanahan goes for a weak armed tiny QB. Forget about it. Can you imagine the field day the NFCE defenses would have teeing off on him? You bring pressure up the gut and the dude is toast. Plus, you won't have to defend anything outside the numbers past ten yards. Eff all that noise. Drafting Moore to be your franchise guy is the equivalent of a hail mary pass from your own 20.

So bring back strong armed Shuler or Russell. Yeah, that's what we need.

[ArmchairRedskin]

So bring back strong armed Shuler or Russell. Yeah, that's what we need.



Don't be a dolt. Nobody is saying arm strength is the only thing.

[Newera]

Why were the announcers saying they thought he would was out at the next level during the game last night? Mike Mayock knows his stuff btw. You have to take any "Mock Draft" with a grain of salt but honestly I haven't seen a single one mention him very much if at all even 3 rounds deep.

That's not a surprise. The coach of San Diego State said Moore will be good at the next level and if he was 6' 4 he would be the number one pick. Okay, so he's not. Smaller quarterbacks have done okay in this league. Geez, Rex is only 6' 1. People always over rate arm strength, when it's accuracy that is most important, per Bill Walsh.

[Skin'Em84]

No way Shanahan goes for a weak armed tiny QB. Forget about it. Can you imagine the field day the NFCE defenses would have teeing off on him? You bring pressure up the gut and the dude is toast. Plus, you won't have to defend anything outside the numbers past ten yards. Eff all that noise. Drafting Moore to be your franchise guy is the equivalent of a hail mary pass from your own 20.

I'm fine with him if we can get him in the 3rd. He does have good intangibles, and plenty of QBs have done well with weaker arms (Pennington before his shoulder surgeries, Brees, Montana, etc..) Accuracy is most important. I have no problems with him as long as we don't reach to take him.

[deejaydana]

I don't think the height is the issue, it's the lack of arm strength. Again, I'm going off what Mike Mayock has said about him.

[Newera]

Don't be a dolt. Nobody is saying arm strength is the only thing.

Just defending my dude.

---------- Post added December-23rd-2011 at 01:42 PM ----------


I don't think the height is the issue, it's the lack of arm strength. Again, I'm going off what Mike Mayock has said about him.

People also act like arm strength can't improve. Rodgers and Brady have improved their arm strength.

[ArmchairRedskin]

I'm fine with him if we can get him in the 3rd. He does have good intangibles, and plenty of QBs have done well with weaker arms (Pennington before his shoulder surgeries, Brees, Montana, etc..) Accuracy is most important. I have no problems with him as long as we don't reach to take him.

Brees does not have a weak arm. Stop it already with the Brees comparisons. They don't hold any water past the height. Montana played in a pure WC offense. Pennington was severely limited. It really showed in the playoffs.

[Newera]

Brees does not have a weak arm. Stop it already with the Brees comparisons. They don't hold any water past the height. Montana played in a pure WC offense. Pennington was severely limited. It really showed in the playoffs.

Moore's arm compares favorably to Montana's. It's his accuracy that is his strength and his quick mind. Brees, has simply gotten better and better. He's taken quarterbacking to an art form. So you don't think Moore couldn't do that as well at the next level. All "Good" quarterbacks once they get to the NFL, get even better. Who's to say Kellen won't get even better. It has to be the right system for him. Bill Walsh would love the kid. He ignored what everyone was saying about Montana and took him in the 3rd and the rest is history. If you have a conviction about a guy to excel in your system, you take him.

[KDawg]

If he was as legit as some posters say on here I think we'd see him on at least some Mocks. I haven't found a single one where he's even in the 2nd round. And you're right, he's undersized and has a very weak arm. He also plays a watered down schedule.

Yup. Tom Brady's scouting report in college...


Tom Brady Positives: Good height to see the field. Very poised and composed. Smart and alert. Can read coverages. Good accuracy and touch. Produces in big spots and in big games. Has some Brian Griese in him and is a gamer. Generally plays within himself. Team leader.

Negatives: Poor build. Very skinny and narrow. Ended the '99 season weighing 195 pounds and still looks like a rail at 211. Looks a little frail and lacks great physical stature and strength. Can get pushed down more easily than you'd like. Lacks mobility and ability to avoid the rush. Lacks a really strong arm. Can't drive the ball down the field and does not throw a really tight spiral. System-type player who can get exposed if he must ad-lib and do things on his own

Sounds pretty familiar. I found that on another forum. Wish I could find an official version.

Not to say Moore is Brady in the least. But don't discount the guy because he's not a guy who's going to look good in jeans.

[NLC1054]

So bring back strong armed Shuler or Russell. Yeah, that's what we need.

That's hardly fair and you know it.

Moore has severe physical limitations that all the brains and the smarts in the world may not be able to overcome. He's 5'11" in cleats, and he's 190 pounds soaking wet with a brick in both pockets. He's got average arm strength, and it's only going to be tested more on the NFL level; he's passes have that "rainbow arc" you don't always want on the deep throws. And we base our entire offense on the ability to hit the intermediate to deep throws.

Yes, he is incredibly smart and very much accomplished on the college level. But he will be very much tested to do the same at the NFL level. I don't think anyone is talking about getting some tall, big mofo that can throw it through a brick wall but can't be accurate to save his life.

Could he be like Drew Brees. Maybe. Maybe. But it's unlikely.

[Newera]

That's hardly fair and you know it.

Moore has severe physical limitations that all the brains and the smarts in the world may not be able to overcome. He's 5'11" in cleats, and he's 190 pounds soaking wet with a brick in both pockets. He's got average arm strength, and it's only going to be tested more on the NFL level; he's passes have that "rainbow arc" you don't always want on the deep throws. And we base our entire offense on the ability to hit the intermediate to deep throws.

Yes, he is incredibly smart and very much accomplished on the college level. But he will be very much tested to do the same at the NFL level. I don't think anyone is talking about getting some tall, big mofo that can throw it through a brick wall but can't be accurate to save his life.

Could he be like Drew Brees. Maybe. Maybe. But it's unlikely.

Why does it have to be unlikely. Why not. What more does the guy have to do to prove that he knows how to play quarterback. Watch Boise fall next year. They will be decent but not elite. His arm is better then people realize. Height is over rated as well. Quarterbacks slide and throw thru lanes not over people.

[mistertim]

I don't think the height is the issue, it's the lack of arm strength. Again, I'm going off what Mike Mayock has said about him.

I think height certainly can be an issue. Especially if you're talking about a guy who may come in at 5'11 or something like that. Possible problems seeing throwing lanes develop (especially on short and intermediate stuff between the hashes), possible batted balls, even with an overhand delivery. Most NFL teams would like their guys to be at least 6'2 and it seems the general "prototype" is 6'3 - 6'4 or so. That obviously doesn't mean that a QB HAS to be that tall. Obviously Brees is extremely successful and Vick has been pretty successful (though a lot of his throwing is done at least a bit outside of the pocket). But those are exceptions mostly.

[BigRedskinDaddy]

If he comes in at that height/weight (I wouldn't necessarily be shocked if he did), he might not even be drafted and I'd say late rounder at best. If he does come in at 6'0 and 190 lbs (listed numbers) then he could be a 3rd-5th rounder. If he somehow manages to grow a few inches taller, put on 30 lbs of muscle, and considerably improve his arm strength by the combine and pro day then he would have a legit shot at going in the 1st.

Most of the mocks I've looked at have hime anywhere from the 10th to 15th best QB in this year's draft. I have to believe he will go somewhere between the late 2nd-and late 3rd, possibly the early 4th. But here's the thing: his lack of size, mediocre arm strength and marginal athleticism notwithstanding, this kid knows how to get it done, has a football IQ that's top 3 percentile at least, and LOVES proving doubters wrong. He was asked about his chances in the draft after the game last night and the sly, cheshire-cat grin that came over his face spoke volumes to me at least.

He is planning on doing some damage at the next level, not just holding a clipboard...

[ACW]

You would be a winner too if you were playing pop warner teams pretty much every week.VT and UGA are Pop Warner?

[ConnSKINS26]

Most of the mocks I've looked at have hime anywhere from the 10th to 15th best QB in this year's draft. I have to believe he will go somewhere between the late 2nd-and late 3rd, possibly the early 4th.

These statements do not go together.

If he IS seen as the 10th-15th best QB in this years draft by NFL teams, the likelihood of him being drafted before the 6th is very, very small, historically.

[ddub52]

Brock Osweiler was on display in that game too. How did he look? (I was traveling and didnt get the chance to watch)

[mistertim]

These statements do not go together.

If he IS seen as the 10th-15th best QB in this years draft by NFL teams, the likelihood of him being drafted before the 6th is very, very small, historically.

Yeah I was kinda thinking that as well.

Now, I don't want the people who are advocating Moore to think I dislike the guy or have anything against him. I've watched him play plenty of times and he seems really smart, good throwing mechanics, extremely accurate. But the issue of his size and arm strength is going to be a factor, there really isn't any way of getting around that. Could he prove his doubters wrong? Of course, and I'm rooting for him to do just that; he seems like a really good kid. I won't go so far as to say I think he will, or that I think he has a good shot at becoming a great QB at the next level, but who knows. All I'm saying is that for people to think the Skins should draft him in the 2nd or something of that nature is just crazy. I don't think he fits this offense and I don't think he fits the mold of what Mike or Kyle look for in a QB.

[AsiaticSkinsFan]

Moore is nothing like Tom Brady.


shorter, weaker am, and not tested in college weekly against good comp

[Slacky McSlackAss]

VT and UGA are Pop Warner?

Did I say every week? VT UGA and TCU may not be but Colorado State, Wyoming, Tulsa, and Wyoming aren't exactly BCS contenders.

[HoggLife]

He is someone we can get with our 2nd 4th round pick and that would still be early for him. Id like to see us go best player available in the st unless we can get Luck or RG3 and in the 2nd maybe get Landry Jones and in the 4th get Moore. That would give us 2 young QBs to battle it out and let the best man win.

[illone]

Moore is one of those guys who will make some team very happy. I feel like hes going to be a stud in the nfl.

[mistertim]

I think he will get drafted by someone but I don't think it will be the Skins. Again, I wish the guy the best; great college QB. I just don't see him being in the mold of what either Shanahan looks for.

[BigRedskinDaddy]

These statements do not go together.

If he IS seen as the 10th-15th best QB in this years draft by NFL teams, the likelihood of him being drafted before the 6th is very, very small, historically.

A-HA. Having thus exposed my ignorance of how many QB's actually get picked in each draft, I will now go stand in the corner of shame.

And think about what I've done.

Good catch brother.

[Newera]

Moore is one of those guys who will make some team very happy. I feel like hes going to be a stud in the nfl.

He's going to be real good. Just think about what he did at Boise. Lost only three games by five points. If he had a decent field goal kicker he may have gone undefeated. It's a record that will never be broken. What's also remarkable is that he had four very strong years of production.

---------- Post added December-24th-2011 at 12:48 AM ----------


I think he will get drafted by someone but I don't think it will be the Skins. Again, I wish the guy the best; great college QB. I just don't see him being in the mold of what either Shanahan looks for.

Look if the Shanahans liked Beck coming out and Mike liked Romo coming out, chances are they will like Moore. Moore's numbers are better than both of those guys. So it's not farfetched to think they may like Moore. The question is how much do they like him. I think one of the reasons they didn't draft a quarterback last year was because they knew this class was a lot better. The question is how they grade the quarterbacks. Mike has a history of drafting senior quarterbacks, and likes a body of production.

Here's another amazing Kellen Moore stat. He was only sacked 31 times in four years. Eight times a year. Less than once a game. From a guy that's not super mobile, but has pocket presence and feel that can't be taught. Something Rex does not have.

[The Robert Griffin Experience]

I'd draft Moore between the 4th-6th round no matter what we did with our 1st round QB. I think that he has the mental tools, the accuracy, and the work ethic, backed up by the college production to be a superstar. If he can improve his arm to at least above-average, then he could be the sleeper of the draft. At worst, we could trade him for a Schaub-like package. The height is of no concern to me - keep in mind Rex Grossman is only 0.02 meters taller. Maybe half an inch. His mobility is also ridiculously underrated - he's not Cutler, Griffin or Tannehill, but he's not Grossman either.

There are some real issues with him - his delivery mechanics aren't that great to say the least, and one of the things that Brees does is that he has a high release that allows him to play taller than his size. It also makes for a *slow* release. Moore is going to need a year or two to correct that, but in an ideal situation, he'll have plenty of time to do so.

I certainly wouldn't see him as our plan A QB, but he would be amazing value in the 4th or later, because the upside is so massive.

[Newera]

I'd draft Moore between the 4th-6th round no matter what we did with our 1st round QB. I think that he has the mental tools, the accuracy, and the work ethic, backed up by the college production to be a superstar. If he can improve his arm to at least above-average, then he could be the sleeper of the draft. At worst, we could trade him for a Schaub-like package. The height is of no concern to me - keep in mind Rex Grossman is only 0.02 meters taller. Maybe half an inch. His mobility is also ridiculously underrated - he's not Cutler, Griffin or Tannehill, but he's not Grossman either.

There are some real issues with him - his delivery mechanics aren't that great to say the least, and one of the things that Brees does is that he has a high release that allows him to play taller than his size. It also makes for a *slow* release. Moore is going to need a year or two to correct that, but in an ideal situation, he'll have plenty of time to do so.

I certainly wouldn't see him as our plan A QB, but he would be amazing value in the 4th or later, because the upside is so massive.

The issue with Kellen is how much do you want him. If you're thinking of waiting toward the sixth you won't get him. If Colt went in the third, you can bet he will probably go at least by the third. So, if you want him, you have to determine when to pull the trigger. A lot is going to do with his work outs. Does he improve his stock in his private workouts. You know he's going to kill the wonderlic. I think he's going to increase his stock when everything is said and done, and now with no Barkley it helps him.

---------- Post added December-24th-2011 at 01:40 AM ----------

Another good article on Kellen . . .

http://www.cbssports.com/collegefootball/story/16565008/averagesized-moore-leaves-boise-state-as-biggest-winner-in-fbs

Interesting what Dennis Erickson said about Kellen's arm.

[wysknz1]

Did I say every week? VT UGA and TCU may not be but Colorado State, Wyoming, Tulsa, and Wyoming aren't exactly BCS contenders.

what did Wyoming ever do to you that you had to mention them twice??? They've had some good teams (once in a while)

[Idaho fan]

I hate... loath BSU.. I live in the Donkey's back yard... I have watched many of the BSU games including the ones that weren't nationally televised.. I have admired Moore not only for what he has done on the field but off. He has always been a winner.. and lives in the film room... is one of the hardest working players at practice. He played at a small Washington HS and was only recruited by Idaho, BSU and Eastern WA... The son of a coach. He will impress NFL coaches in my opinion and impress in workouts and at the combine. I think he will be taken in the 3rd and possibly 2nd as I think some coaches will overlook his lack of size.

What is amazing is how accurate he is - and his decision making is as good as it gets. Just imagine if he was 6'-2"+... I don't want to have to root for Moore but I would be happy if the Skins somehow landed him in the 4th. Id hate to see him end up on a NFC E roster other than ours I know that.

[mistertim]

Look if the Shanahans liked Beck coming out and Mike liked Romo coming out, chances are they will like Moore.

What in the world does Shanahan liking Beck and Romo have to do with Moore? Both of those guys were bigger, more mobile, and had stronger arms. What exactly is the similarity with Moore, there?

[bowhunter]

What in the world does Shanahan liking Beck and Romo have to do with Moore? Both of those guys were bigger, more mobile, and had stronger arms. What exactly is the similarity with Moore, there?


So you're saying that Moore may be small, but he's slow?

[KDawg]

Moore is nothing like Tom Brady.


shorter, weaker am, and not tested in college weekly against good comp

I didn't say he was anything like Tom Brady, did I?

I said scouts didn't have Brady scouted all that high, and they knocked his frame and arm strength, too.

[Excited 4skins]

I would say that yeah Beck and Romo have stronger arms, but I'd rather have Moore - unproven or not - over Beck. Romo is in a higher class above either Beck or Moore, but at least Moore is extremely accurate and wins games.

[mistertim]

So you're saying that Moore may be small, but he's slow?

So all small guys are fast? I have watched him play plenty of times and while he is good at sliding around in the pocket, he isn't much of a threat to beat you with his legs.

[NewCliche21]

So all small guys are fast? I have watched him play plenty of times and while he is good at sliding around in the pocket, he isn't much of a threat to beat you with his legs.

Most people who are in sports need to have big bodies in order to compete in, well, anything.

The only advantage that a small person can potentially have is to be faster than others. That's why small guys who "make it" in sports are virtually always fast (Banks and Moss on our team alone). If Banks and Moss had every other quality that they have but ran a 4.7, then they would be writing on this board rather than being written about.

[Buck812]

I wonder if hes athletic and cordinated enough to play on stilts?

[NewCliche21]

I wonder if hes athletic and cordinated enough to play on stilts?

:ols: :ols:

Well done, that was an excellent critique.

[visionary]

I really like Moore. He's definitely one of my favorite college QBs of all time, maybe one of my favorite qbs period.
Also I've said for a while now that he reminds me of Brees a lot.
The accuracy and the oft mentoned lack of arm strength and the ability to spread the ball around like no other.
Also people may forget, but Brees was generally overlooked when it came to drafting.
I don't remember much talk of him at all before the draft, and most of it was negatives about his arm strength and how he would not be good at the next level.
Two differences I can think of between Brees and Moore.
Moore has played better overall and has obviously won a lot more games.
Brees on the other hand had better mobility, and was very quick outside the pocket.
I do wonder how Moore will hold up without a good o-line, because we haven't seen him in situations where he has to run around to avoid getting sacked a lot.
(then again few QBs succeed without a good line)

Now all that said, I don't expect him to go early. I think some team will pick him up in the mid-later rounds and will be very happy with what they get.
I think it will be interesting to see if he helps the starting qb of whatever team picks him, from the sidelines, while also soaking up the pro game next year.

[G.A.C.O.L.B.]

Don't know anything about him, but it seems there is a QB like him every year. Subpar physical attributes but "he's just a winner". Who's the last guy who fits that description who's actually panned out in the NFL? Can't think of one.

[BigRedskinDaddy]

Don't know anything about him, but it seems there is a QB like him every year. Subpar physical attributes but "he's just a winner". Who's the last guy who fits that description who's actually panned out in the NFL? Can't think of one.

Does Doug Flutie count? :pfft:

[bowhunter]

So all small guys are fast? I have watched him play plenty of times and while he is good at sliding around in the pocket, he isn't much of a threat to beat you with his legs.

Nope not saying that at all, just thought it was funny :-) I haven't seen much of the young man play, a few highlight videos and his bowl game against ASU. I don't think we need a QB who's a threat to run every play. I'm fine with "elusive"

[Newera]

What in the world does Shanahan liking Beck and Romo have to do with Moore? Both of those guys were bigger, more mobile, and had stronger arms. What exactly is the similarity with Moore, there?

There stats. Moore had better numbers over a more consistent period of time. Kellen does not get sacked. Don't discredit his pocket presence. Neither Beck nor Romo are giants. Sure Kellen is a bit smaller, but more than makes up that with intelligence, anticipation, pocket presence and instinct. Something, apparently, Beck lacks.

[ArmchairRedskin]

Here's Wes Bunting's take on him.


From a mental standpoint, Moore grades out about as high as you can in this area. He’s able to decipher information quickly, he’s a magician with his pre-snap reads and routinely finds secondary targets underneath and locates his hot man. He’s the son of a high school football coach, is a proven winner and has taken his team on the road, against adversity, and beaten some very good football programs. He’s a hard worker who puts in the time and because of that warrants a pick and a potential roster spot.

Impression: I see him more as a later round type pick/reserve only whose playing career will end up being closer to say a Koy Detmer type quarterback than a Drew Brees


You can read Wes' entire report on Moore here

http://www.nationalfootballpost.com/Prospect-of-the-day-Boise-State-QB-Kellen-Moore.html


People dont discout his intelligence or any of his abilities underneath at all, they just realize how limited his size, lack of mobility and weak arm make him. People are too easily fooled by college protection. Thats the bottom line.

[Shanny&Danny]

Moore will make a nice career of holding the clipboard and occasionally grabbing a Gatorade for the starting QB,but there's no way he's a starter in this league.

[CrabR]

If we had moore we would be leading our division. His arm strength is about as good as Grossman's . but he does not commit the turnovers and actually leads his receivers so they can run after the catch

I say we take him. I think we would have to use one of our 4th rounders to get him

[RonArtest15]

If we had moore we would be leading our division. His arm strength is about as good as Grossman's . but he does not commit the turnovers and actually leads his receivers so they can run after the catch

I say we take him. I think we would have to use one of our 4th rounders to get him

Arm strength about as good as Grossman's??? NO.

Koy Detmer comparison is spot on. He's a better version of Stefan LeFors.

[CrabR]

he would do better than grossman. From what i have seen he can throw about as far as grossman and neither can throw than far. Not saying he is our QB for teh next 10 years just better than Grossman and make a adequate backup

my thinking is to draft 2 Qbs. Didnt we draft Ferott same year we drafted Shuler. Didt Dalls draft Walsh and Aikman in the same year ?

[Newera]

I want Griffin or Luck, but I would settle for Moore. I really think he's going to surprise. And, I think those three are going to turn out to be the best in this draft.

[IrepDC]

Moore is nowhere near the athlete that Brees is. I get annoyed with that comparison. The only similarity I see is height.

[Newera]

Moore is nowhere near the athlete that Brees is. I get annoyed with that comparison. The only similarity I see is height.

The better comparison in how Moore plays stylistically, it's more like Montana. Certainly from an instinct, pocket presence feel and accuracy.

http://twitter.com/#!/RealSkipBayless/status/110198696729247744

[afkidd]

Kellen can throw 60+ yards when needed. See his 507 yard game against Hawaii or against Nevada last year. Threw a 60 yard bomb straight into the bread basket of Young. They would have been undefeated if the kicker made the kick (twice i might add) last year. There are plenty of examples of him putting zip on the ball or launching it with deadly accuracy, but most people are going to discount it because he played in non-BCS conferences.

He is going to be a solid starter in the NFL if he is given a chance. He's just too damn smart to not. And the touch he puts on the ball is retarded.

[El-Rey]

If we can't get Griffin, I think this it would be a very good play to go after Kellen Moore. The guy is an absolute winner and if it came down to choosing him over Landry Jones, I would do it in a heartbeat. Even if he turns out not to be an NFL-quality QB, then we will still have a full draft of picks to fill our other needs. QB is obviously a pressing need, but picking someone for the sake of it in the first round is not going to help us at all.

[FSUSkins24]

When I opened this thread I kind of expected to learn a little bit more about the guy. I don't watch Boise because I don't really care to watch them beat up on terrible teams.

I knew he was undersized, I just didn't realize HOW undersized he was. At 5'11 190 lbs. I wouldn't expect him to win a fight, much less continually get tackled by muscle bound DEs flying around the edge. There is a reason why there are "prototypical" QBs. If a 5'11 190 lb. QB could take the punishment required you'd see a lot more of them.

Comparing him to Montana, Brees, and Brady is asinine as well. Yeah there is always that chance he proves everybody wrong like those guys did. But those guys are the exception, not the rule.

If he's available in the 5th and the Shanahans wanna give him a shot... go for it. I just don't see how he could possibly be the franchise QB that everyone in Washington is dying for.

---------- Post added December-25th-2011 at 04:54 AM ----------

On a less serious note, he is an ugly *** kid with those Mr. Ed teeth. I would hate for that to be the face of the franchise.

[CrabR]

he is nowhere near Montana, Brees, and Brady calliber. He is just better than what we have. After thinking about it I would not use a 4th rather a 6th. I do not think we will take a QB in the 1st this year unless we trade up for RG3

[Thinking Skins]

Here's that list of the winningest QBs in college football. I've done a bit of searching and noticed that most were drafted, so if we want to look at the correlation between collegiate winning percentage and draftability, I'd say that Moore has a high probability of being drafted.

1. Colt McCoy, 45-8, 2006-2009, Texas
Drafted by the Cleveland Browns in the 3rd round (85th overall) of the 2010 NFL Draft.

2. Andy Dalton, 42-7, 2007-2010, TCU
Drafted by the Cincinnati Bengals in the 2nd round (35th overall) of the 2011 NFL Draft.

3. David Green, 42-10, 2001-2004, Georgia
drafted by the Seattle Seahawks in the third round of the 2005 NFL Draft

4. Peyton Manning, 39-6, 1994-1997, Tennessee
Drafted by the Indianapolis Colts in the 1st round (1st overall) of the 1998 NFL Draft.

5. Ken Dorsey, 38-2, 2000-2002, Miami
Drafted by the San Francisco 49ers in the 7th round (241st overall) of the 2003 NFL Draft.

6. Rick Leach, 38-8, 1975-1978, Notre Dame
Drafted by the Denver Broncos in the 5th round (132st overall) of the 1979 NFL Draft.

7. Matt Leinart, 37-2, 2003-2005, USC
Drafted by the Arizona Cardinals in the 1st round (10th overall) of the 2006 NFL Draft.

8. John Rauch, 36-8, 1945-1948, Georgia
Drafted by the Detroit Lions in the 1st round (2nd overall) of the 1949 NFL Draft.

9. Dan Lefevour, 36-15, 2006-2009, Central Michigan
drafted by the Chicago Bears in the sixth round of the 2010 NFL Draft

10. Chuck Ealey, 35-0, 1969-1971, Toledo
In 1972, Ealey signed with the Hamilton Tiger-Cats of the Canadian Football League (CFL)

11. Chad Pennington, 35-4, 1997-1999, Marshall
Drafted by the New York Jets in the 1st round (18th overall) of the 2000 NFL Draft

12. Jay Barker, 35-5, 1991-1994, Alabama
drafted in the 1995 NFL Draft in the fifth round by the Green Bay Packers

13. Tim Tebow, 35-6, 2006-2009, Florida
Drafted by the Denver Broncos in the 1st round (25th overall) of the 2010 NFL Draft

14. Eric Crouch, 35-7, 1998-2001, Nebraska
drafted by the St. Louis Rams of the NFL as a wide receiver

15. Chuck Long, 35-13, 1982-1985, Iowa
Drafted by the Detroit Lions in the 1st round (12th overall) of the 1986 NFL Draft.

---------- Post added December-25th-2011 at 09:14 AM ----------


Here is the list of winningest college QB's. Bump everyone down one and put Moore number one. Not exactly a who's who list Manning being the lone exception of course. A lot more failures in terms of NFL success with this list. A lot more.



1. Colt McCoy, 45-8, 2006-2009, Texas
2. Andy Dalton, 42-7, 2007-2010, TCU
3. David Green, 42-10, 2001-2004, Georgia
4. Peyton Manning, 39-6, 1994-1997, Tennessee
5. Ken Dorsey, 38-2, 2000-2002, Miami
6. Rick Leach, 38-8, 1975-1978, Notre Dame
7. Matt Leinart, 37-2, 2003-2005, USC
8. John Rauch, 36-8, 1945-1948, Georgia
9. Dan Lefevour, 36-15, 2006-2009, Central Michigan
10. Chuck Ealey, 35-0, 1969-1971, Toledo
11. Chad Pennington, 35-4, 1997-1999, Marshall
12. Jay Barker, 35-5, 1991-1994, Alabama
13. Tim Tebow, 35-6, 2006-2009, Florida
14. Eric Crouch, 35-7, 1998-2001, Nebraska
15. Chuck Long, 35-13, 1982-1985, Iowa

I'm not sure where to find this but it'd be nice to see something like completion percentage thrown in there as well as the wins because I see Chad Pennington and remember him being one of the most accurate passers in NFL history.

[Bat~man]

Here's that list of the winningest QBs in college football. I've done a bit of searching and noticed that most were drafted, so if we want to look at the correlation between collegiate winning percentage and draftability, I'd say that Moore has a high probability of being drafted.

1. Colt McCoy, 45-8, 2006-2009, Texas
Drafted by the Cleveland Browns in the 3rd round (85th overall) of the 2010 NFL Draft.

2. Andy Dalton, 42-7, 2007-2010, TCU
Drafted by the Cincinnati Bengals in the 2nd round (35th overall) of the 2011 NFL Draft.

3. David Green, 42-10, 2001-2004, Georgia
drafted by the Seattle Seahawks in the third round of the 2005 NFL Draft

4. Peyton Manning, 39-6, 1994-1997, Tennessee
Drafted by the Indianapolis Colts in the 1st round (1st overall) of the 1998 NFL Draft.

5. Ken Dorsey, 38-2, 2000-2002, Miami
Drafted by the San Francisco 49ers in the 7th round (241st overall) of the 2003 NFL Draft.

6. Rick Leach, 38-8, 1975-1978, Notre Dame
Drafted by the Denver Broncos in the 5th round (132st overall) of the 1979 NFL Draft.

7. Matt Leinart, 37-2, 2003-2005, USC
Drafted by the Arizona Cardinals in the 1st round (10th overall) of the 2006 NFL Draft.

8. John Rauch, 36-8, 1945-1948, Georgia
Drafted by the Detroit Lions in the 1st round (2nd overall) of the 1949 NFL Draft.

9. Dan Lefevour, 36-15, 2006-2009, Central Michigan
drafted by the Chicago Bears in the sixth round of the 2010 NFL Draft

10. Chuck Ealey, 35-0, 1969-1971, Toledo
In 1972, Ealey signed with the Hamilton Tiger-Cats of the Canadian Football League (CFL)

11. Chad Pennington, 35-4, 1997-1999, Marshall
Drafted by the New York Jets in the 1st round (18th overall) of the 2000 NFL Draft

12. Jay Barker, 35-5, 1991-1994, Alabama
drafted in the 1995 NFL Draft in the fifth round by the Green Bay Packers

13. Tim Tebow, 35-6, 2006-2009, Florida
Drafted by the Denver Broncos in the 1st round (25th overall) of the 2010 NFL Draft

14. Eric Crouch, 35-7, 1998-2001, Nebraska
drafted by the St. Louis Rams of the NFL as a wide receiver

15. Chuck Long, 35-13, 1982-1985, Iowa
Drafted by the Detroit Lions in the 1st round (12th overall) of the 1986 NFL Draft.

---------- Post added December-25th-2011 at 09:14 AM ----------



I'm not sure where to find this but it'd be nice to see something like completion percentage thrown in there as well as the wins because I see Chad Pennington and remember him being one of the most accurate passers in NFL history.

Wow, Take out Manning and that list is full of busts to average QBs. Dalton may prove to be another good one by the time it's all said and done. This actually goes against Moore.

Some people are just easily wow'd, a blue field and pretty stats automatically means NFL franchise QB to them. These are the reasons why I'm happy fans have NO say in choosing our players.

Moore would get crushed in Arena League Football...

[KDawg]

Some people are just easily wow'd, a blue field and pretty stats automatically means NFL franchise QB to them. These are the reasons why I'm happy fans have NO say in choosing our players.

..

This is wrong for a variety of reasons, not the least of which is your assumption that people are wow'ed by Moore because of a 'blue field and pretty stats'.

Kellen Moore is a very, very smart quarterback. He makes great reads, anticipates defenders movements and hits the open receiver. He's over a 5:1 TD:INT ratio. You don't get that by accident or by being unable to read a defense. While it's true he didn't face SEC talent week after week, he had solid production against top 25 teams each and every time he played them. He's a leader. He doesn't rely on physical traits to make a play, ala JaMarcus Russell, and he's going to put the time in. Yes, he's a bit undersized, and his arm strength isn't quite there, but I'd say people like Moore for a lot more reasons than you give him credit for.

In fact, I'm somewhat surprised to see you say something like that. You're better than that.

Your comment, by the way, is easily reversible. "Some people are just easily wow'ed". Yes - I'd say so. With physical traits. Ryan Leaf had all the tools but he was a melon head. JaMarcus Russell had some of the best tools ever, but he managed to bust out because he couldn't put down the fork.

Moore is a good quarterback, and I think he has a bright future, but not because he plays on a blue field :)

---------- Post added December-25th-2011 at 10:35 AM ----------

For the record, I've said it before and I'll say it again.... Do you know why Tom Brady wasn't a high draft pick? Because of his physical traits and a weak arm.

Moore isn't Tom Brady by any means, and nor am I implying that. Just saying, some times physical traits aren't the end all be all.

[wysknz1]

---------- Post added December-25th-2011 at 04:54 AM ----------

[/COLOR]On a less serious note, he is an ugly *** kid with those Mr. Ed teeth. I would hate for that to be the face of the franchise.



John Elway?

[AsiaticSkinsFan]

I didn't say he was anything like Tom Brady, did I?

I said scouts didn't have Brady scouted all that high, and they knocked his frame and arm strength, too.
so then you compared the two.


Brady is at least 3 inches taller, played against better comp consistently, etc.

If Moore is drafted, it will be 6th or 7th round. Using a 3rd or 4th round pick on him, like some have suggested on here, is crazy.

[KDawg]

so then you compared the two.

I did no such thing.

I said they both were knocked for their arm strength and size. Which is true.


If Moore is drafted, it will be 6th or 7th round. Using a 3rd or 4th round pick on him, like some have suggested on here, is crazy.

I agree with the above.

[Shanny&Danny]

Moore is tiny,he will be on IR after after the first hit by an NFL DE or LB.

[FSUSkins24]

John Elway?

Haha touche

[Newera]

When I opened this thread I kind of expected to learn a little bit more about the guy. I don't watch Boise because I don't really care to watch them beat up on terrible teams.

I knew he was undersized, I just didn't realize HOW undersized he was. At 5'11 190 lbs. I wouldn't expect him to win a fight, much less continually get tackled by muscle bound DEs flying around the edge. There is a reason why there are "prototypical" QBs. If a 5'11 190 lb. QB could take the punishment required you'd see a lot more of them.

Comparing him to Montana, Brees, and Brady is asinine as well. Yeah there is always that chance he proves everybody wrong like those guys did. But those guys are the exception, not the rule.

If he's available in the 5th and the Shanahans wanna give him a shot... go for it. I just don't see how he could possibly be the franchise QB that everyone in Washington is dying for.

---------- Post added December-25th-2011 at 04:54 AM ----------

On a less serious note, he is an ugly *** kid with those Mr. Ed teeth. I would hate for that to be the face of the franchise.

In regard to Brady, Brees and Montana, they weren't the exception to the rule when they were in college. Which is why they all went later. The point, he (Kellen Moore) still carved up good teams (Georgia, Tech, Oregon) at the same size he's always been. People put too much stock in size and not enough in heart and instinct for the game. The kid can throw.

[ACW]

In regard to Brady, Brees and Montana, they weren't the exception to the rule when they were in college. Which is why they all went later. The point, he still carved up good teams at the same size he's always been. People put too much stock in size and not enough in heart. The kid can throw.Yeah. He may not have the physical tools, but give me someone like him over someone like JaMarcus Russell, who had the physical tools but lacked the heart and intelligence.

[Newera]

Wow, Take out Manning and that list is full of busts to average QBs. Dalton may prove to be another good one by the time it's all said and done. This actually goes against Moore.

Some people are just easily wow'd, a blue field and pretty stats automatically means NFL franchise QB to them. These are the reasons why I'm happy fans have NO say in choosing our players.

Moore would get crushed in Arena League Football...

Yeah, let's pick Gabbert. He's big and has a strong arm. Let's pick Tannenhill who's played for a year and a half. Or, Weeden who's a year and a half younger then Beck. That's when busts happen. With Barkley out, what are our options.

So far the best quarterback coming out of the last draft is Andy Dalton who went in the second round, in a lesser conference mind you, just like Kellen. Kellen's number where also a whole lot better than Daltons, by the way. Kellen was also 1 and 1 against Andy. What's Kellen, an inch shorter than our present quarterback. Even Theisman wasn't a giant. Brees is the standard for smaller quarterbacks today. To cast Kellen off strictly because of size is well . . . ignorant and naive, that's when mistakes happen. Look at his body of work. Look at his intangibles.

Is college different than the NFL? Of course. But Kellen's body of work is remarkable, which is all you can go on. He also won. After all, isn't that what's most important. Not a lot of the other quarterbacks can say that. We saw what happened to Colt Brennan when he went up against Georgia in a Bowl game. It wasn't good. Georgia defeated Hawai 41–10. Brennan completed 22-of-38 for 169 yards, while throwing three interceptions. On the other hand, Kellen against Georgia went 28 for 34 for 261 yards,1 pick, 3 touchdowns, and quarterback rating of 170. Yup big athletic Georgia.

Wait, didn't Georgia play for the SEC championship this year. They actually played decently against LSU until Tyran took over midway in the third quarter.

To knock a guy that won 50 games and only had three loses by a total of five points, and never trailed by more than seven points his entire career, is a silly attempt to discredit what the kid did in his four years. The colleges that passed on him for the 6.3" prospects that became, well, not much because he looked "To small." Well, who got the last laugh? The Moores. Don't be surprised if the same thing happens in the NFL.

We will see with him. I'm a believer and is the best pure quarterback prospect I've seen in a long time when it comes to playing the position. Sure he will need to get a little stronger and will. If he turns out to be a stud, (which I believe he will) remember you heard it from me. If he doesn't, I will admit I missed. However, I trust my eyes when it comes to Kellen. The kid can play.

Like I've said, if we can't get RG3, who I believe will end up in Cleveland, I'm in favor of trading down and stockpiling picks and picking Moore in the process. But that' s me. Merry Christmas. More Kellen fodder . . .

http://www.aolnews.com/2010/09/23/kellen-moore-the-megahumble-megastar/

[FSUSkins24]

In regard to Brady, Brees and Montana, they weren't the exception to the rule when they were in college. Which is why they all went later.

I'm not sure what your point is here. I don't believe Kellen Moore is a bad QB in the college game. I don't even believe he is undersized for college football. I believe he is undersized for the NFL.


The point, he (Kellen Moore) still carved up good teams (Georgia, Tech, Oregon) at the same size he's always been.

I get what you're trying to say, but that still doesn't mean he'll cut it in the NFL. Those Georgia, Tech, and Oregon teams aren't composed of NFL prospects. They may have 3-6 that will enter the draft at the end of the year, but most of them will have to find jobs within their college major.

The NFL is made up of the biggest, baddest, most football smart players from the college game AND most of them are many steps ahead of Moore.

You can't teach size. That's why people put an emphasis on it. Somebody earlier said something to the effect of "if he can put on 20 lbs. of muscle" ...right. I worked as an intern for a D1AA football strength and conditioning program and you don't just put on 20 lbs. of muscle in a matter of months. Not even with steroids.

The bottom line is that many coaches will just look at his measurables and peg him as a backup QB. That's just how it is.

[bowhunter]

[/COLOR]On a less serious note, he is an ugly *** kid with those Mr. Ed teeth. I would hate for that to be the face of the franchise.

Have you seen this kids smile? I've carved jack-o-lanterns with prettier teeth.

https://encrypted-tbn2.google.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcSbA1o3QMCfpcDCahvPqwtXit_mj4M0p cXOsBu_ty-45gWcYX5M

But that said, after they put on a helmet and mouthguard in, they can still look pretty good throwing 3 TD passes a game

[Newera]

Dennis Erickson on Kellen Moore in the NFL

http://www.kivitv.com/sports/136195783.html

This coming from a former NFL coach. So it ain't just me.

---------- Post added December-25th-2011 at 11:52 PM ----------


I'm not sure what your point is here. I don't believe Kellen Moore is a bad QB in the college game. I don't even believe he is undersized for college football. I believe he is undersized for the NFL.

I get what you're trying to say, but that still doesn't mean he'll cut it in the NFL. Those Georgia, Tech, and Oregon teams aren't composed of NFL prospects. They may have 3-6 that will enter the draft at the end of the year, but most of them will have to find jobs within their college major.

The NFL is made up of the biggest, baddest, most football smart players from the college game AND most of them are many steps ahead of Moore.

You can't teach size. That's why people put an emphasis on it. Somebody earlier said something to the effect of "if he can put on 20 lbs. of muscle" ...right. I worked as an intern for a D1AA football strength and conditioning program and you don't just put on 20 lbs. of muscle in a matter of months. Not even with steroids.

The bottom line is that many coaches will just look at his measurables and peg him as a backup QB. That's just how it is.

Well keep being fixated on his size and miss out on a good quarterback. He will go earlier than so called people "Fans" and so called NFL draftniks think.

And more . . .

http://www.lvrj.com/sports/flawed-system-kept-moore-from-ultimate-goal-136131278.html

[thedoc4454]

Drew Brees -6'
The Sex Cannon - 6'1"
Sonny Jergenson - 6'
Joe T 6'
The Dog Killer 5'11"

Really, why not just drop the height issue? At this point it's embarrassing.

[G.A.C.O.L.B.]

Does Doug Flutie count? :pfft:

Lol, swear to God, when I was thinking about it later on, he was the ONE name I came up with. And it only took him 15 years to find success in the NFL.

[Newera]

Personally after Kellen works out (and teams realize he has more arm strength then advertised) and meets with coordinators and coaches, he will increase his stock. Plus, you know he's going to crush the wonderlic. It will be interesting to see how he does in the senior bowl.

Protect him and he will shred defenses. He has all his life.