This is Hughes last season with Wiz

[Newera]

He just doesn't fit the offense. He's too much of a selfish iso player like Stack. I think the team will move Hayes to two and will try and resign Juan. Plus, Huges is looking for a big contract. They can sigh Juan for less money -- plus Juan won't mind coming off the bench.

Hughes just doesn't fit the scheme -- and it's not like he's trying to fit it either. Whereas, Arenas is making an effort.

[Zen-like Todd]

Kind of silly in retrospect that we didnt pick up the option on Juan's contract, and now he's making us all look stupid.

[Buford]

They can always give him a new contract before the season is over.

[Zen-like Todd]

Originally posted by Son of Sniglet
They can always give him a new contract before the season is over.


The option was very cheap though.

[Fatty P For The Pulitzer]

Hughes would make interesting trade bait if they really don't want to re-sign him. However, there was something in the Post a few weeks ago about how Grunfeld wants to re-sign him after the season and Hughes said he wants to come back. Hayes won't start (except in cases of injury or suspensions) until he can create his own shots.

[DSF]

How do we not pick up the option on this kid? He leaves his heart on the floor every game and can clearly score in the NBA.

Now when we get Blake back, we're going to see a LOT of improvement from him to the point where Juan will only be on the floor for like 5 mins a game if that.

As for not re-signing Hughes? I disagree, He'll be back, I just hope its at a reasonable price because Kwame is going to be the one who gets the maxed out contract on this team.

[monkey66]

I must say I agree with you even though it is very early. Lets see how things progress down the road...

Regardless of Hughes performance, if Juan keeps playing like he has Ernie will not let him walk...

[Gamebreaker]

Funny how two games have erased all the widely held concerns about Juan from last season. For instance, his lack of size, inability to bring the ball up the court, and his penchant for taking ill-advised shots in pressure situations.

I'll admit he's looked great so far, but he has to be more consistent than two games to prove to me that we don't need Hughes.

[Alvin_Walton40]

I remeber reading that Mgt. felt that signing Dixon would hamper them from signing the other teams free agents - like giving Haywood 25 million for ???? - HUGE MISTAKE! another f'up by the Wiz. File that away with the other huge f'ups by the Wiz.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/articles/A12564-2004Oct30.html

[Buford]

Originally posted by Zen-like Todd



The option was very cheap though.

it was only for 1 more year.

I think he's worth alittle more on a longer deal, and I think he'll take a reasonable deal to stay in a city where his family and friends are, and how popular he is.

[mhd24]

Juan can't be given more minutes. When he is in the game, it forces Arenas to guard the 2-guards because Juan can't guard shooting guards. What is he going to do when the Wizards play Boston with Pierce, Davis, Welsh, and even Payton? They will just post him up. Hughes is better player than Dixon in every aspect of the game. Plus, he's YOUNGER too.

[Buford]

Sometimes you need to look at a guy beyond his "talent"

Even Eddie Jordan said after that game last night.... "He's too small...etc, etc.....but he plays big"


Juan Dixon has something that guys like Darrell Green and Fred Smoot have. Heart

Maybe he won't be a starter in the NBA. But he'll be a good team guy with a lot of heart, and desire to win.

[Gamebreaker]

Heart isn't going to stop Baron Davis from posting him up and abusing him all game long. I like the guy, but he has obvious limitations that the whole league will try to exploit.

[Zen-like Todd]

We would be 0-2 without him.

[SAMB0]

Originally posted by Gamebreaker
Heart isn't going to stop Baron Davis from posting him up and abusing him all game long. I like the guy, but he has obvious limitations that the whole league will try to exploit.

Good Thing Baron is in the West now and We wont have that problem that much

[mhd24]

The east has many more guards of qulaity:

1) Francis
2) Marbury
3) Wade
4) Redd
5) Kidd
6) Pierce
7) Davis
8) Billups
9) Iverson
10) Carter
11) Crawford
12) Mason
13) Payton

[DonMagicJuan]

this wont be his last season, its Juan's last season with us tho...i doubt they let go of both hughes and dixon....

[hands11]

Originally posted by Gamebreaker
Funny how two games have erased all the widely held concerns about Juan from last season. For instance, his lack of size, inability to bring the ball up the court, and his penchant for taking ill-advised shots in pressure situations.

I'll admit he's looked great so far, but he has to be more consistent than two games to prove to me that we don't need Hughes.

What are talking about ?

his lack of size, inability to bring the ball up the court, and his penchant for taking ill-advised shots in pressure situations.


He hasnt had a problem bring the ball up court and he doenst take as many ill advized shots as some other players. He actually doesnt both of these things better the Gil or Hughes. And he makes a bunch of the ones he takes. His only problem may be is lack of size but there are players smaller who are effective.

Iverson is 6' 165
Jaun is 6'3 164

At least Juan has the frame to but on some weight over then next year or 2 if that is a problem. Right now he is about quickness and speed.

[fixer26er]

Originally posted by DSF
How do we not pick up the option on this kid? He leaves his heart on the floor every game and can clearly score in the NBA.


Just seems like it was a numbers game. While Juan is playing GREAT, if all the guards on the team plays like they are capable of playing, then who do you play him over?

Although it is just one game, I agree that Hughes looked a bit selfish against Charlotte. Let's wait about 10-15 games before we write him off. If he still appears to be playing for a contract AND Hayes it still going strong then I say lets shop him around.

I know a team in the Western Conference that may be looking for a guard and they may be willing to pony up the likes of(one, maybe two, but not all three): Nene, Skita, Rodney White.

I'd be willing to look into that deal if he wasn't working out in the good old Princeton offense.

[fixer26er]

Originally posted by Alvin_Walton40
I remeber reading that Mgt. felt that signing Dixon would hamper them from signing the other teams free agents - like giving Haywood 25 million for ???? - HUGE MISTAKE! another f'up by the Wiz. File that away with the other huge f'ups by the Wiz.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/articles/A12564-2004Oct30.html

That was a great signing. He would have commanded double that on the market. While Haywood is no all-star caliber center yet, he is a better player than Adonal Foyle, Brian Cardinal and Mark Blount. They all got $40 million dollar deals last summer.


He has shown steady improvement and came into camp in GREAT shape and followed that up with a solid preseason. You think in a league lacking legit 7 footers with some talent that some team won't throw money at a 25 year old center who will probably average close to a double-double with a couple of blocks this season?

[js79]

hughes plays good defense, doesnt he? which juan isn't too great at.. i mean he's good at getting steals but heads up defense, he's a big liability..

i could be wrong, just an opinion

[Gamebreaker]

Originally posted by hands11


What are talking about ?

his lack of size, inability to bring the ball up the court, and his penchant for taking ill-advised shots in pressure situations.


He hasnt had a problem bring the ball up court and he doenst take as many ill advized shots as some other players. He actually doesnt both of these things better the Gil or Hughes. And he makes a bunch of the ones he takes. His only problem may be is lack of size but there are players smaller who are effective.

Iverson is 6' 165
Jaun is 6'3 164

At least Juan has the frame to but on some weight over then next year or 2 if that is a problem. Right now he is about quickness and speed.

The knock on Juan has always been that he's a tweener. He doesn't have the ball handling skills to run the point effectively, nor is he a "pass first" type of player. He also isn't big enough to be effective on defense at the 2. This is common knowledge, and every sportswriter who has ever covered the Wiz has said it from time to time. Also, weren't you one of his major detractors last season? My how does two games change one's opinion.

Last season Juan Dixon was taking more shots a game than our starting power forward, Kwame Brown. When Juan is not a starter, that is a big problem and quite a few people had a problem with it. Why is everyone pretending like two games erases all of that?

I also don't understand why people are being so defensive of him. I never said he couldn't be a good player. Yet to say he's a better player, or a better player for this team than Hughes is just false. Period. Hughes is better player in every area you can think of, except possibly three point shooting. Regardless, that one aspect is not enough to change what is obvious. Hughes is the starter and Juan is the backup because Hughes is simply the better player. If not, I'm sure Eddie Jordan would have no problem inserting Dixon as the starter.

[Gamebreaker]

Also, to even compare Dixon to Iverson is laughable. AI can create off the dribble, Dixon can't. AI is also a better passer and a better defender despite his size. As far as being a team player, Juan has him beat there. But that's it.

[hands11]

Originally posted by fixer26er


Just seems like it was a numbers game. While Juan is playing GREAT, if all the guards on the team plays like they are capable of playing, then who do you play him over?

Although it is just one game, I agree that Hughes looked a bit selfish against Charlotte. Let's wait about 10-15 games before we write him off. If he still appears to be playing for a contract AND Hayes it still going strong then I say lets shop him around.

I know a team in the Western Conference that may be looking for a guard and they may be willing to pony up the likes of(one, maybe two, but not all three): Nene, Skita, Rodney White.

I'd be willing to look into that deal if he wasn't working out in the good old Princeton offense.

What ever guard gets traded, trade them for a draft pick or a true star PG.

[hands11]

Originally posted by Gamebreaker


The knock on Juan has always been that he's a tweener. He doesn't have the ball handling skills to run the point effectively, nor is he a "pass first" type of player. He also isn't big enough to be effective on defense at the 2. This is common knowledge, and every sportswriter who has ever covered the Wiz has said it from time to time. Also, weren't you one of his major detractors last season? My how does two games change one's opinion.

Last season Juan Dixon was taking more shots a game than our starting power forward, Kwame Brown. When Juan is not a starter, that is a big problem and quite a few people had a problem with it. Why is everyone pretending like two games erases all of that?

I also don't understand why people are being so defensive of him. I never said he couldn't be a good player. Yet to say he's a better player, or a better player for this team than Hughes is just false. Period. Hughes is better player in every area you can think of, except possibly three point shooting. Regardless, that one aspect is not enough to change what is obvious. Hughes is the starter and Juan is the backup because Hughes is simply the better player. If not, I'm sure Eddie Jordan would have no problem inserting Dixon as the starter.

I was defending him against your statement that he is a bad ball handler. I think he handles it better then Gil and he start the offence better. Im not saying he is better then Gil or Hughes in all areas. They are all different players. Im just saying what he is good at and comparing his liabilitiy to other small players who are stars. We have a log jam. Proven big dollar contracts will start. Hughes can drive and get fouled and can shot. Gil has talent but is inconsistant. Im thankful we have so much talent to choose from. The only thing I thing I ever said bad about Dixon was that he would be squezed out in a numbers game because we had to many other players who can play guard. I used Juan as and example of the kind of HEART players we needed here. Like ETAN, Blake and now Ruffin and Jamison.

[hands11]

Originally posted by Gamebreaker
Also, to even compare Dixon to Iverson is laughable. AI can create off the dribble, Dixon can't. AI is also a better passer and a better defender despite his size. As far as being a team player, Juan has him beat there. But that's it.

Your black and white analysis is annoying. Im was comparing his size and the fact the small players can be effective. Of course he isnt Iverson. Juan can be effective and he can get a lot better. He hasnt had consistent minutes to develop here so who knows how good he can get. When he did, he played well to great. He didnt come into the league like Iverson with a mandate to takeover and shot. He didnt play 40 min a game for several years. Only time will tell what he can do, but it probably wont happen here because he isnt going to get the time to develop in the near future. I project he will stick around in this league. He will get better, and bigger. For now, he is a roll player and insurance if someone gets hurt.

We are just future telling. Thats what some of us here do. Anyone can state what someone does after they do it. We are talking about the what ifs. What is possible. Spoting the glimpes of talent as they reveal themselve. What a player may develop into given the intangables. All you do is bash players like Haywood, Kwame, Dixon, Jefferies, etc until they are actually doing something on a consistent basis, or riding the glory boys like Gil.

[Gamebreaker]

Originally posted by hands11

All you do is bash players like Haywood, Kwame, Dixon, Jefferies, etc until they are actually doing something on a consistent basis, or riding the glory boys like Gil.

Apparently you haven't paid any attention to my posts. When have I ever bashed Kwame? Please find that post, although you will be wasting your time. I've always expected Kwame to eventually live up to his potential, and I've never called him a bust. I was one of the few people who pointed out how he was really developing on time when you compare him to Jermaine O'Neal, Tracy McGrady and other high schoolers who went pro. The only problem was Kwame got so much attention since he was Michael Jordan's first draft pick, the first high schooler to ever be picked first overall, and was so raw and insecure he couldn't take the pressure.

I've bashed Haywood because a guy his size shouldn't play anywhere near as soft as he does. I've bashed Dixon because of the bad decision-making and bad defense he's played, and I will continue to bash Jeffries because he continues to prove to be a wasted first round pick. We could've signed an undrafted free agent to do what Jeffries does for us, which is a step above nothing.

As far as "riding the glory boys", I have no favorites on this team and even if I did Arenas would definitely not be one of them. I love his intensity and competitiveness, but it usually shows in all the wrong ways. Yet I don't bash him as much as I do the others because he's a steady contributor to this team and is actually taking time out to focus on becoming a better PG. I'm still not impressed with his turnover ratio, but he provides us with the best chance of winning if he can develop into more of a game manager than just a plain scoring threat.

[EvilMonkeyBoy]

Originally posted by fixer26er


That was a great signing. He would have commanded double that on the market. While Haywood is no all-star caliber center yet, he is a better player than Adonal Foyle, Brian Cardinal and Mark Blount. They all got $40 million dollar deals last summer.


He has shown steady improvement and came into camp in GREAT shape and followed that up with a solid preseason. You think in a league lacking legit 7 footers with some talent that some team won't throw money at a 25 year old center who will probably average close to a double-double with a couple of blocks this season?

Haywood is not better than Brian Cardinal and Mark Blount. Blount is already a reliable Double-Double a night Center, which is a feat in the east, he even had a 20-20 game last season, a feat I doubt Haywood has come close to. As for Cardinal, I'd rather be paying 40 million for a guy who can get you 10+ a night and make a clutch shot anytime you need it then whatever it is Haywood provides.

I doubt Haywood is suddenly going to become a double-double threat.

[Newera]

I 'm not saying Hughes is a bad player. In fact, he's a very talented player. The question is he necessarily a good fit for this team. Time will tell.

For instance, Areanas is more a scoring point guard then a distributing point guard, much like Wade. He can create his shot. Juan's game is more off transition and spot up shooting, which fits Arenas game better then Hughes.

For instance the way Eddie Jones was spotting up for those three's that put the game away against the Heat. They all came from dishes from Wade. That's more Juans game then Hughes.

Think about it, in the first half against the Heat, Gil was not shooting. He was playing distributor and we were down.

In the second half he got more in a scoring mode and the team game back. Actually Hughes did play well in that game also.

I'm just talking more from a chemistry mode then a pure talent mode. Detroit showed last year in the finals that chemistry can win over talent. The pieces have to fit.

We are fortunate to have such talent. However, a decision will be made. Juan is probably the odd man out, but he can make the decision difficult. And knowing Juan, he will. He has always been doubted and I think he really uses that as motivation.

When I heard he worked out with Ray Lewis of the Ravens this summer and worked on his ball handling, that told me a lot. He's handling the ball much better. His handle this year seems more natural then awkward like it had been.

This argument will go go back and forth all year. Both are free agents.

[REDALERT]

Some very good points people. And I have to agree about the haywood issue. Haywood is soft for a big man his size, kind of reminds me of Ralph Dalton that played for Georgetown with Patrick Ewing.


Also, the players are calling him hulk now. I'm not sure how long they're been calling him that. But if it started this year, it's because Haywood didalot of working out during the off season. But IMO, just because you were working out and gained some bulk doesn't constitute any change in the way you play the game.

So, with Haywood. I would have waited until this guy has proven he's worked and improved on his game not his bulk so he could be called the hulk.


And Juan Dixon. IMO, Juan will get better as time progress. Especially in his playing time. Sometimes you need guys like Juan dixon on the team. And if he could be signed to backup the rest of the guards then so be it,

[SAMB0]

now down the line i say.. no

[mh83]

Quiet haters 33 should of had 34 points as he made a 3 pointer. Point blank Hughes simply "got his eagle on" and took control of this game, not to many guards could do what he did today, and his decisonmaking and defense have improved rapidly.

Sshhhhhhhhh....quiet haters

[fixer26er]

Originally posted by EvilMonkeyBoy


Haywood is not better than Brian Cardinal and Mark Blount. Blount is already a reliable Double-Double a night Center, which is a feat in the east, he even had a 20-20 game last season, a feat I doubt Haywood has come close to. As for Cardinal, I'd rather be paying 40 million for a guy who can get you 10+ a night and make a clutch shot anytime you need it then whatever it is Haywood provides.

I doubt Haywood is suddenly going to become a double-double threat.

Do you like your crow heated up or cold? Don't forget that he is one of the league leaders in blocked shots as well.

Big deal about Blount's 20-20 game last year. Didn't help him much this year when Wood dominated him in the paint did it?

Haywood has made clutch buckets down the stretch, not to mention blocked shots and grabbed big rebounds in crunch time. What has Brian Cardinal done? Do you actually believe The Logo, or any other GM with half a brain, wouldn't swap Cardinal for Haywood? Haywood is a superior player to Cardinal. It's an open and shut case.

[Newera]

Hey,

I started this thread, and I have to admit, Hughes is making me eat crow. It seems the big three are blending into a nich mesh. Larry is by far our best one on one player. He has immense athleticism. It's good to see him have ten assist. Maybe he's seeing the value of ball distribution.

He and Jamison are turning into money. Geez, we are the Golden State Warriors west.

[fixer26er]

Originally posted by Newera
Hey,

I started this thread, and I have to admit, Hughes is making me eat crow. It seems the big three are blending into a nich mesh. Larry is by far our best one on one player. He has immense athleticism. It's good to see him have ten assist. Maybe he's seeing the value of ball distribution.

He and Jamison are turning into money. Geez, we are the Golden State Warriors west.

Actually, I was referring to the Haywood comments, with the whole crow eating thing. Sorry about that, perhaps I should have started a B. Haywood thread.

I was with you when I replied to this post earlier. I agreed that he was playing selfish basketball and his only concern was getting paid next year. I also said that we should wait 10-15 games to see if he kept it up. I was wrong. I would have to say he has probably been the Wizards best all-around player the last five games or so. He's also making players around him better. At first I thought the change in Haywood could be attributed to his buddy Jamison playing next to him. But after watching the last couple of games it's obvious that Hughes, more than anyone else, is determined to get Haywood involved and confident.

It's just a shame he doesn't get any respect around the league. Hopefully, his first career triple-double opened some eyes. Maybe the refs will start giving him a call or two.

It's nice to know that we have players who are maturing into legit NBA players right before our eyes and that they would actually like to stay in Washington and build this team into a winner.

[jbooma]

do you still think hughes is leaving :D

i think he loves it here now :cheers:

[fdarugar]

Wow! I can't believe all the Larry Hughes hating that is going on. Juan Dixon couldn't hold Hughes' jock for one night. I think Hughes is the teams MVP this year because he does it on both ends of the court, if it came down to who I would rather max out a contract for, it would be Hughes over Kwame. Larry Hughes is definately a rising star in this league, one that can't be let go of.

[VMAN911]

GETTING RID OF HUGHS WOULD BE SILLY AND DOWNRIGHT DUMB THE GUY IS A PLAYMAKER, HAS NICE SIZE, A GOOD DEFENDER AND THE TYPE OF PLAYER YOU WANT ON YOUR TEAM. NO WAY DO WE GET RID OF HUGHS