WE: After school shooting in Connecticut, Piers Morgan blasts America’s ‘gun madness’

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Originally Posted by MattFancy

What are you hunting that you need an AR-15?

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People who are unfamiliar with guns, and some who are, think of the AR-15 as this evil black super weapon. The truth is the the AR-15 is an incredibly versatile and modular weapon system. It can be chambered in anything from rimfire .22LR to .50 Beowulf. It can be fitted with long or short barrels. It is able to accept any type of sight you would like to put on a gun, from standard iron sights to high powered scopes. That versatility is part of what makes the AR-15 so popular.

The people who hunt with AR rifles are not going out in the woods and blasting away. Pumping dozens of rounds into poor fluffy bunnies. Their rifles are tailored to the game being hunted. The AR platform has two parts, an "upper" and a "lower". The "upper" has the barrel and determines the type of round that can be fired. The "lower" houses the trigger group. The "lower" is what is considered the gun, it has the serial number. A hunter that hunts different types of game with an AR can own one "lower" and several "uppers" in different calibers. They can then swap the "uppers" depending on what they are hunting. To swap "uppers" all you have to do is pull two pins. For many this is preferable to buying complete rifles for every caliber, not to mention potentially cheaper. In states that allow it, an AR-15 can be a legitimate choice for hunters.

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Originally Posted by twa

deleted.

How do you realistically expect to limit ammo?.

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You can't limit ammo. Thousands of gun owners already use reloaded ammo. They can do it themselves. If sales of all ammunition ceased tomorrow...people with guns would just buy ammunition from all those that have the means to produce it. Kind of like dope now. You create a black market for ammunition, and people would pay exorbitant amounts of money to get it.

We are losing the war on drugs right? Most people who are anti-gun, are also against the "war on drugs" because it's not accomplishing anything. Right? What did prohibition teach us? If there is a demand, even if you make it illegal...people will still find a way.

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Originally Posted by twa

a unrealistic one though,kinda like the bullet ones.
I do agree it would force the nuts to change tactics if you managed to remove all those existing weapons and could get it passed.
but their next choice could very easily be more deadly....ya'll might want to consider that

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Well, it's a bright line rule that can be enforced, it allows continued use of weapons for self defense, hunting, and target practice. I admit that it is politically unrealistic now, but so is reforming social security, and we talk about that all the time. But political will can change, and while I don't think the time is ripe for something like this right now, I think this is the sort of reform that we are (and should be heading to). As for enforcement, that's another issue, but guns would be much easier to regulate than alcohol and drugs, mostly because we are the world's #1 producer. Mexico isn't the one that's making our guns and importing them here. As far as their next choice being more deadly, what are you actually talking about? Snipers? You don't seriously think that nut case murderers are going to develop some new technology do you?

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Originally Posted by autoidiodyssey

People who are unfamiliar with guns, and some who are, think of the AR-15 as this evil black super weapon. The truth is the the AR-15 is an incredibly versatile and modular weapon system. It can be chambered in anything from rimfire .22LR to .50 Beowulf. It can be fitted with long or short barrels. It is able to accept any type of sight you would like to put on a gun, from standard iron sights to high powered scopes. That versatility is part of what makes the AR-15 so popular.

The people who hunt with AR rifles are not going out in the woods and blasting away. Pumping dozens of rounds into poor fluffy bunnies. Their rifles are tailored to the game being hunted. The AR platform has two parts, an "upper" and a "lower". The "upper" has the barrel and determines the type of round that can be fired. The "lower" houses the trigger group. The "lower" is what is considered the gun, it has the serial number. A hunter that hunts different types of game with an AR can own one "lower" and several "uppers" in different calibers. They can then swap the "uppers" depending on what they are hunting. To swap "uppers" all you have to do is pull two pins. For many this is preferable to buying complete rifles for every caliber, not to mention potentially cheaper. In states that allow it, an AR-15 can be a legitimate choice for hunters.

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Thank you. A well thought out response and informative. Now I understand a bit more.

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Originally Posted by MartinC

What do you estimate to be the odds of a situation occurring that requires you to defend you and yours with an assault rifle? I mean seriously?

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The "right to revolt" argument and all of the arguments that stem from it is probably the most bankrupt pro gun argument out there. I can't believe it gets trotted out so much.

---------- Post added December-18th-2012 at 12:12 PM ----------

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Originally Posted by twa

while you dream gun sales are booming

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Look, the bottom line is we can either continue finding excuses to do nothing and preserve an untenable status quo or we can find solutions to our obvious gun problem. The rest of the developed world has.

And gun ownership has been on a 30 year decline BTW.

Pros of allowing assault rifles: makes gun collectors happy, gives people who hunt more options, allows people to prepare for when our government takes away all our rights and they need to go to war against our military

Pros of banning assault rifles: hinders the ability for psychos to commit mass murders and saves innocent lives

Why is this even an argument?

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Originally Posted by endzone_dave

Pros of allowing assault rifles: makes gun collectors happy, gives people who hunt more options, allows people to prepare for when our government takes away all our rights and they need to go to war against our military

Pros of banning assault rifles: hinders the ability for psychos to commit mass murders and saves innocent lives

Why is this even an argument?

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Answer: $$$$$$$

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Originally Posted by endzone_dave

Pros of banning assault rifles: hinders the ability for psychos to commit mass murders and saves innocent lives

Why is this even an argument?

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How does it really hinder it?

I'm fine with banning them,but ya'll are deluding yourselves

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Originally Posted by stevemcqueen1

And gun ownership has been on a 30 year decline BTW.

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Yet the number of NICS checks for 2012 is nearly double what it was in 2000 with a month to go. The chart is here. (Link to FBI pdf file) Checks do not equal sales, but do equal interest.

It could just be fewer people owning more guns. I wonder how they survey to find out the number of households with a gun. If a stranger called your house and asked if you own any guns would you say yes?

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Originally Posted by twa

How does it really hinder it?

I'm fine with banning them,but ya'll are deluding yourselves

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If you think you can kill as many people with a pistol as with an assault rifle, you are deluding yourself.

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Originally Posted by twa

How does it really hinder it?

I'm fine with banning them,but ya'll are deluding yourselves

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Let's not get into the "cannot do everything, so let's do nothing" trap.

I think it would be good to dial down on legality of deadly things that allow one armed person to quickly kill many unarmed people. I think there are many other things that we should be doing, including better protection of vulnerable targets, better social support services, more focus on humans, quality of life, pursuit of happiness... but limiting access to deadliest weapons sounds like a sensible part of the package.

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Originally Posted by endzone_dave

Pros of allowing assault rifles: makes gun collectors happy, gives people who hunt more options, allows people to prepare for when our government takes away all our rights and they need to go to war against our military

Pros of banning assault rifles: hinders the ability for psychos to commit mass murders and saves innocent lives

Why is this even an argument?

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and this is why nothing will get done. For people like you there can only be one solution. We need to stop trying to change each others minds and find common ground.

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Originally Posted by endzone_dave

If you think you can kill as many people with a pistol as with an assault rifle, you are deluding yourself.

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It would be useful if you provide your definition of what an "assault rifle" is. If you think that what was used in Newtown and the things that are used by are military are the same thing then you are mistaken.

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Originally Posted by Painkiller

and this is why nothing will get done. For people like you there can only be one solution. We need to stop trying to change each others minds and find common ground.

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No, we need to take away the political power of gun nuts. They are a minority whose assault weapon interests hurt society.