The stimulus package: Do you approve?

[JohnLockesGhost]

The Federal Government is about to spend more money than the GDP of Australia. So a straightforward question: Do you approve of the stimulus package in its proposed form?

Here's a good breakdown from MSNBC:

The proposed stimulus package's current price tag of $825 billion is a number that is hard to grasp.
It's so big, it would be the gross domestic product of the 19th largest country, just ahead of Australia, which doubles, of course, as its own continent. NBC's Carrie Dann reported that it would also be about the 2007 GDP totals of Singapore, Thailand, Vietnam, the Phillipines and Hong Kong -- combined, and slightly more than the GDPs of Afghanistan, Iran, Iraq, Qatar, Saudi Arabia and Jordan -- combined. The Wall Street Journal wrote, "The plan would be one of the largest single government expenditures in U.S. history, and would be equivalent to about 3% of gross domestic product over two years."
What's exactly in this thing? A lot, and it's wide-ranging -- from money for infrastructure and tax cuts to schools and health-care technology.
The package has some Republicans flabbergasted. See John Boehner's best attempt at a Chandler Bing impression: “Oh. My. God,” he said about the stimulus. And some Democrats have criticized it as not big enough.
Certainly questions have been and will be raised about what items like information health-care technology, for example, have to do with economic stimulus, and why it's not in its own health-care legislation? Nonetheless, it is in there, with lots more.
Here is a breakdown of some of what's in the stimulus, by the numbers:
-- $825 billion total (as of 1/16/08)
-- $550 billion in new spending
-- $275 billion in tax relief ($1,000 tax cut for families, $500 tax cut for individuals through SS payroll deductions)
-- $ 90 billion for infrastructure
-- $ 87 billion Medicaid aid to states
-- $ 79 billion school districts/public colleges to prevent cutbacks
-- $ 54 billion to encourage energy production from renewable sources
-- $ 41 billion for additional school funding ($14 billion for school modernizations and repairs, $13 billion for Title I, $13 billion for IDEA special education funding, $1 billino for education technology)
-- $ 24 billion for "health information technology to prevent medical mistakes, provide better care to patients and introduce cost-saving efficiencies" and "to provide for preventative care and to evaluate the most effective healthcare treatments."
-- $ 16 billion for science/technology ($10 billion for science facilities, research, and instrumentation; $6 billion to expand broadband to rural areas)
-- $ 15 billion to increase Pell grants by $500
-- $ 6 billion for the ambiguous "higher education modernization."

[Toe Jam]

Nope.

Sending out more stimulus checks=fail. That's exactly what they are talking about, too.

And this is on top of the other $750 billion set aside for the TARP program. What are they gonna do? Keep printing money until it's worthless?

As for the infrastructure spending, I dunno about that.

If you want to stimulate the economy, you let college kids go to college for free. Pell grants aren't available to everyone- only lower income students such as myself. I'm grateful for it, sure, but imagine what college students and their parents would be able to do if they didn't have to go into debt sending their kids to school.

[Duckus]

I really don't know. Seriously. I wish more people were open about the fact that we don't really know what to do, instead of claiming they have all the answers one way or the other.

We are dealing with problems that nobody "knows" the solution to. We all have theories, but that is it.

If you put a gun to my head and asked me, I would say spend money but not this much. Maybe about 1/3 less. There seems to be things we could cut out that would not have an immediate impact.

[mardi gras skin]

$ 79 billion school districts/public colleges to prevent cutbacks
$ 41 billion for additional school funding
$ 15 billion to increase Pell grants by $500
$ 6 billion for the ambiguous "higher education modernization.

$141 billion dollars in education over and above the regular education budget. That's crazy.

[JohnLockesGhost]

I'd really just like to know how spending a bunch of money it doesn't have, the government is going to "get the economy moving again." I'm a pretty bright guy, but I just don't get it.

I understand how it's supposed to mitigate the immediate crisis, but how does it lay a foundation of longterm growth. It weakens the economic foundation of the economy even more.

[Toe Jam]

$ 79 billion school districts/public colleges to prevent cutbacks
$ 41 billion for additional school funding
$ 15 billion to increase Pell grants by $500
$ 6 billion for the ambiguous "higher education modernization.

$141 billion dollars in education over and above the regular education budget. That's crazy.

The whole point is to stimulate the economy. I don't see how that makes it happen.

[Toe Jam]

I'd really just like to know how spending a bunch of money it doesn't have, the government is going to "get the economy moving again." I'm a pretty bright guy, but I just don't get it.

I understand how it's supposed to mitigate the immediate crisis, but how does it lay a foundation of longterm growth. It weakens the economic foundation of the economy even more.

It's like a drug addiction.. feels good at first, bites you in the long run.

The next generation is going to be screwed. My grandkids will be paying this back. But no, we don't care about that..

If this is what Obama and democrats say is the "answer", then they are already off to a horrible start.

[JohnLockesGhost]

I really don't know. Seriously. I wish more people were open about the fact that we don't really know what to do, instead of claiming they have all the answers one way or the other.

We are dealing with problems that nobody "knows" the solution to. We all have theories, but that is it.

If you put a gun to my head and asked me, I would say spend money but not this much. Maybe about 1/3 less. There seems to be things we could cut out that would not have an immediate impact.

I appreciate the honesty in your post. When it comes to certain things, I'm a type of guy who just knows what he knows. And while I certainly have my ideas, theories and feelings about this whole mess we're in, I could probably do with a bit of your humility.

I just won't express it on this messageboard.

[GibbsFactor]

Shoot, I'll take more money, I'll use it to go to Vegas one last time before I get stuck in a thunderdome.

[Toe Jam]

Shoot, I'll take more money, I'll use it to go to Vegas one last time before I get stuck in a thunderdome.

The funny thing about a $500 tax credit is that it won't even buy my books for the summer and fall semesters.

I think I understand where they are coming from but America is too far in debt for the average family to take that five hundred dollars and go buy a computer or a TV.

That's what I did with my tax money, though.. and only because I needed one for school.

I don't mean to harp on about the ills of college students but I really do believe that when you help them, they'll help you by spending money..

[skinsfan_1215]

$ 79 billion school districts/public colleges to prevent cutbacks
$ 41 billion for additional school funding
$ 15 billion to increase Pell grants by $500
$ 6 billion for the ambiguous "higher education modernization.

$141 billion dollars in education over and above the regular education budget. That's crazy.

The whole point is to stimulate the economy. I don't see how that makes it happen.

Well for one, it helps many college professors and staff to keep their jobs. I know here at Mason we're facing big cut-backs to all the staff, as well as an increase in tuition. This will also help ensure that people are still able to afford college (well as much as they could anyway). That way we still have our finest institutions churning out well educated, highly productive citizens.

I didn't know about all those other education stipends involved. I might have voted that I disapprove based on its size, but I just can't disapprove of those education measures. I approve of this stimulus package.

[Toe Jam]

Well for one, it helps many college professors and staff to keep their jobs. I know here at Mason we're facing big cut-backs to all the staff, as well as an increase in tuition. .

Dang.

How much of an increase are you talking about?

[JohnLockesGhost]

Well for one, it helps many college professors and staff to keep their jobs. I know here at Mason we're facing big cut-backs to all the staff, as well as an increase in tuition. This will also help ensure that people are still able to afford college (well as much as they could anyway). That way we still have our finest institutions churning out well educated, highly productive citizens.

I didn't know about all those other education stipends involved. I might have voted that I disapprove based on its size, but I just can't disapprove of those education measures. I approve of this stimulus package.

But why should they keep their jobs as I lose mine. To pay for this the government has to tax it from my company.

The government shouldn't pick winners, for moral reasons as well as economic ones.

[mardi gras skin]

Out of almost a trillion dollars, only $54 billion is going to help create the new green economy.

[skinsfan_1215]

Dang.

How much of an increase are you talking about?

I heard on the news up to 10% increase.