The Official Washington Wizards Thread

[Thinking Skins]

Kawhi Leonard.

[stevemcqueen1]

Kawhi Leonard.

Looks good mostly because he fell into the best situation possible.

He's no more talented than Vesely. He rebounds better, but doesn't shoot or defend any better, and Vesely is longer and a better athlete. Kawhi is little more than a glue man too, with less athletic upside than Ves.

[Destino]

http://www.bulletsforever.com/2012/1...e-flex-offense

Click that to see how the wizards are running a flex offense to get Beal open shots. Photos and videos.

[Thinking Skins]

Looks good mostly because he fell into the best situation possible.

He's no more talented than Vesely. He rebounds better, but doesn't shoot or defend any better, and Vesely is longer and a better athlete. Kawhi is little more than a glue man too, with less athletic upside than Ves.

I don't know if I agree with that. Kawhi has a better shot, more range, fouls less, is a better rebounder, and is a better defender. People were calling him no better than Singleton, which I kinda agreed but thought of him as a more polished version. And his rookie stats show it. He had a PER of 16.67 compared to 11.54 for Vesely and 8.27 for Singleton. And he was getting more minutes per game on a quality team. If you break down their shot selections, particularly from different spots on the court, his numbers are really similar to Singleton, but just better in most every category. Is that because he was on a better team or is just a better player (than both)? I'd probably tend more towards the later.

[ixcuincle]

http://twitter.com/WaltonCaps/status...59694959218688

What does it sound like when a hockey guy does hoops? Find out at 8:30. Wizards at Milwaukee, with me and @GCtalks on the call, WFED 1500.

[stevemcqueen1]

I don't know if I agree with that. Kawhi has a better shot, more range, fouls less, is a better rebounder, and is a better defender. People were calling him no better than Singleton, which I kinda agreed but thought of him as a more polished version. And his rookie stats show it. He had a PER of 16.67 compared to 11.54 for Vesely and 8.27 for Singleton. And he was getting more minutes per game on a quality team. If you break down their shot selections, particularly from different spots on the court, his numbers are really similar to Singleton, but just better in most every category. Is that because he was on a better team or is just a better player (than both)? I'd probably tend more towards the later.

You make good points. But I do think playing in San Antonio has been the biggest difference for Kawhi. They are fantastic teaching the game to their young players and I don't think you can quantify the benefit for a young guy getting to play for Pop and take the court with vets like Parker, Manu, and Duncan. I bet Ves would look a ton better playing with them too.

I just don't see a high upside with Kawhi. He's very strong and has an outstanding motor. Good long arms too, great length for a wing. But he's really a pure perimeter player, and I don't see a good shooting ability there. He's had more success with his percentages than Singleton, but I think Singleton is the better shooter from range TBH. Singleton came into the NBA with some ability to hit a corner 3. Though Singleton is pretty bad when he has to dribble and Kawhi can probably create a bit more off the dribble. I think Kawhi's shooting percentages greatly benefited from San Antonio's vastly superior ability to space the floor and Singleton's were hurt by our complete inability to do so.

For me it comes down to Kawhi--better motor and better rebounder, but really a PF in a pure wing's body without elite speed or shooting ability. Singleton, faster and bigger with some ability to play PF and defend guys in the low post or cover guys on the perimeter but much lesser rebounder and worse motor. I think the upside with Singleton is slightly higher because of his physical tools.

Vesely is a different animal. He's a seven footer with enough quickness to play extended stretches at the 3. His upside is a lot higher than Leonard's IMO, which is why he was picked as high as he was. He's got the pedigree to become a fantastic space and weakside help defender, really got jack of all trades potential on D. Not as good a rebounder as Kawhi though, and not as tough or strong. Still, I prefer Ves' superior athleticism and length.

I regret taking Singleton over Faried. I think rebounding is a much bigger issue for this team than defensive potential. If you take Vesely at 6 and then go out and swap JaVale for Nene and gain Trevor Ariza a year later, Faried's skillset becomes far more valuable to us than Singleton's. We couldn't have known about Nene and Ariza at the time of the draft. But damned if it wouldn't have been nice to just say, "Faried has a better body, better motor, and is a more consistent player. Let's take him over Singleton and let the chips fall where they may."

Klay Thompson and Bismack Biyombo are the only viable alternatives to Vesely around the range Ves was taken. But Bismack is an even worse offensive player than Vesely and he's not exactly working with a ton of power himself, plus he's slower than Ves. Klay Thompson's shooting and his excellent length for the 2 guard are his two NBA attributes and he'll carve out a decent career with them most likely. But Thompson wouldn't have much of a role on our team with Beal now, he's a pure 2 because of his lack of strength. Plus he's a little older than Vesely and doesn't have nearly as much upside. If Ves develops, he's our ticket to successfully defending the pick and roll and defending the stretch four. You'll get diced apart by teams with those players unless you've got a big man that can cover space. It's hard to find those kinds of defenders.

[Thinking Skins]

@stevemcqueen1, I agree with a lot of what you said but I just feel like one of my problems with Ernie (and I'm not nearly as down on Ernie as most) is that he always seems to overvalue European potential over proven talent. I was somewhat surprised we didn't trade the Beal pick for a Euro stash. But when it happened with the second rounder, I was like "aah, there's our Euro". Potential is great, but as you mention - until we show that we have the coaching staff in place to develop potential into something, it doesn't mean didly. I can say that I'm impressed with what Wittman's done with Seraphin, but that's not saying much just yet and we'll see how much progress he makes this year. And if Vesely can learn to control himself better this year we may see some marked improvement, but like I said I'm not gonna hold my breath on the Wizards developing a player. If this were the Nationals and we had a record of Zimmerman, Strausberg, Harper, Storen, etc, then I wouldn't mind doing like the Nats do and drafting an injured pitcher who needs Tommy Johns surgery but has the potential to be a starter once it heals or a third baseman with an injured shoulder, because we've shown we know what we're doing in that realm. As for the Wizards, I'm still wait and see. Maybe Wittman can be like Tom Coughlin and get this team to buy into what he's selling and turn us around. But I'm tired of getting my hopes up before the season and then realizing that we are what we are. So I'll wait and see. Hopefully we can do something.

[StillUnknown]

http://www.bulletsforever.com/2012/1...hold-off-bucks

Here are some more notes on the game. This contest wasn't televised, so take these with a grain of salt.

THE GOOD

Trevor Booker: How about THAT performance from Cook Book. He had 18 points by halftime and ended up with 22 in 22 minutes. It sounded like he hit a bunch on mid-range jumpers too, which is obviously huge for his development. If Nene continues to be sidelined by injury, Booker should start, and I think he'll seize that opportunity.

THE BAD

Jan Vesely: He did hit two clutch free throws at the end, but otherwise, it sounded like the same old Vesely. He committed five fouls in 19 minutes, and that simply can't happen anymore.

much more in the link


Vesely's fouling problem almost negates any positives he brings to the defensive end.

[Destino]

http://www.bulletsforever.com/2012/1...hold-off-bucks



much more in the link


Vesely's fouling problem almost negates any positives he brings to the defensive end.

At least Yawn Ves is trying. Ariza needs to be asked to watch the games at home until he's ready to give some effort or we need a body because of injury. Culture change isn't going to stick with the latest Rishard Lewis moping around like an *******.

[stevemcqueen1]

Is Ariza injured?

At least Crawford and Price played well. I think Booker is due for a good year too.

Jan's fouling is a problem that comes up when he plays strong bigs who are good at establishing position for themselves. Jan is best as the help defender and defending in space, outside the paint. When he's on the floor, we really need someone like Nene in at the 5 to play the low post players.

The reason I think we'll be a lot better this year than the past two is the strength of the front court. Nene and Okafor would be a good starting tandem for most teams and Booker and Seraphin are quality reserves. Jan and Singleton bring interesting skill sets to the table. All in all, I think you've got six players to work with there, which is more than the team is

If the front court does their work and leads the team, the play of the guards will improve too. And by the time Wall gets back and Beal is starting, we'll have pretty good starting guards. The team won't be spectacular, lacking a true star. But it will win games. And then if Wall finally makes the leap, they could actually be good.

[StillUnknown]

Wizards vs. Miami on CSN at 8:30 tonight

[BRAVEONTHEWARPATH93]

Wizards vs. Miami on CSN at 8:30 tonight

why are they playing in kc?

[StillUnknown]

why are they playing in kc?

I have no idea.

---------- Post added October-24th-2012 at 09:23 PM ----------

Crawford is a damn good passer, its a shame he chooses not use that skill more often.

I would start Martell Webster at SF to open the season.

[BRAVEONTHEWARPATH93]

I have no idea.

---------- Post added October-24th-2012 at 09:23 PM ----------

Crawford is a damn good passer, its a shame he chooses not use that skill more often.

I would start Martell Webster at SF to open the season.

I personally wish Crawford would stop shooting so much and try to be more balanced. He could be a serviceable guy off the bench.

I can't see the game up here but I hear Webster is cooking.

Can he shoot or is he a scorer? I'm not too familiar with his style

[MonkFan8]

Crawford just doesn't know what a good shot is. He said as much a few days ago.

Even if Beal is learning and can't put the ball on the floor, I still think he should start. JC can be the first guy off the bench when we need a quick burst.

Webster better start. No reason Wittman should go with Ariza, even if he is an established vet.