AP: Armstrong won't challenge doping allegations; loses Tour titles (Lance to confess)

[Elessar78]

You're right L'Equipe sucks big time, because it is the only sports newspaper we have, so they are free to write whatever bs they want, they love to "stir the ****". About Lance he is no different than the others, you can't win the Tour de Farce (farce means joke) on spring water. My opinion and knowledge is that they are all on PED, and whether they are French, Americans, Italians, Spaniards doesn't make any difference to me. I have a few former pro cyclists among my acquaintances, some were riding in the 80's, some were riding 10 years ago, they are all telling the same stories about drugs and the ways to come clean from the ICU tests. Last but not least I think Lance was smart enough to avoid getting caught, ICU couldn't catch him, we should move on, this is getting ridiculous.
This article will show you that most of the French people don't care, only the lousy guys from L'Equipe still have an agenda with Lance.

J'Accuse!

[FrFan]

J'Accuse!

Literaly, I do agree, but Zola's article was more a symbol of eloquence and the power of journalism used to serve a good cause. Impressive knowledge by the way

[Redskins Diehard]

I'd like to believe LA is/was clean. Seems like the Feds are leaning really hard on some of these people, to get these statements out into the public domain. Really seems like small potatoes for the Feds to be going after doping cyclists.

Plus, I just don't buy it. Hincapie claims the PEDs used was EPO and testosterone? How can those go undetected?? If it was some exotic thing that they had no test for, not known what they were looking for, then maybe. But those two are pretty standard. Raised testosterone levels is what gave Landis away.

EPO is a naturally occurring substance. We all have it in our systems. It basically has the same effect as training at altitude. There is a reason the US Olympic Committee established it training center at altitude in Colorado Springs.

[Elessar78]

EPO is a naturally occurring substance. We all have it in our systems. It basically has the same effect as training at altitude. There is a reason the US Olympic Committee established it training center at altitude in Colorado Springs.

But just like testosterone (which occurs in naturally), it's the levels that matter, right?

[Redskins Diehard]

But just like testosterone (which occurs in naturally), it's the levels that matter, right?

Well I don't know that it is the levels that matter. Because in all likelihood you and I, and everyone else in this thread have different levels of naturally occurring EPO in our systems. And if we both went to the Olympic Training Center in Colorado Springs and trained at altitude for a period of time our levels of EPO would increase. That is why they(elite endurance athletes) train at such locations. I believe, not an expert, that the tests are actually to determine if synthetic EPO as a sort of precursor to natural EPO production. Similar to Androstenedione(the stuff made famous in McGwire's locker). Andro actually doesn't do much for someone by itself...except stimulate the bodies production of testosterone.

My own personal opinion is that Armstrong used it...or something similar to it. If for no other reason than the fact that he beat a field of elites that were doing the same thing. That is against the rules laid out by whatever governing body is in existence. As to whether or not the rule should be in place is another discussion. I like the comparison to athletes of 80-90 years ago. The most recreational of athletes today have access to greater "performance enhancers" than the elites of even 50 years ago. Heart rate monitors, lactate threshold testing, power meters, creatine supplements, weightlifting, nutrition knowledge, carbon fiber bikes, the list goes on an on. Should we ban all of that stuff to make sure there is a true comparison over the course of time?

[killerbee99]

But the questions is , how is it ok for LA, if we CAN'T prove every cyclist doped...it's such a moronic position to take.....and a logical fallacy

[Hooper]

He totally cheated.

But he's dug himself in so deep he can't admit to cheating. Even though everyone in cycling apparently does because you have to compete.

So he just keeps digging deeper.

[StillUnknown]

He totally cheated.

But he's dug himself in so deep he can't admit to cheating. Even though everyone in cycling apparently does because you have to compete.

So he just keeps digging deeper.

the roger clemens strategy

[Redskins Diehard]

But the questions is , how is it ok for LA, if we CAN'T prove every cyclist doped...it's such a moronic position to take.....and a logical fallacy

Not sure what "logical fallacy" you are pointing out.

Interesting you capitalized "CAN'T" prove every cyclist doped. Because we also really CAN'T prove that Armstrong doped. You have 2 people that have come out in public and said he did. Someone that allegedly/supposedly/whatever testified that he did. And 500 drug tests that say he didn't.

The moronic position in my opinion is to somehow think that this one cyclist won 7 Tours because he doped and others didn't. One of the most convincing pieces of "evidence" to me is that he beat so many people that DID fail drug tests.

[CrabR]

what are the feds investigating drugs s in cycling.Bigger waste of time than congress investigating steroids in baseball

Maybe they should be on the border preventing the flood of drugs across the border instead

[Rocky21]

He had bad tests.

Why would his teammate, with nothing to gain, lie under oath in front of a grand jury?

He wouldn't dare lie at this point because it would void HIS partial immunity deal. He has every incentive to tell the truth.

At this point, If anyone still believes Lance Armstrong is not a cheater they are (either willfully or unintentionally) simply ignoring the evidence.

[Elessar78]

I'm going to give him the benefit of the doubt. They catch other cyclists and not him? He's won 7 TdFs, he's the most tested man in sport. I just find it hard to believe that so closely watched and not even a dubious test result? They keep a B-sample of all his stuff so in the future if they discover a way to test for PEDs they can go back.

[pointyfootball]

I would not be surprised if he did cheat. However, the negative test results are puzzling to me, as it seems every other big name has been caught, even ones on his team.

I also have a hard time accepting Hamilton & Landis' testimony as they've proven they will lie before.

Edit: I do think he did cheat somehow/someway.

[Bang]

So am I unamerican for not giving a **** about cycling?
I never gave a damn about it before Lance OneNut, and I couldn't care less about it now.

He cheated to ride a bike up a mountain. I think it's pretty obvious. The smoke is non-stop, and that usually means fire.
But, that said, I'm still having a very difficult time giving a ****.

~Bang

[Rocky21]

For anyone who didn't watch 60 Minutes last night and/or is on the fence.
http://www.cbsnews.com/sections/60mi...main3415.shtml