ExtremeSkins = Extreme Mess

[LD0506]

It is taken for granted far too often around here that the mods are somehow more, more informed, more in control, more somethin', but very rarely do they seem to get much credit for just being.......... well, guys, yanno, guys that like the Skins who willingly spend their time tending this patch of earth we all feed on, guys that for whatever motivation come back day in and day out to wade in the stupid that grow online and try to keep it in check.

I have a pretty simple standard that I use when judging how someone else is doing a job- would I want to do it? Would I volunteer to be that guy, you know, the one with the shovel following the elephant in the parade? Would I commit part of my day, 365 days a year, to running a daycare for a herd desperately in need of medication?

Easy answer, NO! Not at gunpoint. But when that pops out I am beholden to offer some measure of slack to those that do, and I can say in complete honesty I don't find myself having to do that very often.

[Jumbo]

Threads like these make me sad to read.

"mess" indeed.

And make a few of them moderators!

First, much of burg's post holds validity with my experience. And such is human nature, that even long-time members of great contributions to this board, who never utter a critical word, even if they think them, may finally offer one or two up, after they finally get some minor mod action themselves.

In the end, here's what "90%" (not 100%) of the sturm und drang from the "victimized" or "that mod (s) sucks" gang is simply about: being upset that mods were "mean" or "rude" or "unfair" in giving them one or more penalties, or addressing them in a thread about such, and who then handled their end of some (or several) mod actions poorly in some fashion. Period. That's it.

That's the whole driver behind everything from the silly, to the rabidly frothing, to the lengthy and sweeping indictments from someone in their "just pointing out reality and am being reasonable" posture.

To a person, they are simply, bottom line, upset with a penalty or chewing out they received. And to the point where it stays with them for months (or even years) and continues to run the meter in their heads at times, and even become semi-regular topics of conversation on any other place they go to post.

With this "90%" who are off-target (at best), whether they are factually wrong, or have mis-perceptions, or even just make stuff up ij what they say, they are inevitably operating out of that simple, pedestrian (and I'd say developmentally stunted) position of "I'm still mad about what you did and you guys suck and I'm gonna tell" frame. Like a kid. And on it goes.

I.E. the post from jrock (who I enjoyed though he was often a knucklehead ), years after "finding another home ", he drops in with a little mod-smack nugget. Really.

He had multiple bans and other penalties from rule violations from old staff and current staff, and lots of effort/slack extended his way because he was basically a good guy, and never was permanently banned though he qualified. But here he is, 6 years later, dropping into this thread to do this. Seriously, to me, it's this kind of stuff that's sad. Not the **** that "the mods get wrong."

Whatever "mess" this place is now, has been at any time past, or will be an any future time, those who have staffed here know they've been hearing the same song for the same reasons since its first couple years of existence, and before most current staff were even members. Yet the site prospers, offers much excellent material, and continues to be ES, love it or hate it.

Then we have the same from good old SnyderShrugged <sigh>. A guy with more than a few issues as widely noted by a large group of fellow ES'ers, and who has been a lot of work to keep around, including many PM conversations, and with a file of other member complaints and mod interactions that's like a treatise on "why bother."

Well, we bothered because he does have something to offer in at least some folks views and (most importantly) he means well enough most of the time, seems like a "nice guy at heart" to at least some of us still, and doesn't try to be a serious dick frequently, and that counts in his favor. But he (and it's a good thing) also "finds another home" and yet has to be here, too, and post a one-liner "feel sad" and "mess' comment. Now that's sad. But I mean something different.

Ironically, some of these folks, now and from the past, have the harshest comments about them in their user notes from past mods who are now elsewhere.

Do the people grinding their kiddie ax ever note all the useful things the mods do? Not really---unless feet are held to fire in one of our replies to their diatribes. Theirs (the "90%") is a myopic self-centered POV on these matters, frankly. And were they never nailed by a mod, and other than typical message board scuffling with posters who they disagree with, they'd likely never have a word of complaint or be nobly lobbying for "better modding" and "fairness and justice for all because we don't have it!" or "how we can make this board better." They would be just fine to continue in the ES part of their world and do their thing.

And there's one thing I can unreservedly guarantee regarding the current staff---regardless of "rights and wrongs" in any mod action with any member, no member ever "went down in flames at the hands of an unfair mod" if they were friendly or polite and willing to work together in addressing a problem.

[Skins4Life6388]

Love the board and have been here since 07. My only minor complaint is I got a week long ban during, or shortly after the Browns game. I pm'ed a Mod to figure out why and never heard anything back. Otherwise, it's all good IMO.

[Ghost of Nibbs McPimpin]

I have the feeling that, for some, that gnawing nomadic impulse manifests itself in some disruptive ways. So, the person may not possess terrible character and may usually be polite and good-natured but that sometimes people drive others(or themselves) away through these busts of petulance and anger. When they go, I think it's actually best to remember them (If there is anything to remember) as people who just wanted to move on, whether they acknowledged it consciously or not. I think, depending if they've made a name somewhere else in the future that properly demonstrates positive change, they could be invited back.

It could also be that some personalities are just best suited to being on a small, "intimate" board where their better instincts have their conscience's ear and thus they essentially become better posters due to the reduced scale. The human problem with scale and personal distance is well-known and some adapt and some do not. I have nothing critical to say, only wanted to take a step back and look at it without involving emotions.

[jsteelz]

all im saying is TK kicked my puppys, and Jumbo prank calls me every other day...Terrible lol

[Park City Skins]

This board this,this board that. Mods this,mods that. Let me take a look at my day planner to see if have sometime around October this year to lose about 0.000003 seconds of sleep over the complaints.












Nope. Maybe next year.

[Goaldeje]

I have the feeling that, for some, that gnawing nomadic impulse manifests itself in some disruptive ways. So, the person may possess terrible character and may usually be polite and good-natured but that sometimes people drive others(or themselves) away through these busts of petulance and anger. When they go, I think it's actually best to remember them (If there is anything to remember) as people who just wanted to move on, whether they acknowledged it consciously or not. I think, depending if they've made a name somewhere else in the future that properly demonstrates positive change, they could be invited back.

It could also be that some personalities are just best suited to being on a small, "intimate" board where their better instincts have their conscience's ear and thus they essentially become better posters due to the reduced scale. The human problem with scale and personal distance is well-known and some adapt and some do not. I have nothing critical to say, only wanted to take a step back and look at it without involving all the hurt feelings.

Excellent insight Ghost. I, for one, moved on years ago, but felt no animus at all to anyone here. It just got too big, I never really had any close friends here, so it was an easy break. I made good friends elsewhere, life moves on.

I will say that seeing Jumbo act like an ass to some of those new-found friends is upsetting. Jumbo, I actually came on here intending to deliver a scathing attack on your insecurities, instead, I feel a great of pity towards you. Genuine pity. Sometime, you should consider going through this thread and re-reading both the original posts and then your responses to them. Were some responses merited? Perhaps. Others definitely not so. Considering you banned SS for his comment, I am sure the fact that I mentioned you by name will get me banned; so be it. I would respectfully request it be permanent if at all possible. The way you handled HH a couple of months ago was borderline illegal, not to mention disgusting; your responses here are disgraceful. Zoony has already stuck up for you once, which is disappointing in itself. I remembered Zoony fondly from when I was here more often, apparently things have changed. I very fondly remember PCS, and hope he has not. Look through my notes, I have always been respectful and well behaved; to the best of my knowledge, I have never had an altercation with any members (outside of one time with Chom, but come on...) or staff. Perhaps coming from a well-behaved member this will make a dent.

Jumbo, I had fond memories of you, despite being told about your "true" nature. I remember you being wordy, perhaps, but as you can see from my post, that's not something I tend to hold against someone. However, seeing this thread has upset me today, perhaps because I have made some friends you have abused, perhaps because I have seen how mods SHOULD act elsewhere, I don't know. You seem bound and determined that the problem is entirely on the members' side of things. Perhaps at some point, you will be able to realize that is not completely the case. Certainly, the members could always phrase things better, or withold certain comments, etc. But when a number of core members decides to move on and directly cites YOU as the problem, maybe there is a SMALL problem with how you handle things? There have even been hints throughout this thread made by people in good, in very good standing even, that not ALL of the blame lies on the side of the banned. Hopefully some self reflection will occur, and perhaps this place will improve because of it. Adieu.

[Hubbs]

Jumbo dispensing wisdom.

I got a NNT during that Swinging Gate game in 2009.

I feel like everyone should almost have had a "get out of punishment free" card during that game.

Every message board since the dawn of the internet has contained active members, who, upon their exit, will claim always to have hated it.

-Thomas Jefferson

And even more

That's brilliant. Well done, sir.

You too. On another site. (since this will be your fourth and final ban, though the first from me).

As earlier noted, these kind of threads often seem to unintentionally serve as culling events.

Banned for a post in a thread that's about bans... that's so meta that my brain nearly exploded.

[BigMike619]

Jumbo keeps tab like a bitter ***** of a wife who likes to hold things over your head and use them against you at a later time. You are one of the biggest drama queen punks I have ever come across on the internet. The fact that you think ANY real man is going to care about what little ****ing notes you and your ***** ass cohort TK keep is hysterical. Dana, you are easily the biggest drama whore out of everyone you try to come down with your novel of posts.

I find it funny that Zoony went after tshile for "writing a 50,000 word novel" yet none of them EVER say a word to you about just shutting the **** up for once! you arent funny, you arent clever, and your little tirades bore most of us

I wish as a MOD you had to speak to the posters you ban in person like this. Because the stories I hear of that punk mother****er TK is that he is VERY reserved and doesnt talk ANY **** at tailgates. But I am shocked that

The ONLY reason I am posting this is because of the fact you posted my real name from a Facebook thread where we were clowning you bitches. You thought you were going to "expose" or "embarrass" me somehow but you cant do that. I dont listen to what bitches say, I just laugh at them. And believe me Dana and TK, your punk asses are laughed at on a regular.

Dont worry about any "banning". Im done with this **** site anyways. See you guys at a tailgate hopefully =)

HTTR!

[2cents]

It is amazing how seriously people take themselves.

[ConnSKINS26]

I'd say that suicide-by-mod post by BigMike has been coming for a while.

[skinsfan_1215]

Holy **** is that THE bigmike? As in bigmike full of rage? I'm gonna have to throw a bigmike rage tag on this thread. Wow what a throwback.

Rage on Mike, rage on.

[LD0506]

Well we're definitely down the rabbit hole tonight folks..........

[mistertim]

<angry/threatening rant>

[skinsfan_1215]

This thread...