Romney/Ryan Lose 2012 Election Thread

[MissU28]

I really liked Mitt's last comment about letting the states make the decisions about healthcare instead of the federal government.....states' rights!

[ixcuincle]

Debate thread reopend, i take my joke there

[SteveFromYellowstone]

How can people take this guy seriously? He flip-flopped on just about everything he's been campaigning on

[stevemcqueen1]

Romney will basically be better in the debates. He talks faster.

That's a good thing? I thought he sounded a bit desperate and wordy.

He's definitely polished though. Obama is professorial, which is probably a bad thing to most. I think Obama may have taken a wrong turn in trying to answer the questions too often and not keeping his answers pat stump speech tropes. Romney pivoted too much though, particularly towards the end. It became clear he didn't have any specific plans and started contradicting himself too openly "I'll not cut taxes (I'll cut the corporate tax rate to 25%)."

I think Obama started to work him towards the end of the debate when he got more comfortable and figured out Romney's tact, but in general, I don't think he properly pounced on some of the incoherencies and inconsistencies in Romney's answers. Romney started off strong and seemed to co-opt the direction of the debate for most of the night. Obama should have killed him on lying about that 5 trillion dollar cut in revenue and killed him over his statements on that issue of the 716 million dollar medicare "cut." Why Romney is making this part of his message is beyond me. It's such an obviously bad position for anyone who is even slightly informed.

The one thing that I think is silly about these debates is that pundits say things like this with a straight face, "If you had the sound turned off, Romney looked better because he smiled." That's important why?

Generally speaking, I think voters would benefit from no "instant analysis" of things like this and the convention speeches. The pundits have cliche, general narratives they formulate before they even watch the debates. But the shooting from the hip reactions become the accepted narrative moving forward.

---------- Post added October-3rd-2012 at 11:18 PM ----------

Another thing I'm curious about: was Romney's claim that the economy is worse today than it was in 2010 when Obama supported the extension of Bush era tax cuts an outright lie? By what measure is he making that claim?

[visionary]

http://usnews.nbcnews.com/_news/2012...classroom?lite

Pa. student who wore Romney shirt: Teacher 'told me to get out of the classroom'

Samantha Pawlucy, a 16-year-old sophomore at Charles Carroll High School in the Port Richmond section of the city, says she wore a pink Mitt Romney/Paul Ryan T-shirt last Friday during the school's dress-down day.

No one made an issue of Samantha’s political T-shirt until she got to geometry class.

"The teacher told me to get out of the classroom, I said no," Samantha said.

"She told me to take off my shirt and said that she has another one if I need one. And then the teacher asked me… 'Are your parents Republican?' I said, 'I don't know.' She said that's like her wearing a KKK shirt."

Samantha was so embarrassed by the public criticism in front of her classmates that she told her parents she didn’t want to return to school.

[hunterx]

I am more democratic than republican. I only believe in a few things that the republican platform runs for. Quick question, do you guys disagree with some of these reasons for my not supporting the republican party in general?

1. They don't support woman equality [as much] in the workforce

2. They still don't allow woman to decide what to do with their own bodies when it comes to health care or birth control/decisions related

3. The majority of them use religion as an excuse as to why we can't further explore stem cell research to find cures for a number of disabilities and diseases

4. This is 2012...the right to bear arms is fine, but no one needs an assault rifle or any automatic weapon. Lock those weapons up at authorized firing ranges for rental only to use there. I have no problem with carrying handguns around. Shotguns/Rifles I think are necessary for hunting.

5. Religion has no place in politics. I am tired of hearing them talk about God and faith. Many of their policies and beliefs are shaped around Christianity. The country was founded by many great leaders who were actually Athiest, and this whole God stuff on money and in the pledge of allegiance didn't come back up until the 1950s. There is no one God for this country, that's why people came here, to get away from that. Part of why this country was founded was because people came here from many religious backgrounds, and we respect each one and even those who aren't of faith. Churches should be taxed, too. That's another story.

[No Excuses]

I really liked Mitt's last comment about letting the states make the decisions about healthcare instead of the federal government.....states' rights!

What were the states doing before ACA was passed?

[Burgold]

I really liked Mitt's last comment about letting the states make the decisions about healthcare instead of the federal government.....states' rights!

I don't mind it in theory, but in practical terms... how are the states going to pay for this huge increase? Most of them are broke. You shift Medicare to the states that's a hell of big budget increase for them to absorb.

[NLC1054]

I don't mind it in theory, but in practical terms... how are the states going to pay for this huge increase? Most of them are broke. You shift Medicare to the states that's a hell of big budget increase for them to absorb.

Simple; you just cut education spending, gut teacher's unions, cut funding to police stations and fire fighters and other local government services. Basically just cut everything and pray that it works out in the end.

[GSF]

I really liked Mitt's last comment about letting the states make the decisions about healthcare instead of the federal government.....states' rights!

The states have the right to do it now, why haven't they?

[Larry]

I don't mind it in theory, but in practical terms... how are the states going to pay for this huge increase? Most of them are broke. You shift Medicare to the states that's a hell of big budget increase for them to absorb.

Well, I think the idea that they're pushing is for the feds to give the money they're currently spending, to the states, and then let the states spend it.

I can see lots of potential problems with this idea, beginning with the fact that the best possible outcome for this theory, is that the states do exactly what the feds do. And even if they do that, replacing one federal bureaucracy with 50 state ones would still make it worse, anyway.

But nobody's proposing to make the states cover Medicare without money.

[Burgold]

In practical terms that almost never works though, Larry. States swish around funds to where they need it and then programs go broke all the time. They do it both in legal and illegal ways frequently.

[Larry]

In practical terms that almost never works though, Larry. States swish around funds to where they need it and then programs go broke all the time. They do it both in legal and illegal ways frequently.

Well, now, that is what I think the real idea behind the "block grant" ideas are:

Throw a bunch of Medicare money at the states, and then the Red States can divert it someplace more Republican.

(I think another part of the block grant proposals are "send the money to the states, and next year, we can increase the amount according to inflation (instead of according to health care costs), and darn, I guess the states will just have to cut something, while we look innocent and say 'gee, spending kept up with inflation'.")

[AsburySkinsFan]

The states have the right to do it now, why haven't they?

Because they're broke

[GSF]

Because they're broke

Yes I know. I was wondering what MissU28 thought about it...