The Mess going on at Penn state Thread

[LadySkinsFan]

Reporting criminal incidents to campus police anywhere in the US is a dicey proposition. There is often no action taken, local police forces are not informed, all to protect the reputation of the university/college.

This abuse has been ongoing for decades and people in authority knew about it. It's like the Catholic Church all over again. These poor children, no one protected them.

I think that campus police forces should be required to report all crime to the local police for disposition, rather than doing that themselves. Let the chips fall where they may as to whether a campus is safe or not. I'm sick of the coverup of crime we keep reading about. It should be everyone who is responsible for children in an organizational way to report abuse, not just doctors/nurses/teachers. Coaches, after hours care, anyone so children can feel that there is someone that they can report abuse to, and that it will be taken care of properly instead of hushed up to protect the adult.

[bcl05]

I'm very surprised that Paterno isn't included in the criminal charges, and I suspect he might be down the road. Pennsylvania (like every state) has mandatory reporting laws. Basically anyone who becomes aware of child abuse or neglect is legally obligated to report to the appropriate authorities (police or child protective services). As a pediatrician, I've gotten training on these laws in every state I've worked. If I learn of child abuse and don't report it, I lose my license and can be charged with a crime. All school employees are also included as "mandatory reporters." I've called police or CPS a bunch of times related to my patients. Its not fun, but its not difficult, and its something you simply have to do.

Paterno getting off the hook, either legally or morally, just because he passed it up the in-house chain and never called police or CPS is a crock. If these accusations are accurate, he's complicit in the rape of children. Same goes for anyone else who knew and didn't do the right thing.

[Bostic Hog]

I'm very surprised that Paterno isn't included in the criminal charges, and I suspect he might be down the road. Pennsylvania (like every state) has mandatory reporting laws. Basically anyone who becomes aware of child abuse or neglect is legally obligated to report to the appropriate authorities (police or child protective services). As a pediatrician, I've gotten training on these laws in every state I've worked. If I learn of child abuse and don't report it, I lose my license and can be charged with a crime. All school employees are also included as "mandatory reporters." I've called police or CPS a bunch of times related to my patients. Its not fun, but its not difficult, and its something you simply have to do.

Paterno getting off the hook, either legally or morally, just because he passed it up the in-house chain and never called police or CPS is a crock. If these accusations are accurate, he's complicit in the rape of children. Same goes for anyone else who knew and didn't do the right thing.

Well, here's the problem. The reporting requirement is only valid for employees of the organization. In 1998, 2 outside agencies were given report of the allegations. Sandusky resigned in 1999 -- every other allegation was after 1999, meaning he was no longer an employee of PSU. He did these alleged crimes while working for the Second Mile Foundation, not PSU.

[bcl05]

Well, here's the problem. The reporting requirement is only valid for employees of the organization. In 1998, 2 outside agencies were given report of the allegations. Sandusky resigned in 1999 -- every other allegation was after 1999, meaning he was no longer an employee of PSU. He did these alleged crimes while working for the Second Mile Foundation, not PSU.

I don't think so. The obligation to report doesn't have anything to do with the employer or location of the abuser. The purpose of the laws is to protect children and to get the abused kids out of a dangerous situation. If I (as a pediatrician) see a child I suspect of being abused, it doesn't matter where the parents (or other abuser) works - it just matters that a kids in danger. There may have been some in-house rules for PSU employees, but that doesn't alter one's obligation to protect the kids involved.

[Bostic Hog]

I know that everyone immediately wants to pass judgement; I ask that everyone remember there is a difference between a "moral requirement" and a "legal requirement". I am in no way condoning what has allegedley happened in State College. It seems alot of folks want to hang JoePa. Everyone is clearly able to make their own judgements about this set of incidents and if JoePa (and others) performed their "moral requirement" or just failed in the legal facets. The PA AG will be having a presser this afternoon to answer some of the outstanding questions.

FYI: Curley and Schultz has both resigned.

From ESPN:
"Unfortunately," Scott Paterno said, "once that happened, there was really nothing more Joe felt he could do because he did not witness the event. You can't call the police and say, 'Somebody tells me they saw somebody else do something.' That's hearsay. Police don't take reports in that manner. Frankly, from the way he understood the process, he passed the information on to the appropriate university official and they said they were taking care of it. That's really all he could do."


The attorney general also discussed a 1998 police report involving Sandusky and inappropriate behavior with children. No charges were brought. Sandusky retired the next year to devote his time to The Second Mile, a charity he founded to help children. Sandusky also raised many foster children.


The two events were unrelated, Scott Paterno said, because his father knew nothing about the police report. A recent request to read it was denied by the university. Sandusky retired with great fanfare.


"Does anybody really think," Scott Paterno said, "that if (the university) thought he was a child rapist, they would have given him a farewell tour?"


Nevertheless, hindsight has left Joe Paterno and his wife Sue in anguish.


"Sue and I have devoted our lives to helping young people reach their potential," Joe Paterno said in his statement. "The fact that someone we thought we knew might have harmed young people to this extent is deeply troubling. If this is true we were all fooled, along with scores of professionals trained in such things, and we grieve for the victims and their families. They are in our prayers."

http://espn.go.com/college-football/...ere-all-fooled

[Thiebear]

Try as you might to protect your school.
This abomination of neglect needs to be pointed out and everyone involved fired!

Supporting the children is their only job and they failed miserably.
Football is just a nice after affect for entertainment

Did you post that You can't call the police because an employee told me that a 10yr old child was raped in my showers?
Seems like that is the first thing that should have happened IMMEDIATELY, followed up by everyone "in charge" being at the facility within the hour.


Bostic: Penn State disagrees with your statement :

I know that everyone immediately wants to pass judgement; I ask that everyone remember there is a difference between a "moral requirement" and a "legal requirement".

and i quote from the website:
Our motto, Leges sine moribus vanae, translates to "Laws without morals are useless."

[FanboyOf91]

-----------------

[Bang]

Wondering if someone will do a Bang Style rant on coaches and atheletic directers.


Terrible story by the way. Sad to see yet another case of people covering up for **** like this.
(Also makes you wonder just how prevalent this kind of thing really is)

Not from me, my friend.
I rant for fun,, nothing funny here.
This is terrible.. I'm a PSU fan, and it rips my heart out.
There's no way I can ever watch my team play again without this coming into my mind.
IMO, the entire program is smeared.. it's unfortunate that JoPa will have this hanging over his end, but it can't be ignored. If Sandusky had been arrested as soon as the truth got out, I could respect that, but there's absolutely no way I can ignore that the school tried to cover it, all the way to the point of him continuing to work with developmentally disabled children. Paterno did the right thing in itially, but when the law didn't show up, he should have pressed the issue.
It smears the entire program, irrevocably.

There is not a punishment bad enough for Sandusky, and as unfortunate as it is, JoPa deserves the shame.

The lesson I learn: Never "respect" anyone you've never actually met. Joe Paterno, you're killin' me here.

~Bang

[bcl05]

OK - I've read Pennsylvania's statute about mandatory reporting (if curious - http://www.pacode.com/secure/data/04...42/s42.42.html), and it seems that Paterno may be able to skirt around "legal" responsiblity here. The PA code says that reporting is mandatory for any suspected abuse involving a "child coming before them in their professional or official capacity." Since Paterno didn't have a professional relationship with these kids (presumably), he probably gets off without criminal charges. For what its worth, I'm familiar with the mandatory reporting laws in multiple states (from work/training as a pediatrician) and PA's are the most limited and narrowest-scope ones I've seen. He wouldn't get away with this in some other states.

Regardless, if these stories are true, Paterno knew about a child rapist and did nothing. He continued to enable this monster. Even if he doesn't go to jail, I hope he (and everyone else involved) is tormented by guilt for the rest of his sorry days.

[Elessar78]

Again, as I said in the CFB thread . . . I don't believe Paterno knowingly ignored nor sanctioned Sandusky's use and involvement with the university beyond 2002(?). The satellite campuses are pretty spread out and are essentially their own entities. I'm not sure if Joe could keep track of everything Sandusky did and went. I think you take the body of work the Paterno has done and it's not characteristic of him as a person. I do think he exercised poor judgment, but I also don't agree that he needed to lead the witch hunt so to speak.

To that point, my wife has her Masters in Adolescent Sex Offender treatment. We live and work in the state of Pennsylvania. In her career she has seen many innocent people railroaded by the system because of the excessive zeal with which prosecutors go after child sex abuse cases. Some years she has spent as many as 100 days in court with various clients/patients. I'm not saying that Sandusky is innocent, nor be treated as a sympathetic figure. BUT lives and reputations are so easily ruined by these witch hunts and once someone is accused of this-you can't unring the bell. Acquitted or not, the label sticks. I say this because the measured response isn't always "harboring a criminal". Additionally, investigations take time. Victims do not always come forward easily. So when you say that officials move too slowly, but that's in the nature of cases like these.

Again, I don't know why they still let him be "associated" with PSU after 2002. I think it's super-negligent, can it be laid at the feet of Paterno? Yeah. I'm not sure how he could escape being noticed in the facilities even if it was only Paterno and McQueary that knew of the incident.

To me, Paterno was above board up until 2002. Beyond that I need more info as to how Sandusky was allowed to be involved with the University still.
I do think he is done. Despite, my belief that he has done nothing wrong and probably in good moral standing (benefit of the doubt, you're entitled to your opinion if you disagree) but I don't see him keeping his job after this.

[Goingforburgundy]

Joe will be fired for this. If he had knowledge of it he is gone. He wont go to jail but the next worst thing.

[Lombardi's_kid_brother]

I think the Penn State Board of Trustees has made a decision that everyone can be sacrificed in this mess - except Paterno. His name and legacy are far far far too valuable to them. So, don't be surprised when the university president resigns....and somehow Paterno survives. It's not many coaches who are worth literally billions of dollars to their institution, but Paterno is that.

---------- Post added November-7th-2011 at 09:38 AM ----------

Joe will be fired for this. If he had knowledge of it he is gone. He wont go to jail but the next worst thing.

I don't think he will be "fired." Like I said, I see the university administration and entire athletic department being sacrificed before Paterno goes. But I could see him "retiring" at the end of the year.

It's an obvious analogy, but the Catholic Church has done all it can do to insulate John Paul II from the sex scandals. Any number of church officials could go down as long as he remained untouched. This is the same situation - except Paterno has more clout at PSU than the Pope does in the Catholic Church.

[Goingforburgundy]

The David Stern forced "retirement" of MJ?

[Elessar78]

The crazy thing is that there is a missing District Attorney in Centre County (where PSU is located). He was involved in investigating a prior Sandusky allegations. Now one thing doesn't relate to the other, DA's investigate a lot of crime. But he disappeared several years back and this year he was pronounced legally deceased. It would blow my mind if this was related to that.

Found this: http://www.centredaily.com/2011/11/0...-conflict.html

[Lombardi's_kid_brother]

The David Stern forced "retirement" of MJ?

More like a sudden health problem.

The most powerful person in State College right now is probably Sue Paterno.