The Nats Thread (old thread link inside, too many load issues)

[skinfan2k]

skinsgirl there is a good possibility that games are at 4pm in DC because if oakland hosts a game on the same day. Our game would be at 4 and their game at 7

[AsiaticSkinsFan]

I never said I think Gio should win. I think Dickey should win, I'm just saying that may be a factor in voting. Dickey has had no pressure for two months basically. Gio has been gaining crucial victories with his stellar starts.

And J-Zimm had a nice season but he was the third best pitcher on the roster. Gio was lights out and Stras was K-ing 11 per 9 innings before being shut down. I'd say you could've made that argument during his hot streak and I myself did but he cooled off a bit.

The way I see it, each pitcher had a brutal month this season, so I dont use JZimm's fall off point against him.

Zimm had the staff's lowest WHIP, second lowest in ERA, and second highest in K/BB. He also had the most quality starts, and his WAR is only .1 behind Gio.

You can make an argument for all 3, and I wont begrudge you, but my point is more that Gio shouldnt win the Cy Young this year, which me and you agree on.

[skinsgirl26]

skinsgirl there is a good possibility that games are at 4pm in DC because if oakland hosts a game on the same day. Our game would be at 4 and their game at 7

First of all, thank y''all so much for giving me as much info as you can, I really appreciate it I love this thread.

And that, I did not know...though I guess I should have thought about that. Damnit, I just want to go to a playoff game.

And I've got class from 2:30 - 3:45 today...ughhhhh

[stevemcqueen1]

but why? nearly every important metric, except wins and Ks, Kershaw beats Gio? Kershaw beats most NL pitchers this year.

If Kershaw had 20 wins himself, this wouldnt even be a converstaion

Gio beats Kershaw in K/9, HR/9, FIP, and WAR. Kershaw has him on innings, BB/9, ERA, and xFIP. It's close between them statistically. That's when I go to the context of their team success. Gio put up dominant numbers as one of the top players on the best team in baseball and paced the majors in wins all year pretty much. There is pressure in that and Gio delivered at a high level.

Also, I meant to say that for a pitcher to win a Cy Young when he's not winning a lot of games, two things need to happen:

1.) He needs to put up unquestionably superior numbers in the major individual statistics.
2.) The rest of the field needs to be a bit lackluster.

That's how it came together for King Felix. I don't think you can say the same happened for Kershaw this season.

[AsiaticSkinsFan]

Gio beats Kershaw in K/9, HR/9, FIP, and WAR.

Gio beats him by .1 there.

Kershaw has a better K/BB ratio, BB/9 ratio, and idk where your WAR numbers are from but Kershaw beats Gio by nearly a full point. Kershaw also has the better ERA. Kershaw has been the better pitcher. He hasnt been King Felix 2010 good, but he has been better than Gio this year with the exception of wins.

That's when I go to the context of their team success.

in an individual sport like baseball, I cant ride with this at all.

Gio put up dominant numbers as one of the top players on the best team in baseball and paced the majors in wins all year pretty much. There is pressure in that and Gio delivered at a high level.

Gio's numbers are NOT dominant. ON top of that, why doesnt Kershaw have pressure? He played on a team that fell apart around him and still put up great numbers and the Dodgers were still in playoff contention up until last night. Because Gio has a better team and better bullpen (and the Dodgers bullpen has been a shambles this season) that means more pressure on him? I would think the opposite.

[GMUSkinsFan]

skinsgirl there is a good possibility that games are at 4pm in DC because if oakland hosts a game on the same day. Our game would be at 4 and their game at 7

4pm game on a weekday? I doubt it. Maybe 5pm or 6pm but definitely not 4pm.

Also, I don't think we would play the same day as the A's. ALDS and NLDS series usually alternate days. so the A's would play the same day as the other ALDS series.

[Sticksboi05]

Gio beats him by .1 there.

Kershaw has a better K/BB ratio, BB/9 ratio, and idk where your WAR numbers are from but Kershaw beats Gio by nearly a full point. Kershaw also has the better ERA. Kershaw has been the better pitcher. He hasnt been King Felix 2010 good, but he has been better than Gio this year with the exception of wins.


in an individual sport like baseball, I cant ride with this at all.


Gio's numbers are NOT dominant. ON top of that, why doesnt Kershaw have pressure? He played on a team that fell apart around him and still put up great numbers and the Dodgers were still in playoff contention up until last night. Because Gio has a better team and better bullpen (and the Dodgers bullpen has been a shambles this season) that means more pressure on him? I would think the opposite.

What exactly is your idea of dominant?

Gio led all of baseball in opponent batting average, opponent slugging and opponent OPS. He gave up a measly 9 home runs this season. For comparison, Jared Weaver gave up 20, Kershaw gave up 16, Verlander 19, Dickey 24. That's a huge differential.

The only thing really against Gio is the walks, other than that he's been dominant.

[stevemcqueen1]

Gio beats him by .1 there.

Kershaw has a better K/BB ratio, BB/9 ratio, and idk where your WAR numbers are from but Kershaw beats Gio by nearly a full point. Kershaw also has the better ERA. Kershaw has been the better pitcher. He hasnt been King Felix 2010 good, but he has been better than Gio this year with the exception of wins.

My numbers are from fangraphs. I prefer their calculation of WAR. It's more fielding independent.

Kershaw isn't just behind Gio in wins. He's also behind in WAR, FIP, K/9 and gave up more homers.

in an individual sport like baseball, I cant ride with this at all.

Baseball is not an individual sport. It's a team sport.

Gio's numbers are NOT dominant. ON top of that, why doesnt Kershaw have pressure? He played on a team that fell apart around him and still put up great numbers and the Dodgers were still in playoff contention up until last night. Because Gio has a better team and better bullpen (and the Dodgers bullpen has been a shambles this season) that means more pressure on him? I would think the opposite.

Come on. The Dodgers have been collapsing for weeks and that's a different situation from what Gio faced. Gio is the ace on (probably) the best team in baseball. That's a singular position.

[just654]

Teddy Wins!!! Teddy Wins!!!

[Sticksboi05]

Teddy finally wins!!!!

[stevemcqueen1]

The only thing really against Gio is the walks, other than that he's been dominant.

I agree. The walks and having about 19 less IP are the only real mark against him, and it's why I think this will be such a tight race. Otherwise he's got a really good resume for a Cy Young and would probably win it with a lower walk rate and 220 IP or so. Pat of that IP isn't his fault. Davy pulls his pitchers when they could often go for longer and his last start was scratched. That's an instance where playing for a good team depresses your stats.

[MattFancy]

Congrats to Teddy!!

[Ellis]

wow, teddy finally won!

[renaissance]

http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/...-race/?hpid=z2

He was definitely due. I figured he'd step up for the first home playoff game, but what a great treat for all those who went to the park today

---------- Post added October-3rd-2012 at 02:43 PM ----------

http://deadspin.com/5948669/93-years...nationals-park

[Alvin_Walton40]

wow, teddy finally won!

Damn actually a little pissed I missed it...