cnn: Teacher who was fired after fertility treatments sues diocese

[twa]

since when is a hospital's mission to deny food or water or to end life?

going to a restaurant to be poisoned would seem illogical

we are getting way OT, but here are the exceptions and level of care mandated
http://www.spokesman.com/stories/201...support-issue/
Under traditional Catholic teachings, patients may refuse medical interventions when anticipated burdens outweigh potential benefits.

Do you find the notion of a Joes Animal Rescue and Meat packing plant being funded by PETA to be inconsistent?

[Fight4RGIII]

It would be nice if logic could trump all but it clearly doesn't. And this case is just another example of that.

[Larry]

since when is a hospital's mission to deny food or water or to end life?

. . . to people who have stated, in writing, in advance, that that's what they want?

Do you find the notion of a Joes Animal Rescue and Meat packing plant being funded by PETA to be inconsistent?

"Funded by"? You mean, Catholic Hospitals don't change their patients?

And here I thought that the customers paid. In fact, I always thought that the places made a profit.

[Destino]

Catholics should treat women quite a bit better if they ever expect to be taken seriously.

taken seriously by who? You?

---------- Post added April-29th-2012 at 12:44 PM ----------

since when is a hospital's mission to deny food or water or to end life?

A simple injection to mercifully end a life with dignity would be a better option. Sadly those defending life have forced unnecessary suffering.

[Larry]

Catholics should treat women quite a bit better if they ever expect to be taken seriously.

Just a generic response to more than one person expressing an idea . . . .

I don't see anything in this article that says they would have treated a man any differently.

Many people may have many problems with the Catholic Church's various positions (insert off-color reference here) involving women. But I don;t see anything that says that this particular one is gender based.

[Destino]

It would be nice if logic could trump all but it clearly doesn't. And this case is just another example of that.

Logic based on what? Individual benefit or long term human dignity and value of life? The catholic church opposes anything and everything that moves human life towards becoming a commodity. Manufacturing humans (when many are available for adoption) is not something they will support. Especially when the process of doing so destroys many lives (in their view) in the process.

[alexey]

Dogmatism is a great way to make good people do bad things.

People ought to reconsider taking their morals from human organizations.

---------- Post added April-29th-2012 at 01:01 PM ----------

Logic based on what? Individual benefit or long term human dignity and value of life? The catholic church opposes anything and everything that they think could possibly move human life towards becoming a commodity. Manufacturing humans (when many are available for adoption) is not something they will support. Especially when the process of doing so destroys many lives (in their view) in the process.

Fixed that for you. It is what they think and not what is actually the case.

Let's not use a concern that is common to all humans to justify immoral behavior of the Catholic Church.

[Larry]

Logic based on what? Individual benefit or long term human dignity and value of life? The catholic church opposes anything and everything that moves human life towards becoming a commodity. Manufacturing humans (when many are available for adoption) is not something they will support. Especially when the process of doing so destroys many lives (in their view) in the process.

Just pointing out that In Vitro Fertilization and destruction of fertilized eggs are not the same thing, but are two separate acts.

Many people, when changing the anti-freeze in their car, dump the old anti-freeze down their curbside storm drain. (Many of which simply carry whatever is dumped into them, to the nearest creek.)

This does not, however, mean that we should oppose changing of anti-freeze, because some people pollute when they do it.

----------

And, as to your "moves life towards a commodity" and "when many are available for adoption", I'll refer you to my post to twa, concerning the church's position on Viagra.

If this thread had been about a Catholic School firing a man, because they found out that he was using Viagra (for the purpose of conceiving a child, with his wife), would people be as enthusiastically defending the decision?

(I know that my position would be the same: I wouldn't agree with their decision, but I would defend their right, as a church, to make it.)

[Destino]

Fixed that for you. It is what they think and not what is actually the case.

Let's not use a concern that is common to all humans to justify immoral behavior of the Catholic Church.

have you even considered their position seriously and looked into the reasoning behind it? You discount it without showing that your reasoning is anything greater than superficial and self serving.

Personally I'm undecided for now. There is a lot to consider here.

[Thiebear]

So your saying the Catholic Church treats women as equals? Really? (for those quoting me in mock outrage)

How many:
Priests: 400,000+
Bishops: 5000
Cardinals: 180
Popes: 1

how many are women?
http://www.womenpriests.org/called/past.asp

Gaylord, Mich.BISHOP PATRICK COONEY
Last summer, he let the Rev. Gerald Shirilla serve as pastor of a church with a school, although he knew that the priest had been forced out of the Detroit Archdiocese in 1993 by abuse allegations that dated back decades. After the Detroit Free Press reported on the situation this year, Bishop Cooney said that the priest had made "some errors in judgment" but was "no threat to the well-being of our children." Two weeks later, he suspended him. Among those who have accused Father Shirilla are former professional baseball player Tom Paciorek and three of his brothers. Father Shirilla has admitted massaging boys in their underwear but said there was nothing inappropriate about it, and he denied molesting anyone.

http://www.bishop-accountability.org...ewsBishops.htm

Men get re-assigned: Women get fired.

[Destino]

Just pointing out that In Vitro Fertilization and destruction of fertilized eggs are not the same thing, but are two separate acts.

And, as to your "moves life towards a commodity" and "when many are available for adoption", I'll refer you to my post to twa, concerning the church's position on Viagra.

If this thread had been about a Catholic School firing a man, because they found out that he was using Viagra (for the purpose of conceiving a child, with his wife), would people be as enthusiastically defending the decision?

(I know that my position would be the same: I wouldn't agree with their decision, but I would defend their right, as a church, to make it.)

The possible killing of embryos is one of many reasons for thir overall position. I am unfamiliar with their position on Viagra. I don't see how it plays a role in the transformation of people into commodities.

[alexey]

have you even considered their position seriously and looked into the reasoning behind it? You discount it without showing that your reasoning is anything greater than superficial and self serving.

Personally I'm undecided for now. There is a lot to consider here.

A faith-based human organization that claims divine authority is not suited to properly handle difficult moral issues.

[Destino]

A faith-based human organization that claims divine authority is not suited to properly handle difficult moral issues.

Morality shouldn't be rewritten based on self serving short term needs. There is nothing compelling about determining what is right by what is wanted.

[Thiebear]

To answer the question on the Catholic teaching on oral sex, and in fact almost any question on sex, it is important to bear in mind these four conditions: FTFF – Free, Total, Faithful, Fruitful.

Is the sexual act in question Free, Total, Faithful, and Fruitful?

Is oral sex open to life? Can life come from oral sex? Is the Holy Spirit able to create life from oral sex?

Answer: No. Oral sex is not allowed in a Catholic marriage.

Sounds like Viagra is not allowed in Catholic marriage unless it is being used to explicitly have children correct?
I think we can prove in 97.5% of the cases that is not the case. it is being used to fix broken pipes.
Fire them all.

[Destino]

Sounds like Viagra is not allowed in Catholic marriage unless it is being used to explicitly have children correct?
I think we can prove in 97.5% of the cases that is not the case. it is being used to fix broken pipes.
Fire them all.

I disagree with the catholic position on sex within marriage. I understand their reasoning but it isn't supported biblically IMO and fails to understand the role sex plays in married life.