2013 Comprehensive NFL Draft Database

[Taylor703]

Pretty simple, Winters is only 295 some teams will shy away from him because of that. Also you have to wonder is he a OG or a RT? Winters also only really fits into the ZBS so that narrows him off of teams lists. He could rise, but everything so far is late 3rd to late 4th.

---------- Post added December-27th-2012 at 02:35 PM ----------



You really didn't just compare Sam Shield who played minimal time at DB to Lester who has been a DB since day one did you?

I didn't compare them as players, all I simply said is he struggled at the position but has had success at the NFL level. I see no reason why to create this pissing match when I'm basically agreeing with you...

[skinzwiz]

Pretty simple, Winters is only 295 some teams will shy away from him because of that. Also you have to wonder is he a OG or a RT? Winters also only really fits into the ZBS so that narrows him off of teams lists. He could rise, but everything so far is late 3rd to late 4th.

How is his pass protecting specifically? Is it comparable to an Aboushi?

[acuratl1984]

There had to be something more to Richard Sherman coming out for him to not be drafted by Harbaugh and continue to slip. Its a great story, but I always have wondered

Think during the game last week, they said he was a WR up till his senior season? So only one year of being a CB, and that Carroll recruited him to be a "shutdown" CB at USC, but he choose Stanford instead.

So one year of product only.
http://www.sports-reference.com/cfb/...sherman-1.html

[Dukes and Skins]

How is his pass protecting specifically? Is it comparable to an Aboushi?

If you go back one page you can read my full write up on Winters at NFLDM

[DaGoonie55]

I will say however, that I think that it wouldn't be too hard to upgrade our situation at safety without investing a ton of dollars, or very high draft picks. Our current players are so terrible, and with good play from the corners and front 7, I don't know that you need an all world safety.

I disagree. Know what the super bowl winning defenses from the following teams have in common?
Steelers - Polamalu
Ravens - Reed
Buccaneers - Lynch
49ers - Merton Hanks
Patriots - Harrison

There are more examples. The Bucs, 9ers, and Ravens all had superior front 7s...but the jack hammer / coverage ball hawk protecting over the top limited your ability to pass out of stout run defense. We need this. We need another prototype FS or SS. We had one, RIP, and we may not see another one in our lifetimes. They are so important.

A MONSTER at safety. Don't think we'll find it in this draft, but we need to do something.

[stevemcqueen1]

I disagree. Know what the super bowl winning defenses from the following teams have in common?
Steelers - Polamalu
Ravens - Reed
Buccaneers - Lynch
49ers - Merton Hanks
Patriots - Harrison

There are more examples. The Bucs, 9ers, and Ravens all had superior front 7s...but the jack hammer / coverage ball hawk protecting over the top limited your ability to pass out of stout run defense. We need this. We need another prototype FS or SS. We had one, RIP, and we may not see another one in our lifetimes. They are so important.

A MONSTER at safety. Don't think we'll find it in this draft, but we need to do something.

Safety is a luxury position. I'm sure I could go back through the history of SB teams and come up with examples of them having great guards and kickers to make the same argument you're making about safeties.

A safety is basically a DB who isn't fast enough to play corner. You might get 4 or 5 special ones who are the exception--in twenty years. Same as any other position.

You absolutely do not have to have a Sean Taylor to have an elite defense.

---------- Post added December-27th-2012 at 05:20 PM ----------

And in fact, spending a high first round pick on a safety has pretty much been one of the worst things you could do in the draft short of drafting a kicker in the first round.

[Alcoholic Zebra]

Safety is a luxury position. I'm sure I could go back through the history of SB teams and come up with examples of them having great guards and kickers to make the same argument you're making about safeties.

It's a valid assessment. You NEED good safety play to win it all unless your pass rush is other worldly.

2011 - Giants ran a 3 safety defense this season, plus their pass rush was clicking
2010 - Charles Woodson (although this is sort of cheating, he lined up ****ing everywhere for them)
2009 - Darren Sharper
2008 - Polamalu
2007 - Giants, they had 52 sacks that season.
2006 - Bob Sanders (got healthy in time for the playoff run)
2005 - Polamalu
2004 - Rodney Harrison
2003 - Rodney Harrison
2002 - John Lynch
2001 - Lawyer Milloy
2000 - Rod Woodson

And in fact, spending a high first round pick on a safety has pretty much been one of the worst things you could do in the draft short of drafting a kicker in the first round.

While you're going to extremes here (and I disagree with that), I do agree that you definitely don't need to spend a high first rounder on a safety. Pick 15th and on, cool.

I haven't seen a Top 10 picked safety do anything amazing besides Sean Taylor. Some of the others are Michael Huff, Laron Landry, Donte Whitner, and Roy Williams. A solid group, but arguably not even 1st round worthy.

Edit - But honestly, I feel like Meriweather in our defense plus a solid Free Safety (which we lack), plus our pass rush back and healthy could potentially be enough.

[skinzwiz]

If you go back one page you can read my full write up on Winters at NFLDM

What's the website b/c I don't see it up here.

[Samurai]

What's the website b/c I don't see it up here.

http://nfldraftmonsters.com/category...nsive-tackles/

[STBonecrusher21]

Im liking what I see out of this Ross Cockrell, CB from Duke. Nice size. Great instincts. Has 5 picks for the year (One a pick-six), and 12 PDs to go with it.

[Dukes and Skins]

I love Lache Seastrunk. That is all.

[darrelgreenie]

...I will say however, that I think that it wouldn't be too hard to upgrade our situation at safety without investing a ton of dollars, or very high draft picks. Our current players are so terrible, and with good play from the corners and front 7

I think the reality of finding a starting caliber rookie FS is harder then you realize. I think there will be starting caliber FS in the 2nd round and maybe if we're lucky we might find a FS that slips into the 3rd round that is starting caliber. But, I think its a long shot.

---------- Post added December-27th-2012 at 11:11 PM ----------

Safety is a luxury position.......A safety is basically a DB who isn't fast enough to play corner.

Sometimes S are just as fast if not faster then CBs. But using your statement above as a starting point...I would say a good Safety is typically a bigger then CB and combines that added size with being a surer tackler and capable blitzer to be a force in box against the run like a LB. They should also be able to match-up against TEs in man coverage and most importantly play deep zone coverage with range, instincts and smarts to prevent/make plays in deep coverage. Sometimes S are called upon to signal or call the defense and emerge as team leaders.

All things being equal I think its fair to say that S is a luxury position. However, if you don't have adequate Safety playing specifically assignment sound deep coverage its a game changing liability. In that case it goes from being a luxury to a necessity. By addressing the S (specifically FS) position with a higher draft pick it has the possibility of turning a liability into a position of strength.

[soljaofjesus]

If we could trade our 2nd rounder for a 3rd and 4th, I'd love to have a draft that goes like :

3rd ) Micha Hyde CB - IOWA

3rd) Andrew Jackson ILB WKU

4) Brian Winters OT - Kent State - Good ZBS . Alittle small

4) Margus Hunt - DE - SMU (Had a good bowl game but the other games were sub par. ) . Alittle small but room to bulk up. Very Tall and lengthy. RAW

5) Quenerus Smith OLB WKU- Tore his ACL and won't' be able to compete in time . Stock will fall

5) Duke Williams - S Nevada - More of a Strong Saftey than a FS .

6) Marcus Lattimore RB South Carolina - He said he will go pro and while I don't think he will be healthy enough for combine or this season, we could stash him on IR or PUP and he could be a steal...he is expected to go in rounds 5-7.

7) Joe Vellano - DT Maryland - Needs to bulk up and can be stashed on he practice squad.

7) Mychal Rivera TE - Tennesse - I'm not sure if he could be here. Walterfootball has him at a 3-4 rounder but CBS sports has him as a 7 rounder - FA .




If we couldn't trade down, I'd try to take David Amerson or Xavier Rhodes in the 2nd ( Rhodes is probably a round 1 lock) instead of Micah Hyde , and just remove Margus Hunt from the additional 4th round pick.

[Alcoholic Zebra]

One of the problems with projecting safeties for us in the draft, is that our defense and Shanahan want versatile players. They want the offense trying to figure out which safety is coming down into the box and which isn't. Tanard Jackson and Meriweather fit that. Madieu doesn't.

[STBonecrusher21]

DL for Rutgers, #95, is completely dominating against VT.