ES: Ice vs. III

[Dr. Do Itch Big]

Yep, Jenkins isn't very good. Even with Ryan he never amounted to much. Ironic though Ryan's first nfl pass ever was a long td pass to Jenkins.

[KDawg]

I still think its funny that not only is my post the first one, but it says I started it lol

You would.

[KingGibbs]

Maybe KDawg is MattFancy? Hmmmm.

[Bishop Hammer]

Vick gets a lot of Blake but I think I remember reading that White didn't really put in the time till Vick went to prison. Also, Joe Horn deserves a lot of credit for the development of Roddy White.

Vick just wasn't a good QB when he was in ATL. Whites stats dramatically improved once Vick was gone. I doubt it was because he was lazy. For that matter almost all the receivers looked better whenever Mike wasn't in the line up.

[BRAVEONAWARPATH]

Atlanta board in case you're interested.

http://boards.atlantafalcons.com/for...t-the-falcons/

[KDawg]

Atlanta board in case you're interested.

http://boards.atlantafalcons.com/for...t-the-falcons/

I really like some of the football talk on that thread.

[RandyHolt]

Good stuff there

One of these days, maybe the opposition team will be the one that needs to run the ball, to keep our offense off the field.

Seeing where our offense is ranked, maybe we are on our way to finally hearing that.

[LD0506]

I know, kinda off-topic but saw this on that Falcon board: http://profootballmock.com/?p=4810

[capt1an chaos]

^^^^^ that is some funny **** right there !!!!

[KDawg]

I know, kinda off-topic but saw this on that Falcon board: http://profootballmock.com/?p=4810

Stop stealing MattFancy's thunder.

[HailToTheRedskins14]

Just saw the Vick talk pop up here. Vick never took anything off his passes in Atlanta. That's why his receivers dropped everything. People talk about how strong an arm is, but one thing Ryan does well is know when to take something off. There's no reason to throw a dart 4 yards to a wide open guy. Ryan makes a lot of different throws, and Vick pretty much strong arms it at 90 mph (at least in Atlanta, I think he's lost some velocity nowadays). That's what makes Ryan so good, and I'm not a guy that thinks he's as good as people make him out to be. I think there are maybe 10 QB's who could be running that offense just as good if not better. Brady, Brees, Rodgers, Schaub, Manning, Manning, maybe Rivers, Stafford. And for the sake of not being a homer, I won't say one way or the other on RG3....

[MartinC]

Steve Young was a QB whose numbers reflected a huge difference in performance after being traded. The huge performance difference can only be explained by differences in his support systems. The same is true for other QBs who made moves both up and down. So, QB PLUS support system = performance. Since Ryan is a QB that formula applies to him as well..

You need to actually watch some film of Steve Young with the 49ers. When he first got there he was essentially the same QB he had been in Tampa - most of his big plays came on broken plays, he ran a lot and was inconsistent on the timing plays Montana was brilliant at. His completion percentage his first 2 years in SF was just over 50% almost exactly the same as when he was at Tampa. He threw far fewer picks though and that might be about the supporting cast and not playing from behind like he was every week in Tampa.

He was on the bench behind Montana his first few years in SF so that gave a young OC time to work with the natural ability both as an athlete and passer Young possessed. When he replaced Montana the offense he ran under that OC was an adaptation of Bill Walsh's blueprint - same route combinations but more run heavy with much more designed movement off run action to take advantage of Youngs ability to throw on the run. In his 3rd year in SF his completion percentage jumped to well over 60% and it newer dropped below this the rest of his time in SF.

The OC of course was Mike Shanahan.

IMO Steve Youngs improvement in SF was PARTLY a result of a much better supporting cast, PARTLY due to excellent coaching in developing Young as a passer and QB and PARTLY due to the maturation of Young himself. The difference in performance can be explained by other factors than just an improved supporting cast.

To change tack slightly take a look at this break down of the Atlanta passing attack versus a cover 2 concept against the Panthers. Since we leave both our inside backers on the field on literally every snap look for Atlanta to look for opportunities to isolate White on a 'backer in the same way this week as well. I hope our defensive staff have been watching film this week and have an adjustment ready for this.

http://www.nationalfootballpost.com/...s-Cover-2.html

[Oldfan]

You need to actually watch some film of Steve Young with the 49ers. When he first got there he was essentially the same QB he had been in Tampa - most of his big plays came on broken plays, he ran a lot and was inconsistent on the timing plays Montana was brilliant at. His completion percentage his first 2 years in SF was just over 50% almost exactly the same as when he was at Tampa. He threw far fewer picks though and that might be about the supporting cast and not playing from behind like he was every week in Tampa...

When I speak of supporting cast, I am thinking of everything:offense, defense, special teams and coaching.

I have heard Steve Young comment on this point. He talks about "organizational support." He used Archie Manning as an example of an excellent QB who never got the help he needed. Archie and Steve Young had similar skill-sets.

[MartinC]

When I speak of supporting cast, I am thinking of everything:offense, defense, special teams and coaching.

I don't think anyone can say with a straight face that the supporting cast as you describe it is not vital to a QBs development and success. However it still took Young to buy into what Shanny was selling and teaching - it was not until his 3rd year in that system and under Shanny that he started to become the QB we all remember. Some QBs with great talent just never get it whatever the supporting cast ...

It was more than JUST the supporting cast however defined that accounts for the change in Young in SF and in Tampa. It was a big part though I will give you that.

[Zazzaro703]

I apologize for all the gushing, by the way. I like both these guys a lot and wish them both the best... Except for Sunday and any other future Falcon/Redskin matchups. When that happens, I hope Ryan throws 8 interceptions. And fumbles. Six times. And we recover them all.

---------- Post added October-4th-2012 at 09:42 AM ----------





How did MattFancy's post wind up first?

I saw this happen in another thread yesterday and just looked past it. Something on the forums is bugged