Israel-Palestine kerfuffle

[twa]

#1 The only reason the Palestinians don't have offical boarders is because ISrael doesn't have or claim international boarders.
Jordan, Syria, Lebonon and Egypt all have offical boarders.

.

No, the reason they don't is because they turned it down when offered in hopes of more....repeatedly

perhaps when they give up the idea of exterminating the Jews a real country and peace will be negotiable

[JMS]

No, the reason they don't is because they turned it down when offered in hopes of more....repeatedly

perhaps when they give up the idea of exterminating the Jews a real country and peace will be negotiable

So the Palestinians you are saying forced ISrael to not define her boarders? The first time in the history of the middle east the Palestinians forced Israel to do anything.

No, the reason Israel doesn't declair her boarders is because her boarders are controvercial for Israeli's. Many in Israel want Israel to reclaim all the ancestrial lands which they held in biblical times. The problem is not even all Israeli's agree on how much land that is. Anyway that's why Israel has not and won't anytime soon define her boarders. Cause many folks in Israel don't think she's done growing.

[Larry]

No, the reason they don't is because they turned it down when offered in hopes of more....repeatedly

Yeah, it's terrible the way those Palestinians keep demanding more and more, and turning down offer after offer, because they want more.

[twa]

Yeah, it's terrible the way those Palestinians keep demanding more and more, and turning down offer after offer, because they want more.

Not working out too well is it

probably shouldn't have sided with the Nazis either....or listened to the siren call of the Arabs......or turned down the mandate

[visionary]

http://worldnews.nbcnews.com/_news/2...id=msnhp&pos=1

US slams Israel's decision to expand settlements

The White House and the State Department said on Friday a new Israeli settlement expansion plan was "counterproductive" and could make it harder to bring Israel and the Palestinians back to the negotiating table.

"We reiterate our longstanding opposition to settlements and East Jerusalem construction and announcements," White House spokesman Tommy Vietor said.

State Department spokeswoman Victoria Nuland reiterated this position, adding: "We're going to be evenhanded in our concern about any actions that are provocative, any actions that make it harder to get these two parties back to the table."

Israel plans to build thousands of new homes for its settlers in the occupied West Bank and East Jerusalem, an Israeli official said earlier, defying a U.N. vote that implicitly recognized Palestinian statehood there.

The official, speaking on condition of anonymity, said Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu's conservative government had authorized the construction of 3,000 housing units and ordered "preliminary zoning and planning work for thousands" more.

Palestinians had a major symbolic victory when the United Nations General Assembly voted overwhelmingly to recognize them, but the U.S. argued the new status could set back Palestinians in the path to peace. NBC's Andrea Mitchell reports.

"We believe these actions are counterproductive and make it harder to resume direct negotiations or achieve of a two state solution," Vietor said. "Direct negotiations remain our goal and we encourage all parties to take steps to make that easier to achieve."

[Predicto]

I love the idea of Netanyahu complaining that the UN recognition of the Palestinian state interferes with the negotiations and the peace process, when he has personally spent the last decade refusing to negotiate, catering to his far right wing, building ever more settlements and completely ignoring Abbas - the one man who actually wants a peaceful negotiated solution.

No one understands chutzpah better than that guy.

---------- Post added December-1st-2012 at 04:58 PM ----------

How can you take a piece from a country w/o borders that you already occupy?

Did you seriously expect Israel to not respond to them going for UN recognition instead of negotiating

oh hahahahahahahahaaaaaaaa!

Good one.

[The Bounty Hunter #21]

I've reached the point where I know that these situations will never end. Everyone wants peace and prosperity for all but both of those things tend to go against human nature. History has taught us that peace within itself is a myth and mere periods of calm is the best that we can all expect. It's extremely tough to read/watch these horrific situations unfold before our very own eyes not knowing the true solutions that can fix such problems. Intense debates occur, finger pointing, and name calling without a resolution. The day that "the people" realize that the world within itself is enslaved by ideals that only present themselves as simple band-aids over a horrendous/infected wound is the day that true change will occur. Until then, the only option that we have consists of doing the very best that we can to have a positive impact instead of amplifying what's already a colossal mess.

[visionary]

http://www.aljazeera.com/news/middle...637512632.html

Abbas returns to hero's welcome

Palestinian President Mahmud Abbas has returned to the West Bank after his successful UN bid for upgraded status.

Abbas told cheering crowds on Sunday: "Yes, now we have a state. Palestine has accomplished a historic achievement at the UN."

The crowds chanted his name and waved Palestinian flags.

Israel has also withheld this month's transfer of tax revenues to the Palestinian Authority in response to the status upgrade.

Under interim peace deals, which Israel says the Palestinians violated by unilaterally seeking an upgrade of their status, it collects about $100m a month in duties on behalf of the authority.

But, Israeli officials said, the authority owes about $200m to the Israel Electric Corporation, and that money would now be deducted from the tax transfers.

[mboyd784]

Israel = amoral, ruthless and petty.

Like a scorned woman.

[Redskins Diehard]

http://worldnews.nbcnews.com/_news/2...id=msnhp&pos=1

This is a good step in my opinion. A small step but one in the proper direction

[visionary]

http://backchannel.al-monitor.com/in...nger-relevant/

Israeli official: Agreement not to build in sensitive E1 zone ‘no longer relevant’

As Israel announced that it was withholding tax payments to the Palestinian Authority Sunday, an Israeli official told Al-Monitor that Israel considers its 2009 understanding with the Americans that it would not build in the sensitive E1 zone of East Jerusalem “no longer relevant.”

“The Palestinians want to use the peace process in order to bring about the end of the State of Israel,” Israeli Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu charged on Sunday, as the Israeli government said it was withholding some $100 million in tax funds to the Palestinian Authority. Palestinian Authority President Mahmoud Abbas returned to a hero’s welcome in Ramallah Sunday, following his successful campaign to get the United Nations to vote to grant Palestine upgraded status in the world body last week.

Angered by the United Nations vote, Israel on Friday announced that it was building 3,000 new settlement homes in East Jerusalem and the West Bank, and allowing zoning and building approval permits to go forward in the sensitive E1 zone, that if pursued would effectively divide the West Bank.

“I understand there was some agreement with the Americans in 2009 … at the start of this government’s term of office not to build in E1,” the Israeli official, speaking not for attribution, told Al-Monitor Sunday by email. “That commitment has been kept in full.”

“Now we have two new factors making it no longer a relevant understanding,” he continued. First, “new elections in a few weeks [that] will bring a new government…and [secondly, the Palestinian Authority’s] fundamental violation of all prior agreements and re-writing of the rules.”

[Thiebear]

Now that Palestine is going to be considered its own State it has more clout in the debate
A state that doesn't touch?

[JMS]

Not working out too well is it

probably shouldn't have sided with the Nazis either....or listened to the siren call of the Arabs......or turned down the mandate

I believe you would be reffering to the Grand Mufti?



He's the guy who fled Palistine in 1937 one step ahead of a british arrest warrent. and spent the next decade including WWII on the run from the allies. Durring the war It's true he lived in Italy and Germany and once famously met with Hitler to get his support for Arab rule over the British Palistinian Mandate after German troops liberated it. Only German troops never came close to even threatenning the Palistinian mandate. It was never a goal for Hittler because it was militarily insignificant compared to the Suez Canal which Hittler desparately wanted, needed, and at his peak could only ever threaten mildly when Romel's Afracan corps once was able to knock on Egypts door, briefly...


Absolutely the Mufti was a collaborator, but both sides tried to use Hittler to further their own means, and neither side was all that sucessful at it. Two examples of Zionist groups colluding with with the Nazi's to further their own means come to mind as well.. One included military collusion.

#1) The first was the Haavara Agreement. It allowed German Jewish immigrants to leave Germany for Palistine in exchange for leaving their goods in Germany. The property then would be converted into German goods for exports for what was then Palistine. This was early in Hittler's rule before he decided upon the final solution. Zionists groups in what was then called Palistine collaborated with the Nazi's to enact this agreement to further their own profit and goals of a greater Israel.

#2) The second example is much worse. The Stern Gang, a Zionist terrorist organization active in Palestine early in World War II contacted the Nazi's twice in 1941 proposing they take an active role in fighting the British on behalf and in collaboration with fthe Nazi's in exchange for allowing Jewish Immigration to Israel to continue. Members of the Stern Gang include future Israeli prime minister Yitzhak Shamir,

In January 1941, Stern attempted to make an agreement with the German Nazi authorities, offering to "actively take part in the war on Germany's side" in return for German support for Jewish immigration to Palestine and the establishment of a Jewish state. Another attempt to contact the Germans was made in late 1941,
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Avraham_Stern

The facts are though that the Nazi's army was on the other side of Egypt during WWII. Germany had few strategic interests in the Palistinian mandate during WWII. Nazi's were much more interested in killing both Jews and Arabs during that time than they were in striking deals with them. Germany essentially coveted the Suez Canal. If she could have gotten her hands on that Hittler would have gained a powerful achievement. The Palistinian mandate wasn't even an afterthought for him, nor were making deals with Arabs or Jews.

---------- Post added December-3rd-2012 at 10:43 AM ----------

US slams Israel's decision to expand settlements
http://worldnews.nbcnews.com/_news/2...id=msnhp&pos=1

I'm thinking this is the beginning of the end of talks on a two state solution.

---------- Post added December-3rd-2012 at 10:43 AM ----------

US slams Israel's decision to expand settlements
http://worldnews.nbcnews.com/_news/2...id=msnhp&pos=1

I'm thinking this is the beginning of the end of talks on a two state solution.