2013 FA Thread (Updates on OP) New: Merling, Brace, Pashos, Trueblood, EJBig, Tapp, White, Williams, MATTHEWS; Re-up: Rex, Hall, Davis, Paulsen, DY, RJax, Lich, Sundberg, Baker, Sav, Golston, Kehl, Polumbus; Paycuts: Carriker, Moss, BMeri, J. Wilson

[Skinsinparadise]

sorry about that I misunderstood where you were coming from on that!

No problem, I just want to clarify, thanks

[Skins3000]

Also, don't forget that Hall has already signed two large contracts. Granted, he was released in the first year of the Oakland deal, but I'm sure he still saw plenty of that guaranteed dough. He is also in the last year of a great deal he signed with the Redskins. The Skins took a shot on him when seemingly no one else would ... and Hall went to VT ... so you'd think that he would be fair in his demands. He genuinely seems like he wants to be here. He's also not THAT old. Yeah, he's going to be 31 ... but people think he's older because he came in to the league so young. Is this going to be his 10th season? Charles Woodson is still balling at 38 ... I don't think Hall has lost a step ... no reason to cut ties with someone who has been very good.

Stop it people, D. Hall is going to be 31 years of age, contract of 7.5 million, ranked as one of the worst cover corners by profootballfocus, not saying they are the gospel, and the team is salary cap strapped. This is a no brainer by simply cutting the guy and either draft young cheap talent or bring in a suitable free agent. This team needs to remain young and fresh.

[Skinsinparadise]

http://nfltraderumors.co/deangelo-ha...in-washington/

you might have missed that when the offseason started... Hall knows that he isnt going to get paid 8-9 mil / year now so he is openly willing to renegotiate his contract but of course we will see how much of a pay cut he is willing to take. I hope the Redskins are fair to him. As I suggested before ~3-4 million pay cut out be a nice medium in which Redskins save some room in the cap penalty year and Hall doesnt feel like he is getting screwed over. Remember this is different than restructure which only pushes the dead cap to the future.

I hope they can work something out with Hall so that we can get him to come back for a contract that will pay him average of 4-5 mil for next 3-4 years. If most of the money is guarranteeed then I think Hall might take the deal.... And I dont see Hall as a player that will get lazy cause he got paid... never came across that way to me...

I caught it at the time -- but I see a pure renegotiation and a restructuring as different in a way. That article mentions renegotiation which I like, I've seen other things that talked about restructuring which I don't like if its done the way the Redskins in the past have done. But getting beyond that, for me its simple, yeah whether its releasing him and getting market value or redoing his contract to me the upshot is I'd like it if he doesn't make 8 million a year, whether its this year or the following years either, and if it gets done that way, am on board.

I don't love Hall but like him. Nonetheless, I don't see him as one of the leagues elite corners. In the article you posted PFF ranks him 70th in the league. That IMO makes him a 3 million a year or so type of corner, not an 8 million guy, that's all. And if it doesn't all work out with the contract, yeah I do think we can pull off an upgrade or at least find a guy who matches Hall's ability while getting younger and cheaper via FA or possibly the draft.

[wit33]

Hall will be turning 30 midway through the season next year (Novemeber 19).

I hate to put so much credence in one game, but how many corners could have done what Hall did against Bryant and the Cowboys? How much was that one game worth salary wise-- 2 million, 3 million....?

[Rocky52Mc]

Wow. I appreciate the heartfelt pitch for D. Hall but you are creating your own shots at Hall and making assumptions about what I am thinking. I didn't take a single shot at D. Hall in the post you responded to, in fact I can't recall a post where i ever really focused on ripping D. Hall in all my time here, though maybe i missed one but he's not a player that generally consumes my attention. I thought it was self evident but clearly I need to elaborate as to why I'd release Hall and take my chances signing him that way as opposed to restructuring. Its pretty simple:

A. I think a guy like Keenan Lewis is better.
B. Keenen Lewis is younger
C. We likely can get Keenan Lewis or a player of his caliber cheaper at the same price or cheaper than 8 mill
D. D. Hall will be 30 and will unlikely get 8 million from anyone on the market

Conclusion: So if you want D. Hall back why pay him like he's one of the best corners in the game especially into his 30s? The fact that i don't think he is one of the elite corners in the game or deserves to be paid as much into his 30s -- doesn't mean the opposite extreme that he's terrible.

Just for kicks, I'll play along as if I killed the guy with my post when I didn't, I am curious are you suggesting you know first hand on how coaches are high on him based on you having personal conversations with them? If so, cool enough, I'll trust it. But if its based on your thoughts tied to what you think they are thinking -- you got guys who will contradict you including Chris Russell who covers the team. If i recall on Twitter LL56 said something to the effect that the team would consider releasing D. Hall but don't know who to replace him with -- which didn't sound to me like they are in love with the guy.

It doesn't have to be a wild fluctuation between love or hating a player. And I doubt its the case with the Redskins when it comes to Hall. He's a feisty player who to your point played well in the clutch in the home stretch of the season -- but the way the Redskins operate, am doubting that they love paying a player turning 30 a salary that puts him among the top at his position when he's not IMO and most others one of the top 10 corners in the league. If he were 24, I would bet it would be a different story. Just my opinion here.

I've actually talked extensively with a former DB on the team. Am I friends with him? No. Do I see him from time to time? Yea. Is all I'm saying coming from him? Absolutely not. **** Chris Russell and LaVar. Who in the hell places proper opinions to either of those guys?

Sorry for making your original post appear to be hating D.Hall, but yes I am sticking up for the guy.

Cut - I do not think so.

Restructured - far more possible.

Whoever on earth would tell you that the Redskins would not know who to replace him with is beyond me. That's not even a rumor, that's bull****. They have lists upon list of available FA, UDFA, Rookies, contract bubbles...it's not even funny. They have plenty of enough info on who they would replace him with, they just don't have the ammunition to pull a move other than acquiring a solid player via FA or draft ATM.

I'm pretty positive the Redskins are going HARD in the draft at CB and S considering it's LOADED. Probably 2-3 guys. As far as replacing Hall? I just don't see him leaving this off-season, but you never know.

[thesubmittedone]

I just want to point out that when we throw PFF rankings or DVOA out there specifically for guys on our team, especially on defense, we need to be aware that they should all have poor rankings overall. I mean, just look at Fletcher being the third worst ILB. Come on, does anyone with even an ounce of football awareness who has watched the Skins this year think that he's even remotely at that level?

The fact is, our defense was disgustingly awful and out of sync up until the bye week. Everyone suffered for it. But we saw a different defense after that and they kept getting better as the season wore on until they were holding teams who were offensively on fire the past month before meeting them (like Dallas and Seattle) totally in check. London Fletcher was a monster, and DHall was excellent as well. I bet you if we looked at our players on defense and had those rankings from the bye week on, they'd be among the upper echelon.

As Redskin fans, we should be entirely more aware of the fact that, pre-bye week, the entire defense (players and scheme) was in such disarray that everyone suffered for it. Remember when we had absolutely no pass rush or ability to stop the run in 2006? Remember how bad Sean Taylor looked? I wonder what his DVOA would've been that year. We need to remember that once our coaches got it together and some of the younger guys like Crawford stepped up, everyone else started looking and playing a lot better.

[HighOnHendrix]

They have lists upon list of available FA, UDFA, Rookies, contract bubbles...it's not even funny.

So...binders full of cornerbacks?

[MartinC]

I don't love Hall but like him. Nonetheless, I don't see him as one of the leagues elite corners. In the article you posted PFF ranks him 70th in the league. That IMO makes him a 3 million a year or so type of corner, not an 8 million guy, that's all. And if it doesn't all work out with the contract, yeah I do think we can pull off an upgrade or at least find a guy who matches Hall's ability while getting younger and cheaper via FA or possibly the draft.

Hall is not the 70th corner in the league - hes not top 15 but hes not 70th either. All of our corners suffered last year from the drop off in pass rush when Orakpo went down and the abysmal safety play especially at FS. I dont think Hall is worth $8M but he is a starting calibre corner and those are hard to find - if he will accept a restructure which involves him actually taking less money not just converting salary into bonus then he will stick around if not he we will move on.

[Chump Bailey]

I agree with you Martin in that the lack of a consistent pass rush really put a strain on our secondary.

[Skinsinparadise]

Cut - I do not think so.

on my post I suggested cut to resign, not cut and dump

Whoever on earth would tell you that the Redskins would not know who to replace him with is beyond me. That's not even a rumor, that's bull****. They have lists upon list of available FA, UDFA, Rookies, contract bubbles..

Yeah I don't take that line so literally. Of course they have the same list of free agents that we all have. The way I take the line is considering cap constraints -- releasing D. Hall per se doesn't bring a slam dunk replacement. Lets use Keenan Lewis as a hypothetical -- as people have pointed out, how do we guarantee we sign him, how do we know how the bidding process goes, whose to say we can win a bidding war for coveted players with our cap situation. Personally, as I pointed out, I'd risk it and play it out but I get those who would worry about it.

I'm pretty positive the Redskins are going HARD in the draft at CB and S considering it's LOADED. Probably 2-3 guys. As far as replacing Hall? I just don't see him leaving this off-season, but you never know.

It is a good draft for CB and S. Still its risky to leave a position completely void and assume that we get our player in the draft to replace him. What if we go safety in the 2nd, RT in the 3rd, and go CB on the 4th depending on how things play out to the draft board -- can we count on that guy who is more likely to be a project as our starting corner in 2013.

Hall is not the 70th corner in the league - hes not top 15 but hes not 70th either. All of our corners suffered last year from the drop off in pass rush when Orakpo went down and the abysmal safety play especially at FS. I dont think Hall is worth $8M but he is a starting calibre corner and those are hard to find - if he will accept a restructure which involves him actually taking less money not just converting salary into bonus then he will stick around if not he we will move on.

I agree. I didn't say he's the 70th best corner in the league, I said PFF ranked him that way. If i thought he was the 70th best corner in the league - that would make him not a starting caliber corner but a decent #3 guy -- then I wouldn't say I like him. But as to PFF, I haven't looked but I'd be surprised if that is an aberration with them (due to lack of pass rush this season) when it comes to Hall -- if i recall their rankings emphasize a lot the completion rate of Qb's throwing against the corner -- and for Hall he's generally ranked among the worst in the league in terms of that year after year. Guys like Sherman, Revis if I recall are usually around 50% or below whereas Hall if i recall is often around 75%.

But personally, I'd say he's playmaker. He's a feisty leader. And this is a team that doesn't have much of either so he serves a valuable role. In 2011, Bryant arguably ate Hall up in key drives where we lost close games, this season in particular in game 16, Hall made up for it and played him great.

I don't gush about Hall. But I'd rather have him than not. Where I come from on him is I don't see him as elite or as a first tier corner. And the kicker is he's not 25 and on the rise -- players his age tend to slip not improve. So I don't think we should pay him as a 25-27 year old elite corner which in my mind what we'd be doing if we paid him 8 million a year and ditto if we restructured it in a way, Vinny style like Clinton Portis' contract, so he ends up at 8 mill but spread out. If its a pure lets rip that contract up and start over and he ends up at 3-4 million a year I am more than on board.

[pjfootballer]

I just want to point out that when we throw PFF rankings or DVOA out there specifically for guys on our team, especially on defense, we need to be aware that they should all have poor rankings overall. I mean, just look at Fletcher being the third worst ILB. Come on, does anyone with even an ounce of football awareness who has watched the Skins this year think that he's even remotely at that level?

That's why I LOATHE advanced stats in this day and age. Great for the scouts, bad for the fans.

---------- Post added February-21st-2013 at 08:22 AM ----------

Who in the Blue Hell is Keenan Lewis?

You know your damn roll and shut your damn mouth!

(Actually I know who he is, I just wanted to put a Rock quote in here)

[Rex Tomb]

So...binders full of cornerbacks?

[DC9]

cut banks sign either hester or cribbs, I'd sign cribbs cause he plays st's an can play wr/rb in our O...

Banks is a FA. I wouldn't mind A. Wilson, but I'd prefer Lynch. The cornerback ferris wheel will be fun to watch as long as we have a seat.

[pjfootballer]

http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com...-want-peppers/ Redskins want Peppers!

Man I wish the Redskins would have gotten Peppers, my favorite player would have been playing for my favorite team. Him and Orakpo would have been beastly together.

Keep posting your Virginia Redskins and this kind of bull**** in here and you will quickly be labelled a troll. Just a word of advice to up your game in here or no one will take you seriously. Looks like you've alredy been NNT'd before you even got out of the gate. That should tell you something.

[DC9]

Not much in the way of overnight news, but enjoy your breakfast bars courtesy of rotoworld.com:

The Cowboys began informal extension discussions with the representatives for Tony Romo Wednesday.
Romo is currently scheduled to earn $11.5 million in 2013, the final year of his contract. The new deal will reportedly be for three or four years. "We have a great quarterback and he deserves to be paid," VP Stephen Jones said. "Our goal is to not let the quarterback run out of contract." Romo will turn 33 in April, but it's not necessarily a prohibitive age for a quarterback. Peyton Manning will be 37 next month, Tom Brady will be 35 in August and Drew Brees is 34.

Executive VP Stephen Jones says he "wouldn't rule [RT] Doug [Free] out."
When asked if he would approach Free about a contract restructuring, Jones said, "That's speculative." All offseason long it has been assumed that Free would be cut, and the team's official website has gone as far to call him a "sunk cost" at his $7 million salary. But on Tuesday, NFL.com's Ian Rapoport said Free's release "isn't a foregone conclusion." We feel he'd have to take a hefty pay cut to return to the cap-strapped Cowboys.

ESPN 1500 Twin Cities believes free agent RT Phil Loadholt is a "plausible candidate" for the franchise tag, but that the Vikings prefer a long-term deal.
According to beat writer Tom Pelissero, the Vikings' "fear" is that Loadholt will immediately sign the tender and lock himself in at the franchise price of $9.7 million for tackles. In other words, the Vikings want Loadholt back, but not at an elite-tackle price. Whether it's via the tag or a multi-year deal, Loadholt is expected to remain in Minnesota. Per Pelissero, the Vikings plan to meet with the reps for all their key free agents at the Combine.

Updating an earlier item, the Browns now plan to meet with free agent Josh Cribbs' agent at the Combine.
That doesn't mean the Browns will make Cribbs an offer. The consensus among the local media is that Cribbs has played his final game in a Browns uniform.

The Ravens plan to touch base with free agent CB Cary Williams' representation at the Combine.
"The ultimate goal, if possible, is for Cary is to stay a Raven," Williams' agent said. "It's tough terrain with them because of their cap situation and them having to pay their quarterback. If it doesn't work out with Baltimore, I think Cary has elevated his game and himself. ... I'm expecting him to very much be a wanted man by teams." Both the Baltimore Sun and Carroll County Times expect Williams to walk.