Sandy hook "hoax"?

[Bang]

Bang, I don't believe that the video references Christmas at all.
I would be more likely to say that Christmas is the reason people would not believe it.
As stated previously...I don't believe it...but there are some questions. That's it. Nothing more.
I have never stated the gov't was behind the whole thing.
What was the meaning of time behind 9/11 ? ...yeah, nothing.

I think you misunderstand me..I mentioned Christmas just to illustrate how monstrous the act it is.. kill kids right before christmas. It's just my descriptive.. it's not part of any theories or anything.

I get the need to ask questions. i don't mind questions.
i don't like the pre-conceived answer.

I should be clear that my fist shaking in this thread isn't towards anyone in particular here.. but in the overall theory itself. And that didn't originate here.
I know you and most everyone who's participated in this thread. I've been reading you all for a long time. I know the difference, so i hope that our little family here takes that as granted.
i don't blame or accuse anyone here of perpetuating these things. This is just a discussion on this "theory", and if anyone's said anything considered out of line, it was me up at the top. sorry, the fact folks would originate this really angers me, because above all i believe as i said before,, these conspiracy theories do not come from 'concerned citizens".. i think they are much more sinister in origin.

~Bang

[The Evil Genius]

Gun sales have skyrocketed since this incident occurred.

Clearly this was all orchestrated by gun manufacturers to boost sales.

It's was a NRA op!

Of course, now it makes perfect sense.

[China]

Here's a lovely story:

This man helped save six children, is now getting harassed for it

Gene Rosen sheltered six kids during the Sandy Hook massacre. Now he's become a target of conspiracy theorists

“I don’t know what to do,” sighed Gene Rosen. “I’m getting hang up calls, I’m getting some calls, I’m getting emails with, not direct threats, but accusations that I’m lying, that I’m a crisis actor, ‘how much am I being paid’?” Someone posted a photo of his house online. There have been phony Google+ and YouTube accounts created in his name, messages on white supremacist message boards ridiculing the “emotional Jewish guy,” and dozens of blog posts and videos “exposing” him as a fraud. One email purporting to be a business inquiry taunted: “How are all those little students doing? You know, the ones that showed up at your house after the ‘shooting’. What is the going rate for getting involved in a gov’t sponsored hoax anyway?”

“The quantity of the material is overwhelming,” he said. So much so that a friend shields him from most of it by doing daily sweeps of the web so Rosen doesn’t have to. His wife is worried for their safety. He’s logged every email and every call, and consulted with a retired state police officer, who took the complaint seriously but said police probably can’t do anything at the moment, and he plans to do the same with the FBI.

What did Rosen do to deserve this? One month ago, he found six little children and a bus driver at the end of the driveway of his home in Newtown, Connecticut. “We can’t go back to school,” one little boy told Rosen. “Our teacher is dead.” He brought them inside and gave them food and juice and toys. He called their parents. He sat with them and listened to their shocked accounts of what had happened just down the street inside Sandy Hook Elementary, close enough that Rosen heard the gunshots.

In the hours and days that followed, Rosen did a lot of media interviews. “I wanted to speak about the bravery of the children, and it kind of helped me work through this,” he told Salon in an interview. “I guess I kind of opened myself up to this.”

The “this” in question is becoming a prime target of the burgeoning Sandy Hook Truther movement, which — like its precursor that denied the veracity of the 9/11 terror attacks — alleges that the entire shooting was a hoax of some kind.

Click on the link for the full article

[Bang]

Hopefully my reason for anger is becoming clearer..

This is America. Remember that.

~Bang

[mboyd784]

Yea, that's ugly. But no less ugly than having 6YOs shoved in front of cameras for interviews mere hours after being witness to a massacre.

[Kosher Ham]

Yea, that's ugly. But no less ugly than having 6YOs shoved in front of cameras for interviews mere hours after being witness to a massacre.

Children are more likely to be honest about what they saw.

And less likely to have issues after.

Still, I agree with you. No reason to involve the kids.


J, we are good. I see your point and you see mine. We are not on opposite pages here.

[Bang]

Yea, that's ugly. But no less ugly than having 6YOs shoved in front of cameras for interviews mere hours after being witness to a massacre.

yes, it is a lot more ugly.
the motivation of the tv.. get people watching,, show the horror as fast as possible.
It isn't nice, but their motive is simple. Money. Ratings. Advertising.

What are the motivations of those who want to suddenly haul the jew out for inquisition because he has toys for the kids to play with?
What are the motives of the people who want to spy on an innocent man.. or worse.. because he looks strange to them on tv?

How are those equal to you?

~Bang

[Jumbo]

Jesus ... it amazes me the vitriol people have for others who may present a position just outside their specific worldview.

"They" (those calling out the idiocy aspect of this topic) aren't doing do what you describe. That comment is simply additional idiocy on your part. "They" are seeing dog **** (even the remote idea that "the government, immoral warts and all, would plot the killing of those kids for gun control or etc.) and calling it dog ****, plain and simple. Personally, I call THA being a good citizen. "Worldview" my ass. Jesus that was a dumbass comment.

I think the media misrepresented the events of that day and have not atoned for the misinformation that was reported.

That (flaws in media reporting) could be an intelligent related conversation to have on this story.

I do find it to be quite convenient that these details are still fuzzy, but are the driving force behind a nationwide political agenda for gun control. Do I think the government went and massacred a bunch of children over it? I sure as hell hope not. Reason would tell me no.

But you lack enough reason to simply dismiss it entirely and firmly, seconds after it goes through your head? I guess the solace to take from that is "you could be worse."

Does it make me a coward, a moron, or an idiot for considering the possibility of it? I think it makes me an American to consider that possibility. I worked on a nuclear weapon base. if you have some misconception that the government actually values human life, you forget how many nuclear weapons we have and what they can do.

On this matter, it "makes you" a moron or idiot or whatever "dumbass" type insult you'd typically use in such situation if you're one to ever use such terms (meaning if you're human)---if you give it more than that few seconds of thought. Your post certainly involved more than a few seconds of thought, and it's total content speaks for itself, as we continue. The fact the you've been on a nuclear base means zip in the conversation (I know what you THINK it means in pertinence to your views) and is another dumb remark. And I agree (as does everyone I know from ES in the thread calling "stupid" here) that "the government" (and many of its citizens) can often have an incredible disregard for human life.

It is telling to me regarding the insane hatred that even the slightest questioning of an official story can generate.

Insane hatred? Jesus, you read more "questionable" (being nice now) in your reaction than the perfectly normal (and healthy) one of being fed up with "conspiracy idiots." You can know the government has done, will do, and is doing on kinds of shady-ass and immoral **** without being an idiot. Well, some people can. It is more pure dumbassery to assume the folks calling it out in here don't know that and can still smell stupid when it's piled head high around them. Anyone who's read these people doing it in the thread, and isn't being an idiot in the matter, should know this.

Some of you act as if this country has never done anything terrible. Watching that video is not going to burn the world to the ground. If you choose to believe it, then do some more research and find out the truth for yourself.

Again (first sentence in the above section) with just a parade of stupid in this post (really, I don't remember ever associating you as a poster with so much stupid--must be an aberration). You should sit down and ask yourself how such lame thinking even gets through your cognitive filters to get typed and posted. The other sentences are pretty dumb, too, but the first one is the star.

Personally, I would like to see the police reports.


Personally, when I started typing this, ts was just to respond to seeing it quoted later in the thread and your initial comments standing out to me as "seriously?" But as I worked through it, I am left with the sense that this stands out as having more "dumb" packed into one medium size post on a topic than I've seen in awhile, and it's hard to impress me. I also note that I can tell we'd agree on a loot of things and this makes me think of the time I play your role here among my friends and their all 'wtf??" regarding me.

[skinsfan07]

Not a conspiracy theorist, but I do believe in Government manufactured tragedies. To assume that the govt doesn't lie or try to turn a profit off of tragedies is crazy. This nation was BUILT on lies and murder. Why the hell would you expect that to change now?

[mboyd784]

yes, it is a lot more ugly.
the motivation of the tv.. get people watching,, show the horror as fast as possible.
It isn't nice, but their motive is simple. Money. Ratings. Advertising.

What are the motivations of those who want to suddenly haul the jew out for inquisition because he has toys for the kids to play with?
What are the motives of the people who want to spy on an innocent man.. or worse.. because he looks strange to them on tv?

How are those equal to you?

~Bang

I see your point. Perhaps this man should have declined to appear on TV and be exploited for ratings and ad revenue. As an adult, it mustve crossed his mind and I'm sure it does now.. The children had no such consideration.

That said, being the whipping boy for right-wing gun nuts and white supremacists is a terrible outcome. i wouldn't wish it on anyone.

[SkinsWarrior81]

Can't please everyone, I suppose.

[JTC228]

I don't always give our government a ton of credit, but if they did try to manufacture a tragedy like this, I would think they would do a little better covering up their tracks to make sure that a few average joes with a computer and lots of time couldn't crack the case. Just sayin...

[Jumbo]

AConsideration is not consent, acknowledgement, or agreement. Is it bad to question stories and to find out the absolute truth, or are you content with whatever you are spoon fed by the media who obviously reported on this story without all of the facts?[
Ya... that totally justifies the FBI slaughtering everyone.

Other folks here are being real polite to you (mistakenly IMO), there's a reality-sized difference between this insulting "content being spoon fed by the media" bull**** of yours and being the kind of total dumbass (or worse) that it now becoming increasingly clear to me you are in this "area" having now read the rest of your posts.

I have worked with enough folk who "try to appear reasonable" (not the totally and regularly frothing in public type) so they don't lose their audience and fail to establish some credibility for their nonsense, when what's really going in their head is more like the claptrap that keeps surfacing in your posts. Again, there's a difference between the real bull**** that gets done and using that reality to support delusional or paranoiac or just stupid thinking. In this matter, to me, you read like one of those guys who mix reality with the other stuff.

[SkinsWarrior81]

Also, the immediate dismissal by folks without viewing the video seems a bit short sighted. I shut the video off a few minutes after I saw the "infowars.com" moniker. I don't think the government killed a bunch of kids here to enact gun control. Do I find the timing politically convenient? Yes.

Do I think calling anyone who questions the situation a ****ing moron / idiot / dumbass is warranted? No.

To each his own.

---------- Post added January-15th-2013 at 12:00 PM ----------

Other folks here are being real polite to you (mistakenly IMO), there's a reality-sized difference between this insulting "content being spoon fed by the media" bull**** of yours and being the kind of total dumbass (or worse) that it now becoming increasingly clear to me you are in this "area" having now read the rest of your posts.

I have worked with enough folk who "try to appear reasonable" (not the totally and regularly frothing in public type) so they don't lose their audience and fail to establish some credibility for their nonsense, when what's really going in their head is more like the claptrap that keeps surfacing in your posts. Again, there's a difference between the real bull**** that gets done and using that reality to support delusional or paranoiac or just stupid thinking. In this matter, to me, you read like one of those guys who mix reality with the other stuff.

Jumbo, the FBI screwed up and killed some people in Waco who didn't deserve to die. That isn't some hugely disputed thing. Whether those people inside were great people or not is irrelevant. David Koresh was a pretty creepy / terrible guy. I was unaware that lighting a building on fire was the generally acceptable way to end a stand off.

[Jumbo]

Is it American to do a five minute google search that debunks the conspiracy or is using google unAmerican?

I sometimes marvel at my resistance to make more use of such threads for culling purposes (an age-old ES tradition--and some of my fellow staff members don't help with their encouragement).

My other good quality (I am allowed two here) is I don't hold any grudges.